*** Official *** XBox 360 Software Discussion Thread (1 Viewer)

[Romier S]

I can't recommend Condemned enough. I completed the game two nights ago and I'm just loving it (I'm on a second replay now). Final game time was around 10-11 hours for me. It's horror themed first person adventure game with heavy emphasis on melee combat (i.e. you'll be using pipes, paper cutter arm, 2x4's etc.) so playing with a controller should not be a problem for you. This is not a twitch based shooter afterall. The atmosphere is relentless, and the game is probably the most frightening one I've played since Silent Hill 2. It isn't a game for everyone as it is slower paced, but if you have even a remote interest in this type of game you cannot go wrong with a buy.

I'm working on a review for it, Call of Duty 2 (which I also completed), and Kameo which I'm about halfway through. I'll post some links up for anyone interested when they are done.

 

[James_Kiang]

I am hoping to be getting a new television that will support the same resolutions that Josh mentioned (480 i/p, 1080i).

Romier, you mention setting the resolution on the 360. Is this something done for each game? Or is it a general setting done in the dashboard? Sorry for such a basic question, but I have no experience with either hdtv or XBox (will still be a while before I get my 360).

On a separate note, I notice a lot of ads that say the televisions are "HD ready". I know this means you need a digital box or whatever to display in high-def. Is the 360 basically one of these boxes for the purposes of playing games? In other words, will there be anything else I need that I am not thinking of right now in order to display a game in 1080i?

While I'm at it (though it may be OT), how does 1080i compare to 720p? Is there such a thing as 720i? (...off to check the primer, but answers here would be appreciated)

 

[Josh Lowe]

James - A lot of your questions about resolution can be answered by doing searches in the Display forum.. to sum it up - "HD ready" means the device is capable of displaying HD resolutions (720p and 1080i) but requires an external device to supply the signal - IE it has no integrated HD tuner. A 360 is such a device.

I haven't hooked my 360 up yet but if it's anything like the original Xbox, you set your preferred resolution in the dashboard. What does sound different is that Romier's saying the 360 converts all games to the desired resolution. Only certain games on the original xbox would work in 480p (and a very few were released in 1080i).

 

[RAF]

The simple answer is that 1080i and 720p should look about the same in theory, but in reality, 1080i looks a little bit better for static (still) shots and 720p looks better for action shots (like sports and fast moving video games.) Most people would think they look about the same.

A slightly more detailed answer (but still simplified for the sake of clarity here) is as follows.

720p (or 720 horizontal lines displayed in one frame in the vertical direction) is made up of 1280 horizontal pixels per horizontal line so the resolution (or number of pixels) of 720p = 720 x 1280 = 921,600 pixels per frame.
Note: Some "720p" plasmas display 1280 x 768 lines so their effective resolution is 1280 x 768 or 983,040 pixels.

1080i (or 1080 horizontal lines created from two separate fields of 540 horizontal lines that are interlaced - thus the "i" in 1080i - to produce a single frame are made up of 1920 pixels per horizontal line. So the pixel count of a 1080i frame would be 1920 x 1080 = 2,073,600 pixels per frame. However, since each frame is made up of two fields of 1920 x 540 = 1,063,800 pixel resolution the actual perceived resolution of a 1080i image is really closer to that 1,063,800 pixel figure. And even though 1,063,800 pixels is a higher resolution than the 921,600 pixels of a 720p frame (about 15.4% higher) the interlacing introduces certain artifacts in high motion pictures (like sports and video games) where the fields don't stand still while interlacing takes place. The net effect is that for relatively still shots the 1080i would look better to most people, whereas in fast action shots the 720p would look better because the 921,600 pixels would not be dependent on interlacing additional (moving) information to create the frame. The fact that the 1,063,800 pixels in each field of a 1080i interlaced frame (remember an interlaced frame is made up of two fields) are trying to produce a picture while not really quite in sync for action frames can lead to a less satisfying overall effect.

The bottom line - each has its plusses and minuses and the "1080i for stills and 720p for sports" guideline is a good summary of most people's perception of the situation.

One small footnote: That's why 1080p is such an exciting technology. In 1080p there is no interlacing and the resolution of a 1080p picture is over 2 million pixels (2K technology) - at least twice today's "HD" pictures. When I saw 1080p in action at CEDIA my jaw dropped. And the next step after that is going to be 4K technology.

It never stops. In 25 years people will be reminiscing about the 360 and the PS3 like we do today about Pong (well, not quite, but you get the picture.)

