*** Official STAR TREK (2009) Discussion Thread (1 Viewer)

[Josh Steinberg]

Here's what I took away from those events as the film played out:

In the 24th century, Ambassador Spock has offered to help the Romulans save their dying star. (That's probably why the planet wasn't evacuated.) For whatever reason, the star went supernova earlier than expected, before Spock was able to stop it. Spock still used the Red Matter to end the supernova before it took out anything else, but Romulus was gone. Nero and his crew were pretty devastated by this and felt betrayed; they felt that they, their society, had trusted Spock and by extension, the Vulcans, to save them, and they failed to do so. I wasn't entirely clear on this next point, but the film seems to suggest that Nero may have felt Spock did it on purpose and deceived the Romulans about his intentions. (We know that's not true, obviously.)

Anyway, when Spock releases a small amount of Red Matter to stop the supernova from expanding any further, it created a black hole (or "singularity" as they called it in the film) which sucked Spock through. Nero had wanted to destroy Spock's ship and was following him, which explains how his ship was sucked through as well.

Nero's ship went through last but came out first. I do not believe Nero intended to travel through time. As we see from the first scene aboard his ship, he doesn't know the stardate; I think he must have assumed the black hole put him somewhere else in the universe but not somewhere else in time.

The Red Matter was onboard Spock's ship, so when Nero went through the black hole, he didn't have the weapon. He had the drill on his ship (he did explain that they had been miners), but not the Red Matter. Nero had no idea what would have happened to Spock's ship but expected that it would show up. When his ship does show up some 20 years later, for Spock it was an instant, so he had no idea that a) Nero had followed him through the black hole or that b) Nero had twenty years to be waiting for him. So as soon as he gets through the black hole into the 23rd century, Spock and his ship are captured by Nero. Nero exiles Spock to that ice planet, keeps the Red Matter, and sets off the Vulcan to do his damage.

Nero and his crew didn't want to just wait around; they came through time and didn't expect to and had no idea where or when they were when they made it through. I don't think there was a plan at that point other than "Blow up Spock's ship on sight" initially. But they had all of that time there to figure out what happened, to postulate that Spock would eventually materialize in the 23rd century, and that they could steal the Red Matter from him.

Neither Spock nor Nero intended to time travel. At least that's how I saw it.

 

[Chuck Anstey]

It wasn't Romulus' star that went supernova, just a star. I am assuming they were using current science that shows there is concern for Earth if another star goes supernova within 100's of thousands of light years. A star going supernova affects a sizable area of the galaxy, not just its own solar system. The real danger is the radiation emitted from the stars poles can travel extremely far and just about wipe out whatever is in its path. The "shock wave" took time to reach Romulus so Spock did invent something to absorb it but didn't get there in time. That might have been because of a debate or miscalculation.

 

[Josh Steinberg]

Thanks for clarifying, Chuck, that makes a little bit more sense in at least explaining why they didn't simply evacuate the planet - a supernova like that and there'd be nowhere to go, I suppose.

 

[Sean Laughter]

The prequel comic, if I'm remembering it correctly, basically made it out that the star going supernova didn't exactly do a traditional supernova, it continued to expand as it enveloped the planets of its own solar system, so it eventually was going to engulf the entire galaxy.

As I said in my original post though, I think there were some discrepancies between what happened in the comic and the story Spock actually told Kirk during the mind-meld in the film.

And I completely missed the reference to Archer's beagle - I was wondering why there was somewhat of a commotion amongst some in the audience at that line of dialog. Then again, I barely watched four episodes of Enterprise, so I suppose it's expected.

 

[Zack Gibbs]

I read the prequel comic, the background of how Spock and Nero get here is its sole story. The movie presented things with less nuance, but technically everything that happened in the prequel could still be true within the film. There were a lot of (imo, corny) TNG appearances as well. Here are the important bits, if you've seen the movie it should flesh things out well enough;

*Spock was now the Ambassador to Romulus. A follow-up to his role in TNG. In a Superman-esq beginning, Spock tries to warn of the dangers of this weird new supernova star, but the Romulans don't agree with his conclusions.

