NHL 2010-11 Season Discussion Thread (1 Viewer)

[Jeff Gatie]

Scott, did Chara make contact with Pacioretty's head in the reverse angle video I linked to above? I ask you because I respect your view, and you are not prone to hysteria.

 

[Jeff Gatie]

Here it is phil, a split second before the glass and Charas hand is nowhere near his head:






How about this one, right at the point of impact and there is all red jersey surrounding his head, no black glove in sight:





Still say he hit him in the head phil?

 

[Scott Merryfield]

Originally Posted by Jeff Gatie

Scott, did Chara make contact with Pacioretty's head in the reverse angle video I linked to above? I ask you because I respect your view, and you are not prone to hysteria.

Jeff, I have a difficult time seeing whether he made contact with Pacioretty's head before he hits the stanchion from any of the videos I've seen, including yours. That doesn't mean he's innocent -- just that it's inconclusive, IMO. One caveat -- I have not seen anything slowed down frame by frame, although that may not show anything conclusive, either.


However, Chara does make a shoving motion with his arm that runs Pacioretty into the stanchion. I believe that is very apparent from the videos and photos. Based on that, and where on the ice the shove occurred, is why I think that a suspension was warranted. It was a dangerous play in a dangerous area to a vulnerable player. Over the past few years, the league has begun cracking down on checks from behind when a player is just away from the boards for this very reason. I see this as the same type of situation.

 

[Jeff Gatie]

I gave two frames above, including one at the same moment phil's "incriminating" photo was taken. His hand is no where near his head. I agree with you that he pushed him into the boards. I (and no one else) knows if he knew the stanchion was there. My guess would be he knew, and if Pacioretty walked away it becomes a highlight reel hit on Versus, like Gill's hit earlier in the year. But he didn't walk away. Then again, I've already said he should have gotten 2 games, if only because of the injury. But letter of the law (and you can bet the NHL has better frame capture software than me) says no hit to the head = no suspension. It sucks, if only that it feeds the outrageous hysteria coming from "hockey is a religion" land, but hey, Savard suffered the same "the hit was legal under the rules" BS.

By the way, TD Garden and Bell Centre both should get rid of that silly glass in the partition. It does nothing, except injure people.

 

[phil*]

I surmise from this that you have no interest in the truth, you only seek to further the hysteria.

Matter of fact, Pacioretty's head is already in contact with the stanchion well before Chara's arm comes up.

..and once again, Jeff..once you are proven wrong beyond a reasonable doubt..you refrain from admitting it..and resort to personal attacks. Very telling.

 

[phil*]

The issue here is NOT whether Chara's glove or forearm contacted Pachioretty's head or shoulder. It is also, not an issue of intent, because I really don't believe Chara intended to injure him. It is mostly an issue of whether Chara was aware of his surroundings and should have eased up. Since Chara is an NHL veteran of 13 seasons, and has played at the Bell Centre countless times, it is unthinkable that he was not aware of his surroundings.

 

[phil*]

In Boston, Chara said, "I had no idea (Pacioretty) was on the ice . I had no idea it was him." Which, if true, suggests three things: Pacioretty's shoulder-bladesspanning nameplate isn't big enough; one of the world's premier defencemen is shockingly unaware of the opponent he's facing; and that there was no act of long-memory revenge after Pacioretty's push of Chara following the former's overtime winner scored in Montreal on Jan. 8.

 

[Jeff Gatie]

The issue here is NOT whether Chara's glove or forearm contacted Pachioretty's head or shoulder. It is also, not an issue of intent, because I really don't believe Chara intended to injure him. It is mostly an issue of whether Chara was aware of his surroundings and should have eased up. Since Chara is an NHL veteran of 13 seasons, and has played at the Bell Centre countless times, it is unthinkable that he was not aware of his surroundings.

So now that I produced pictures that prove he didn't hit his head, it's suddenly "not an issue?" In the future, you may want to place your change of tune a couple more posts after wallpapering the forum with multiple copies of your ironclad "incriminating" "beyond a reasonable doubt" photos, phil.

 

[Scott Merryfield]

Originally Posted by Jeff Gatie


I questioned the reason for those glass partitions even being there in a previous post, so we are definitely in agreement there, too. As I said before, they do not exist in the regulation size rink that our local OHL team plays on.

 

[phil*]

Apparently, these tee shirts are selling like hotcakes in Montreal. I'd like to get you one Jeff, but I need to know your size. Maybe you can wear it the next time you attend a Habs Bruins game at the TD Garden.