 

[Romier S]

Sure, and take no offense to this but none of it means dick if the actual gameplay doesn't evolve with all of the pretty pictures.

Developers need to be focusing on advancing NPC AI, in-game physics, storytelling ability, and creating truly unique gaming experiences both on and offline. Along with the natural forward movement that occurs in the graphics department of course. Videogames are afterall a visual medium, but far too many times the real underlying systems that make for a truly convincing game world are left by the wayside for fantastic visuals. A pretty game isn't necessarily a good game at the end of the day.

 

[Josh Lowe]

I assume that DVD content isn't being scaled and is displayed in 480i/p since the MPAA seems to hate seeing upscaled content being output over component video..

I'm still wondering.. if games are being automaticaly displayed in whatever resolution you've selected (1080i in my case) then why do the game pubishers bother putting "720p" on the packing (such as on PD0 and Gotham 3) whereas other games (such as Tiger and COD2) show 480p/720p/1080i listed. I think that generates confusion over an already confusing topic.. I like to think I know a lot more than the average person about hi def, and it confused even me.

 

[Romier S]

That's been an ongoing issue since the advent of said selections on the back of current gen Xbox games. Half of the games on the market don't have the proper selections marked off for instance. Some games, like Cold Fear on the Xbox, have 720p checked off but the games only supports up to 480p.

You are right, it's very confusing and in most cases it's best to not even bother looking.

 

[Evan M]

I have an interesting problem, and maybe ya'll can shed some light on it . I have my display set to 1080i on a Toshiba 50H81 and it is cutting off the sides of the picture. Like when playing PDZ, I can barely see my ammo status and in the garage on PGR3, it is cutting off the names of my cars.

Any ideas on what the problem is?

 

[RAF]

No offense taken, Romier. In fact I'm in total agreement. As I mentioned in another thread in the Video Hardware section it looks like Nintendo's new "box" will not support HD at this point. However, I'm willing to bet that the games on that platform will end up being a lot more fun in many cases than their HD rivals'. Beauty is only skin deep.

 

[PerryD]

Sounds like regular old overscan. You'll need to get into the service menu to fix this. Look it up to be sure, but on my Toshiba, I think you hold mute on the remote, then press menu on the TV. There will be settings for HSIZ and VSIZ that can be adjusted to reduce the overscan.

 

[Evan M]

Cool. I'll have to try that... I've always been nervous about accessing the service menu, so never bothered to fool with it. I do have an extended warranty from Best Buy ... maybe I can get them to come fix it.

Thanks for the tip

 

[James_Kiang]

Thanks for the info on the various resolutions that are out there. I actually have a 27" HDTV on its way to me so I'm pretty excited to see the difference. It only supports 480p and 1080i (for HD) but from what you all have said that should be plenty. Sadly, it will still be a while before I can get a 360 to check that out.

To keep this software related, Romier put up some screenies of DOA4 at his site recently. Man, that game looks extremely nice. I haven't seen any gameplay but hopefully it is nice and smooth. If that game had made launch it might have been enough to have gotten me to buy right away. Too bad DOA4 keeps getting delayed as I'm sure many of you will be getting it. One nice thing about waiting is that that game and perhaps even Oblivion will be available, which are both more my type of game than anything out right now.

One last OT question: Can I get the HD quality picture using only s-video connections? Or do I have to go to component?

 

[Romier S]

No, you would have to go component in that scenario James.

 

[Josh Lowe]

Having spent some significant time in PGR3 both single player and online, I'm about 80% satisfied with it. The graphics and sound are phenomenal. The integration of iPod support at the OS level is slick, I can simply override the PGR soundtrack with my own without having to even bother digging through the game's settings. The driving mechanics of the game are the best yet of the series, though it's still more arcadey feeling than GT4 or Forza. But that's what I expected since the kudos system is built around arcadey style driving.

The actual matches on Live have been a blast. I've had moments of wincing and bracing for impact before a crash. In one particular race I got clipped while doing nearly 200mph and slid sideways for a -long- time, staring at the crowd whipping by until I finally hit a solid object. It felt more realistic than any other racing game I've played.

But the game is obviously not a finished product. You can tell it was cut short in order to make launch. They're short a lot of cars, mostly more pedestrian cars.. the exotics are mostly all there. But I would have liked to have driven an S2000, or an EVO 8, or any number of regular guy cars that were in the past Gotham games as well as the exotic and super exotic stuff.

The lack of any cars licensed from BMW or Porsche is a big letdown. True, there are RUF cars but they're not a true representation of Porsche's cars. Not having the Carrera GT sucks, to put it plainly.

