Quadruple dipping ahead/ (1 Viewer)

[MarkHastings]

Damn, I hate being so late to these kinds of threads because there's way too much to catch up on. Hopefully I'm not repeating something here...I find it rather amusing that people assume that releasing "movie only" discs is 'unethical' and assume that the studios are trying to screw the consumer over.

I'm not a business major, but from my limited knowledge, I think I can put it into perspective...

When a new format comes out, it is usually VERY expensive. It will take YEARS for prices to come down to the level where every consumer can get into the format.

In order for the format to 'take off', sales must be good. Now, if the studios immediately released SE versions of HD-DVD's, I would think the prices would be WAY over some people heads and the market for HD-DVD would be a tough struggle.

Look at LD, if they weren't so expensive to begin with, the regular consumer may have gotten into it (thus, driving prices down)...

If 'bare bones' HD-DVD's do come out initially, I'm sure the studios plan isn't "Let's put out bare bones editions first, THEN make them pay for SE's down the line (insert evil laugh)"

I think it's more to the effect of "If we want HD-DVD to take off, we need to keep the prices down so they are 'attractive' to more people than just the HT enthusiasts, so instead of screwing ourselves like LD, let's try to make the initial HD releases 'affordable'. If that means bare bones, then that's what we have to do..."

IMHO!

 

[Glenn Overholt]

Paul - sorry. Something must have come out wrong. The only thing (I think) that will come out on HD are the yet-to-be-released and everything that has been put out on SD. If it isn't out now (with exceptions), the odds are we'll never see it.

This time though, they'll stretch it out a little more. They could make up a twenty-year release schedule, just to keep a steady stream of money flowing.

Mark, I have to ask - if they had one million in costs to 'pay back' would it make sense to price the first 1,000 players out on the shelves at $1,000 each, or to put out 10,000 players at $100. each?

Glenn

 

[Ravi K]

The difference between DVD and the HD formats is that consumers now have a taste for special features. Nobody outside the LD community knew about them back then. I'm still betting that the studios will release barebones HD versions on the estimation that we'll all be glad just to have HD versions of movies, later breaking out the SEs. Like Mark said, they don't want to rush out the SEs and charge more because lesses units might be sold. And they can't just charge less, or they might set a low price precedent, which they don't want

 

[MarkHastings]

Everything would be dependant on what they could sell a single player for. I doubt it would be possible to sell one HD player for $100 and make a profit.

 

[DaViD Boulet]

True, but D-VHS was a linear-format that involved rewinding/fast-fowarding which made special features akward to impliment given the lack of random access and "menu" ability.

IMO, Blu-ray will need to incorporate special features if it is going to take hold and gain momentum in a DVD-saturated world.

I'm sure there will never be a shortage of marketing ploys to get people to double-dip, but I think that most studios will give us Blu-ray presentations really worth the invenstment right off the bat.


Important to note is that many of the studios like Blu-ray because of its expansive storage capability. Sounds like they have plans for more than just a 2.5 hour movie to make use of it.

 

[AnthonyL]

Which studio does the most dipping?(double/Quadruple/etc,.)Fox?

 

[DaViD Boulet]

Just how many versions of MIB are there???

 

[Paul.S]

LOL. Yeah I think David B. called it out: even if you discount SuperBits since they are arguably a different product line, I think SPHE would take first place in that dubious derby.

-p

 

[FrancisP]

I feel comfortable in saying that most of the movies on TCM have few issues because the studios had the power. Once the movies were made, they belonged to the studio. Only in the 50s with stars such as John Wayne setting up their own production companies did the power begin to shift. The only real question is who owns the films now since some classics
have gone through numerous changes.

The studios have neglected these films for economic reasons.
They believe that either these films will not make a profit or not enough of a profit to bother with. These are multi-billion dollar companies so a million or two profit is nothing whereas a smaller company like Image, that's well worth the investment. The studios are unhappy about a 9% sales growth. That is why they are trying to push hi-def on us. I think you will see pretty much the same movies all over again.

As for HD dvds, will they be able to compete with $100 or less SDvd players? If the transition does take place, I think it will take a decade.

 

[MarkHastings]

Yeah, the DVD market (to most consumers) is still too fresh to adopt anything new. Only us here are willing to upgrade to new equipment every few years. Most consumers hang onto their stuff for YEARS.

I'm sure you'd hear a lot of "HD-DVD players? No thanks...I just bought a regular DVD player!"

 

[Paul.S]

Of course you will. And with a careful eye on price, remastering, new telecine for 1080i and supps, I eagerly look forward to buying many of them. I've said in the 'HD DVD releases in Q4 '05 thread' months ago how many of those titles I'm looking forward to purchasing in HD, regardless of which format they street on.

-p

 

[rich_d]

Agreed. I don't doubt that there are some complicated examples but I think the studios know their rights to the bulk of their inventory. On studio system material, issues of video distribution shouldn't be much of a issue. For example, music rights don't apply as the material was home grown played by studio orchestras.

Paul,

My question was around your comment that older films would "especially" benefit from going HD.

I think you are now saying that older films would benefit but not especially which I would agree with. Film going to HD had little downside with the important caveat of coming from good transfers from good source material.

Otherwise, older stuff could actually look worse as the problem just become magnified.

 

[Paul.S]

My position is consistent, even if my comments intimated my point as opposed to making it explicit: I said "some would argue" that older films epecially will benefit. What I mean by that is that some would find an 'older' film that's never been restored and has only seen release on LD benefitting more (showing greater improvement in p.q. compared to previously available home vid options) than, say, Batman Begins.

-p

 

[DaViD Boulet]

Paul, I got your meaning. I think there is a general notion sometimes folks fall into that only "hi-tech" movies will really look that much better with hi-def...and that DVD is "good enough" for old-movies. Truth is that even a 16mm B&W print will look better in 1080P than it does on DVD.

 

[Mark Lucas]

It's not double/triple/quadruple dipping if it's on a new format, and HD is a far bigger jump in quality than VHS to DVD or even LD to DVD.

 

[Paul.S]

David: Nice post. Faster, pussycat! Kill! Kill!

Mark: Amen. But having said that, I'm hoping against hope, precedent and the profit motive that the studios won't disingenuously, purposefully withold available supps only to release them later. It might be a while before there's a robust used market for hi def discs. And even then, the same niche aud will be wanting to sell the original release to get the more recent one with supps. So trading up might not be as easy as dropping by Wherehouse.com (which to this day doesn't deal in SACD and DVD-A).

-p

 

[DaViD Boulet]

Yeah...you know you want it. SAY IT! I want to hear you BEG for 1080-P. That's right...your DTS-HD DADDY is gonna make you BEG. SLAPPP!!

:p)

 

[DaViD Boulet]

I think he meant double dipping more than once on Blu-ray (like a bare bones Fifth Element Blu-ray in March...then a Blu-ray special edition 6 months later...then a Blu-ray super-bit version with better picture but no extras another six months later...)

 

[Citizen87645]

Uhhh...David...I think you're ruining the future formats for me.

 

[Carl Johnson]

If you don't like double dipping follow my lead and don't do it. It's been 7 years since I got my first DVD player and I've yet to double dip on a single title.