Questions: LCD Sony KDF-60XBR950 (1 Viewer)

[Dan]

Danny-

I fully understand your confusion. It's a complex relationship this XBR and I have. For me, it's an imperfect (but very nice) solution. Let me explain-- I'm happy that it's a nice solution but unsatisfied that it's imperfect. To be honest, I'm probably being too picky.

The misgivings come simply with my frustration that no one technology seems to have everything (in my budget anyway), therefore I had to make a choice with one. As LCD is good for gaming (no burn-in, no retooling convergence every few months etc.), I went with it. However, I am a picture snob to a certain extent, and the LCD technology has this characteristic that bothers me. For lack of a better description, it's this effervescent glimmer that's in the shield. On whites you can really see it (you can even make it out if you have an LCD computer monitor). However, this doesn't bother many people, so to be somewhat objective, other than that, things are great.

You often hear the "blacks aren't deep enough" and the "screen door" complaints, but the "screen" is solved by sitting back about 8 feet or more and the blacks have never bothered me. The Cineblack feature and pro/standard settings have solved this to my satisfaction.

The sandy effect comes while playing DVDs. I don't get it playing the XBOX or watching HD. At times it looks like there's a transparent layer of sand laid over the screen, so that there's some blur. You just have to see it. I'd recommend taking your DVD player to the store and have them hook it up to the XBR with your cables to see what the end product will look like. I'm guessing it's my feed/DVD player/DVD format (of course the fact that it's big screen, therefore bringing out imperfections that look razor sharp on a smaller TV). I made some tweaks and have been able to solve it to a certain extent. But again, I think a large part of it is simply DVD quality, as HD looks spectacular (barring that effervescence thing.)

All said, the TV is sweet. If the little things that bother me don't bother you, then it's a definite easy choice and worth paying a little bit more. I compared it to other LCDs and it spanked them all. In color gradation especially.

I've heard people say they have bad bulbs, but I've had no problem to date.

Hope that clears the confusion up-- if you have any other questions, I'm happy to help.

 

[CalvinCarr]

Dan,
Do you reccomend getting the extended warranty? I have heard there is no need since the Sony warranty should be long enough to cover anything that may happen?

 

[Danny Beck]

I wouldn't buy an extra warranty for this tv unless I had the extra money to blow. I believe that most of the bigger problems are going to show up in the first year or two. After that it's anybody's guess but I think most manufacturing related flaws will shop up in the beginning.


Thanks for the further explanation Dan. I'm not sure what it is about the LCD technology that you're talking about exactly. Do you have a good progressive DVD player hooked up with component cables? If not, I think that is a big part of your complaints with DVD viewing.

 

[Mike~Sileck]

I read somewhere that this television only displays things in 788p format...meaning that it converts everything to this. I can understand that for things under 780p, but does it do this to 1080i signals, and does it downgrade them a lot? Plmk

Mike

 

[Dan]

Calvin-

I bought an extended warranty for 5 years. I'm usually not big on extended warranties, but the few times I've purchased them they have always paid off. It was pricey ($400 on top of the set), but it gave me peace of mind with such a substantial purchase. At the worst, things are fixed, at best, you get the latest model. IMO, it's the first year that's the easy one. It all boils down to personal economics, however. Good luck!

Danny- I'm pretty sure it's the DVD player. Let me know your experience if you move forward on it.

 

[Dan]

Mike-

I'm not sure where you read that item, but in reading the documentation, (and in the specs on the Sony site) I understand this TV does display in 1080i from it's 2 component sources.

 

[David Parrish]

The XBR displays all formats in it native resolution of 1386x788. It converts all signals to this resolution.

This is the case with all fixed pixel displays.

For video scaling an image is not that big of a deal and the 788p resolution looks extremely good.

The XBR was rated #2 out of 10 in a recent Home Theater Mag.

Myself, I returned a 60" XBR. I decided to buy a CRT television and wait for the fixed pixel technologies to improve in PQ and price.

Of course, if you just want to buy a TV now and be done with it for several years, and you have to have fixed pixel, the Sony is currently the way to go.

 

[Dan]

David-

Good to see you again. So how's the new TV treating you and which one did you end up replacing the XBR with?

I wish I hadn't found that 788p thing out. All lit says it displays 1080i... I suppose it does accept that, but then "downgrades"?

Another minor thing to bug me.

 

[David Parrish]

Dan,

This will make you feel better. 788p is actually more information than 1080i. If you look at a CRT television, they support 1080i or 540p. They won't do 720p or 788p.