*We know that the star will destroy both Romulus AND Vulcan.

*Having seen the stars destruction first-hand, the miner Nero tries to back up Spock's claim. After being ignored the two of them join together to escape Romulus. Nero has the red-matter on his ship (he mined it) and they make for Vulcan. At this point the Romulans attack them and are saved by Captain Data and the Enterprise-E.

*When they get to Vulcan, the Vulcans also refuse to Help. Vulcan Ambassador Jean-Luc Picard intervenes.

*The Jelly-Ship was designed by Geordi LeForge.

*Spock is now sleeping with Diana Troy. (okay I made that one up.

)

*When Romulus is destroyed they go into some background about the shaved heads/tattoos the crew adorn. It's some kind of tribute to their dead blah blah blah.

*Nero's ship gets outfitted with the latest Romulan weaponry, including.. *gasp* BORG technology.

*A Klingon fleet tries to stop Nero, who's already started killing everything in sight. Worf is commanding it (were you surprised?) and Nero kills him. (oh but then they say he has a chance of making it)

*In the end Spock completes his mission, thinking it would be his last. But as Romulus has already been destroyed, only Vulcan was saved. Nero believes this to have been Spock's intentions the entire time.

 

[Patrick Sun]

Since I didn't much keep up with all the goings-on for the Star Trek film (I've gotten to the point where I'd rather save some surprises for myself while seeing the film for the first time), I was surprised to see Tyler Perry and Winona Ryder in the film (along with Rachel Nichols, who dyed her hair for the 1 minute or so of screen time at the behest of Abrams, she work on Alias's 5th season). And it wouldn't be a JJ Abrams production without Greg Grunberg (listed as the Stepdad, but I am not sure I remember him in the film), and Amanda Foreman.

 

[Chuck Anstey]

Okay that should have been in the movie somehow. I was thinking about it and it made no sense that a mining ship even 100 years from the future could wipe out the military ships of 100 years ago. Imagine the best commercial ship today outfitted with the usual military hardware available to large companies and there is no way it could wipe out the military ships of the early 20th century. Sure an aircraft carrier of today could but not a commercial vessel.

 

[mattCR]

In fact, in the film, there was a moment of dialog where Nero explained the ship as a "Normal" mining vessel from his time period. Which made me think "WTF are you mining with that thing" but since they focused on it doing the drilling, I just rolled with it.

 

[Andy Sheets]

*shrug* I always assumed it was just a shortened take on "sawbones"...

 

[Josh Steinberg]

When Young Kirk is driving the car and he gets a call on the car phone to return the car immediately, that's Grunberg's voice. I thought it sounded really familiar during the scene but couldn't place it until I saw the credits.

 

[Dale MA]

Personally I actually liked the product placement. It grounded the film in a reality, after all Star Trek isn't like Star Wars, it's set in our future. The product placement adds to that feeling IMO.

As for young Kirk stealing the car, the scene showed the transition of the character - the deviation from Shatner Kirk if you will - due to the death of Kirks fathers
which makes the character rebel, turning him into the character that we later meet in the bar. I also thought the parallels between young Kirks and young Spocks troubled childhood's was interesting.

 

[todd s]

I did enjoy the movies. And thought Urban's McCoy was spot on.

But, this is a Trek thread. And what would a Trek thread be without nitpicks. So here we go...

-Didn't like that Engineering looked like a manufacturing warehouse.

-Had no problem with Spock & Uhura. Just surprised how much open romancing they showed. Even if he wasn't Vulcan...He is her superior officer.

-Was very shocked they destroyed Vulcan. WTF?

-Nero was destraught that his wife, unborn child and Romulus was destroyed. Well your 80 so years in the past. How about using your awesome weapon ship and go back and save those on Romulus?