The number of tracks is somewhat lacking. I was happy to see the Nurburgring F1 circuit is now there in addition to the full Nordschliefe circuit.

The real beef I have with the game is the lobby system. It's all random. I can't find a way for a friend and I to meet up in the same race. I can't create a race and specify things like "We will race on X track and use only Y model of car" like you could in PGR2. That sucks, to put it plainly. I mentioned this to a friend who's been on the fence about purchasing a 360 and it seems to have completely turned him off on the idea. I agree, it definitely lacks. And I think it all goes back to the game having been rushed to market. I would say PGR3 is a closer relative to the original PGR than it is to PGR2, if that makes sense. If you look at graphical improvements, PGR->PGR2->PGR3 is a very obvious and logical progression. But when it comes to features, PGR3 is definitely a step backward, and that really hurts the overall quality of the game. I would still recommend it and it's my favorite launch title, but it's definitely not up to the standard that was set with PGR2. Hopefully PGR4 not to mention the inevitable Forza 2 will step things up.

 

[BrianB]

No, they dropped the "slower" cars a while back. Not something they did to get ready for launch, it was a fundamental design decision for the sequel.

 

[Clinton McClure]

I picked up my first three 360 titles this afternoon after work: Call of Duty 2, PGR3 and Condemned. Now all I have to do is locate a 360 and I'm all set.

 

[RAF]

Excellent titles, Clinton. You'll love them once you locate a box.

 

[BobbyPerry]

quick impressions

Call of Duty=excellent
condemned=excellent
madden=good gameplay, bad options
nba2k6=good, not overly impressive
pgr3=gorgeous
tony hawk=dont bother

 

[LarryDavenport]

EB Games have said they will swap titles from bundles for other titles.

I am keeping Call of Duty 2, PGR3, and Perfect Dark 0 (the reason I bought the 360 in the first place). I plan on trading my extra copy of COD2 (ordered seperatly), and Kameo. WHat should I trade for?

 

[David Galindo]

Perfect Dark Zero was a total letdown. I spent a week with it before trading it in for NFS:MW...and I think I made the right decision.

Reasons I disliked PDZ:

-There is no stealth mechanic. Normally I wouldnt care in the slightest, except this game actually expects you to use stealth at some missions. You have to follow set paths along the area for stealth. It doesnt matter if your running full speed or tip toeing along, nor it doesnt matter if you duck behind some boxes, because the enemy AI is not too bright.

In the jungle mission for example, there's tons of foliage to crawl through and sneak up on people...but you cant, because guards choose to randomly see you when they want. I ran up to a guard, and still hit him in the back. After dying and restarting, I snuck towards him very slowly...and he turned around to shoot me.

Gah.

-If it wasn't for the arrows helping you along the level, you would be hopelessly lost. Now, I'm a fan of open areas where you choose your paths, but it doesn't help much where your next objective is not really clear, and there are multiple doors that are inactive or locked.

-The graphics look...not good. Im playing on a 61" HDTV, and this game just throws way too many special effects in there without really cleaning them up. One level was drenched in light beams, shiny surfaces, and shadow effects, and it looked more cluttered than impressive.

-Lack of a jump button. Now, I know your thinking...thats not a problem, with the cover feature and such. But jumping adds a whole new level to FPS. Jumping allows you to use levels in a whole different way. See those stacks of boxes in the corner of a multiplayer arena? Hop on top, wait for the right moment...and pounce on the enemy!

Without the jump button, multiplayer levels feel more like on rail shooters. You cannot hide effectively in levels except where the levels want you to hide. I've seen people use the roll technique to climb mountains, which is frankly ridiculous.

I hate the lack of a jump button. It takes PDZ back into extreme old school techniques, and I would have gladly traded in a roll button for a jump button.

-When you run out of ammo for your clip, the gun doesn't automatically reload. It keeps clicking until you let go of the trigger. Now, this would have worked great in a stealth-like shooter. But PDZ is all arcade action, and this simple reload problem makes guns feel as if they run out of clip ammo WAY too much.

-Everyone runs in slow motion in multiplayer. BUT you can put down your gun to run fast, and I liked that.

-As far as multiplayer goes, its a STEP DOWN from the N64 version! If you remember the PDZ64 game, you could create your own character...add your own head, select a multitude of bodies, and you had a unique character. In PDZero you ony have 6 or 8 choices, I dont remember how much. Everyone usually looks exactly the same in multiplayer (Joanna Dark), and thats ridiculous. At least give us a generic guard with a helmet so it wont look so incredibly dumb.