I bought the Toshiba 57HX93. It's not perfect, but it's just as good as the Sony XBR, just in different ways. It's a lot easier to accept $2300 for a TV with flaws than $5500 for a TV with flaws.

I know that sounds "glass half empty" but, really, it's true. No TV out right now has a perfect image. They all have some kind of artifacts, inadequacies, color problems, screen door, burn-in, etc....

Of course, the Sony has the best WOW factor of the 2 TVs... It's just so dang bright!

 

[Mary M S]

Dan, just a thought, my experience with the Sony GWI GWII60" XBR has been that they are extremely signal greedy.
I would research that DVD player you own. I run an old Panasonic DVD RP91 on mine, which mates very well.

No 'sandies' here.

Also you can take one of the stock 'pic modes' that you never use, run an VE disc on it and tweak it in. It will beat the factory preset modes, and will memory the changes on that setting unless you unplug the set from the wall, which then (I believe) returns the set to factory defaults.

 

[Dan]

David-

Thanks for the clarification. Actually, after I posted I realized the error of my comment. 788p is actually better than 1080i, as 1080i is simply equivelent to 540p.

Glad the new TV is working out for you. The XBR price still makes me woozy. And it is bright-- I usually keep it at Standard/Pro with the brightness cranked down.

Mary MS- Thanks for the feedback. I have a feeling it really is the signal. Sadly, I'm running a Sony DAVS-300--wherein the highest out is S-Video. It's a cheapie. I'm definately all about the upgrade, I just have to get approval, if you know what I mean.

 

[Dan Keefe]

here is a newb question...I didn't think pixels could burn out on LCD's. I was debating between this and Sony's 65" CRT RP TV...But I keep seeing everyone raving about the Hitachi CRT RP...is the Hitachi better than Son'ys 65 inch version?


I know a lot of questions. I am not new to the forum, but definitly trying to get a better handle on HD before i drop 2-5k on a TV

 

[David Parrish]

Dan K,

Those are some decent questions, but you'd get more responses if you started another thread. This thread deals with XBR LCD technology.

 

[Dan Keefe]

I know those questions were about the XBR technology...I was wondering how it compared to the CRT

 

[Mary M S]

I didn't think pixels could burn out on LCD's

(also DLP’s) generally not too much of an issue, but review an new LCD purchase carefully. I liked seing the actual set you are going to receive powered up at point of purchase if possible. Can save a return and also an argument about how many malfuntioning pixels are ‘acceptable’.

Partially dead are the worst, stuck on red/green/blue.
(red to my eye the most obnoxous) Have 3 Sony LCD GW’s in the family. All have a few bad pixels but none in areas which would create any problems.

I did see a Sony LCD floor model I would have never acepted which had 4 stuck-on reds clustered within about 8” promixity to each other, high left of center screen. THAT would have driven me insane.
Not checking closely but have not noticed a change in stuck/dead pixels past those factory flaws which shipped in our original units. One unit run over 2 yrs now.

Have not compared the two CRT’S you are referencing.

PS to Dan. The exciting thing is your unit sitting in your room is not tweaked to max preformance. (upgraders I think hate to run out of 'upgrade' room on a fairly new unit. You can relish steps to take it further in your future.
(and I know the approval factor, I wait till mine just purchased new car parts, ...then its my turn when budget allows

 

[Dan]

Dan-

LCD and CRT are hard to compare. CRT has benefits, LCD has others-- it's going to boil down to personal preferences for you.

I was looking at CRT from the beginning, then switched to LCD, then to DLP, found the "rainbow effect" and went back to LCD to avoid the worry of burnin, convergence, better viewing angles, etc. Personally, I like the CRT look better, but didn't want the hassle or the worry, as I do a bit of gaming and 2:35 watching. Some folks use the zoom feature to get rid of the black bars, but for me, that just defeats the purpose. Others turn down the temp on the set to avoid burnin-- but I've heard both sides of the story (mine burned anyway- mine didn't) and it was, again, something I didn't want to mess with.

David could probably give some good reasons for CRT as well.

As per the pixel question, LCDs are notorious for their dead pixels. I believe the newer models are better on it. I had 3 on my first XBR, but it was no problem when watching movies-- it was only when I was 6-12" from the screen that you could even make it out. However, I had the store I purchased it from take it back. The new TV has no fixed pixels.

Mary- I'm looking forward to some tweaking-- the only problem is, there's not a whole lot of them for hire around here.