 

[Jeff Gatie]

The thing is, how can you legislate this type of hit? It happens all the time and 99.9% of the time there is no injury. Unlike blindside hits to the head and hitting from behind, there just isn't a history of injuries to warrant a ban of hitting around the benches. Plus, every team in the league would simply break out on the bench side, giving them the entire neutral zone with no chance of being hit. That would ruin the game. It was a tragedy, but i personally do not see it as something that can be legislated. The game has it's dangers, and the stanchions are one of them, along with sharp blades and 100 mph rubber disks. The best thing to do is get rid of the partition, and ban seamless glass. Banning that type of hit is, IMHO, going too far.

 

[Jeff Gatie]

You'd sacrifice the still beating hearts of both Kostitsyn brothers to the hockey gods in order to have him on your team, and you know it phil. He's a class act, he's huge, he can fight and he's won a Norris. All things your team lacks right now.

 

[Scott Merryfield]

Originally Posted by Jeff Gatie /forum/thread/305908/nhl-2010-11-season-discussion-thread/30#post_3789545

 

[phil*]

But really, who cares? The league ruled, it's over.

What really is astonishing about this episode is the seemingly blase attitude of most Boston fans. One would think that Bruins fans would be upset at Chara's hit as well, given what happened to Patrice Bergeron and Marc Savard. This is NOT a Montreal vs Boston thing. One can only guess at the outrage that Boston fans would be feeling had this game taken place at the TD Garden, and it was P.K. Subban who had delivered exactly the same hit to David Krejci at the same location on the ice, with exactly the same consequences. Subban would have been lucky to escape with his life from Boston.


This is more of an attempt to get the NHL to clean up its act, and severely punish those players who administer hits to another player's head. Sidney Crosby, the NHL's marquee player, might be lost for the season because of a concussion resulting from a cheap hit.

 

[Jeff Gatie]

Heck, I'd sacrifice the still beating hearts of both Kostitsyn brothers for any defenseman... or even a cold beer. Come to think of it, I don't even need a reason.

My favorite conversation from a hockey forum I frequent was the following: One poster: Dude, I can't stand that Kostitsyn brother! Other poster: Which one, Mary Kate or Ashley? And by the way, I'd take Markov on my team any day, even with the injuries. Class act all the way.

 

[Jeff Gatie]

No phil, we realize that league rulings mean squat. Because of the Savard and Bergeron rulings, we understand the BS. We don't like it, but we understand it. And by the way, Krecji was lined up and crunched by Richards last year, dislocating his wrist and putting him out of the playoffs. Probably the reason for the three straight losses. Most fans reaction - That's hockey. We realize injuries happen, and we don't feel the league has to legislate the danger out of the game. We also believe in the players policing themselves, hence the general lack of hysteria over Begin breaking Savard's back. It happened, Savard was out, and Begin got a dose of Shawn Thornton as payback. And Begin, dirty as he was, dropped the mitts and took his medicine. We respect stuff like that, hence the current loathing of Subban and other Habs who yap and slash and don't back it up. Shoot, even Marchand has dropped them twice, and he's as big a rat as Ken Linesman. And once more phil, CHARA DID NOT HIT HIM IN THE HEAD! This isn't Crosby or Savard, it was a bad play that injured a player. Just like Richards hit on Krecji. Plus you have to admit, if that was Milan Lucic laying prone, Habs fans would be cheering like they won the cup. They've done that before.

 

[Scott Merryfield]

Originally Posted by Jeff Gatie ) and Sopel helps, but I do not think it will be enough.

 

[Scott Merryfield]

BTW, I noticed when watching the Habs - Penguins game yesterday on CBC that Pittsburgh's new arena does not have any glass between the two benches.

 

[Jeff Gatie]

Scott, I heard it reported that only 4 Arenas in the league have that glass. Bell Centre and TD Garden are two of them. It's ridiculous, the days of fighting between the benches ended in the 70s, the only reason for that glass is PR, marketing and/or NBC announcers.

 

[Scott Merryfield]

That's interesting, Jeff. I wonder why Montreal and Boston are among the few that still have that glass? I could understand if they were still playing in the Forum and Garden, but both teams have relatively new arenas.


BTW, I was wrong about our local OHL rink -- there is glass between the benches. I actually looked for it at Sunday's game It's difficult to see from our seats, as we are at center ice on the opposite side of the rink. From that perspective, the front glass blends in with the glass behind the bench.


At least in the OHL, I can somewhat understand why it's place. There are more wild incidents in this league than in today's NHL, so separating the two benches still has some merit. As you said, though, Jeff, those days are pretty much in the past in the NHL.


I've never paid much attention to this small piece of glass before the Pacioretty injury. Now, I'll probably be checking it out at every game I watch from now on.