-Besides Spock & Pike. Are their any other officers who are not fresh from the academy? Scotty beams in and becomes head of engineering.

 

[Zack Gibbs]

I actually liked that, it made the command structure for the film actually plausible, and is a subtle twist on the old "Something terrible is happening and the Enterprise is the only one in range" conceit that was used fairly often. It also reminded my of Star Trek II, and how they were crewed almost entirely of cadets.

There did appear to be a few experienced officers. I could be wrong but I believe the doctor they mentioned as having died before McCoy takes over was the doctor from the original Pilot.

 

[Stephen Orr]

Did Sunshine have warp speed? Oh, not a fun movie...

I personally liked the interview with Nimoy who basically today the nitpickers "get over it."

 

[Patrick Sun]

Ahhhh...thanks for the reminder.

 

[Chuck Mayer]

I have to speak to the experience element. It had a direct negative impact on my viewing of the film.

My other beef (not the one in the review thread) is not the film's problem, but mine. Starfleet Academy to Captain of the Federation flagship in a few weeks is pretty unbelievable. During a conflict, it speaks to the lack of a reasonable pipeline, but I could buy that OK. Then they made it official.

As a Navy guy (submarines to boot) and an Academy nerd, this film completely ignores long-standing traditions that enable maritime success. Not in little ways like most films. In huge ways. The magic of Captain Kirk from the original show is that he was a junior officer once. He was head of a department once, serving again. He was the First Officer once. He became the Captain without losing what made him a great officer, but possessing the one element most crucial to isolated command - experience. Most skippers lose their ability to rapidly adapt and be spontaneous...servants to their experience. Kirk was special in that he combined both. The film ignores that thousands of years of tradition and understanding (learned in blood and misery, like most nautical lessons) to be quick wish fulfillment; a sheer fantasy, to end as the series began, just 15 years younger. It (as you can tell) affected my ability to buy the story.

Like I said, it's directly related to *my* experience.

My review has the rest. I mostly liked the film. A little work and it could have been a great one. But "decent" works for a reboot.

 

[Zack Gibbs]

The ending was the one thing I didn't like, well, I went along with it when I watched it-- a testament to the strength of the film. Over time though I'm sure it will bother me more and more. It's stupid for so many reasons. Kirk just graduated and now he's Captain?

And it foolishly closes the door on what would have been a perfect sequel, seeing this crew coming together aboard the Enterprise. This film introduced them all, but the ship wasn't really important here. In fact I wish they would have had the balls to not have the Enterprise in it at all. It wouldn't have changed anything.

 

[Chuck Mayer]

Alright, here is another nit.

You dumped the red matter in the big evil ship. Awesome. You stay to render aid if desired. Check. That is your responsibility and obligation. Aid is rejected. You have personally both seen what a black hole does.

Why do you stay and shoot pointless ammunition and energy at a ship that will be the size of a molecule in less than a minute? Because it would lead to an awesome, yet pointless and irrationall dangerous "we have to escape" sequence?!? Bitchin'!

I even thought to myself before they offered aid (which made some sense, again)...shouldn't you be leaving right about now? Let's not talk about how smart Kirk and Spock are...let's show it

 

[Phil Florian]

To be fair, the two times this type of black hole created by Red Matter opened up, it pulled two ships into the past. His ship was damaged badly but not destroyed. Kirk was ensuring nothing came out the other side into even a more distant past to create yet another alternate reality. Destroying it on this side was the logical solution.

 

[Chuck Mayer]

But the black hole wasn't opening on one side of the ship or the other

It was opening in the middle. Pretty basic physics. The 1701's pew-pew phasers and photon torpedoes did little damage to the ship anyway. I had assumed the plan was for the black hole to destroy the ship, since their weapons could not (as had been proven earlier numerous times). As evidenced by the need to drill into a planet for the red matter to destroy it...which was part of the plan to put the Ambassador Spock ship inside of Nero's.

Elementary, my dear Phil. So the point had to be stupid one way or the other

I chose the less stupid.