 

[Danny Beck]

Well, i'm days away from making my final decision. I finally figured it out that DLPs will not work for me and my wife. We watched one for about 5 minutes last night at a store and both got headaches within minutes. Not good for us. At first I thought I was just imagining the headache and I said nothing about it and the DLP having issues with this. She suddenly turns to me and says "i'm getting this pain behind my eye!". That was that.


So, we have narrowed it down to the 50" GW III or the 60" XBR950. It's such a tough call and i'm thinking that I have to have the XBR because it is just so damn beautiful. However, when it's all said and done there is gonna be about a $2000 difference in price. I've got to decide it the XBR is worth an extra $2000.


Does anyone know if the XBR has a 2 year manufacturer warranty? I've had people tell me that about the XBRs before but i've never really confirmed it. Thanks.

Tiger

 

[CalvinCarr]

Limited Warranty - LCD TV;
SONY ELECTRONICS INC. ('SONY") warrants this Product (including any accessories) against defect in material or workmanship, subject to any conditions set forth as follows:

1. LABOR: For a period of one (1) year from the date of purchase, if this Product is determined to be defective, SONY will repair or replace the Product, at its option, at no charge, or pay the labor charges to any SONY authorized service facility. After the warranty period, you must pay for all labor charges.

2. PARTS: In addition, SONY will supply, at no charge, new or rebuilt replacements in exchange for defective parts for a period of one (1) year. After the warranty period, you must pay for all parts costs.

3. ACCESSORIES: Parts and labor for all accessories are for one (1) year.

In-home diagnostic warranty service is provided during the initial ninety (90) day period for 19" (measured diagonally) or larger screen size through a SONY authorized service facility.

To obtain warranty service, you must take the Product, or deliver the Product freight prepaid, in either its original packaging or packaging affording an equal degree of protection, to any authorized SONY service facility.
This warranty does not cover customer instruction, installation, set up adjustments or signal reception problems.

This warranty does not cover cosmetic damage or damage due to acts of God, accident, misuse, abuse, negligence, commercial use, or modification of, or to any part of the Product, including the antenna. This warranty does not cover damage due to improper operation or maintenance, connection to improper voltage supply, or attempted repair by anyone other than a facility authorized by SONY to service the Product. This warranty does not cover Products sold AS IS or WITH ALL FAULTS, or consumables (such as fuses or batteries). This warranty is valid only in the United States.

Proof of purchase in the form of a bill of sale or receipted invoice which is evidence that the unit is within the warranty period must be presented to obtain warranty service.This warranty is invalid if the factory applied serial number has been altered or removed from the Product.

REPAIR OR REPLACEMENT AS PROVIDED UNDER THIS WARRANTY IS THE EXCLUSIVE REMEDY OF THE CONSUMER. SONY SHALL NOT BE LIABLE FOR ANY INCIDENTAL OR CONSEQUENTIAL DAMAGES FOR BREACH OF ANY EXPRESS OR IMPLIED WARRANTY ON THIS PRODUCT. EXCEPT TO THE EXTENT PROHIBITED BY APPLICABLE LAW, ANY IMPLIED WARRANTY OF MERCHANTABILITY OR FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE ON THIS PRODUCT IS LIMITED IN DURATION TO THE DURATION OF THIS WARRANTY.

Some states do not allow the exclusion or limitation of incidental or consequential damages, or allow limitations on how long an implied warranty lasts, so the above limitations or exclusions may not apply to you. In addition, if you enter into a service contract with the SONY Partnership within ninety (90) days of the date of sale, the limitation on how long an implied warranty lasts does not apply to you. This warranty gives you specific legal rights, and you may have other rights which vary from state to state.

For your convenience, Sony Electronics Inc. has established telephone numbers for frequently asked questions:

To locate the servicer or dealer nearest you, or for service assistance or resolution of a service problem, or for product information or operation, call:

Sony Customer Information Center 1.800.222.7669. For an accessory or part not available from your authorized dealer, call: 1.800.488.7669

 

[Danny Beck]

Thanks.


You know I have another question that is bugging me as well.

Has anyone noticed the XBR950 seems to have more problems with geometry than the standard GW IIIs? I've now seen 2 60" XBR950s and both of them had geometry problems in the exact same areas and it looks like the WE610s don't have those problems at all. Why would this be the case? You would think the XBR would always have less problems. :frowning:

 

[Dan]

What do you mean by geometry problems?