ML Baseball 2005 Playoff thread (1 Viewer)

[RichardK]

The non-call last night was one of the craziest things I have ever witnessed in sports.
#1. The LIVE pitch, swing and miss, catch, strike out, was clear to me last night.
#2. The umps hand chop, signifying no touch, and then the slow closed fist out sign was kind of wierd, but obvious he was calling the batter out.
#3. The distraught walk by the white sox batter towards the dugout and then his sudden wait 'he didnt say out' was wild.
#4. The non tag by the angels catcher and casual throw of the ball towards the mound was surreal.
#5. The stunned angels team when they realize 'hey he's running towards 1st base and he's gonna be safe' look on their face was crazy to watch.
#6. The ump blew the call, the ball was caught for a strike out. Doh!
#7. The batter knew he struck out, but he did the right thing in taking advantage of the situation.
#8. The catcher blew his responsibility by not tagging the runner, just in case, especially after he just caught a ball in such a manner that would draw doubt or scrutiny.
Sadly for the Angels, nothing to do now but play on. If the Sox win the series, then the baseball gods really want these guys in the Series.

 

[Shane Martin]

The umpiring in the Cardinal game was also pretty poor. The ump was giving Isringhausen way too much leniency(sp?) with the lower part of the strike zone. Even the commentators mentiont it as such.

 

[MarkHastings]

...unless the Sox win the series before game 7.

But as a Red Sox fan, I know that your team should never put themselves in a position where a bad call (or play ) can make or break your season.

 

[george kaplan]

I keep hearing that, and it confuses the hell out of me. Basically, if your team is in a position where a bad call can cost you the game, then the other team is pretty much in the same position. If the bad call had gone against the White Sox in the top of the 10th would it be justified cause the Sox should never have put themselves in that position? No, it would be just as egregious.

 

[MarkHastings]

What the phrase is supposed to put into perspective is, if the team was much better than the team they lost to, the bad call wouldn't have factored into the equation...

Example: If the Red Sox had won some of those damn final games (especially the ones in Tampa) they never would have had to worry about the head to head match up with the Yanks (after tying for first).

OR, if the Sox had played better ball in '86, Buckner's error wouldn't have been so costly. Buckner didn't screw the series, the team screwed themselves long before the error.

It all goes back to my hockey goalie days where they'd say: It's almost NEVER the goalies fault...for every goal scored, 5 things have to had gone wrong before the goal.

 

[Joseph S]

Al Clark went to federal prison after the 1999 ALCS sham. Too bad his cohorts Rick Reed, Dale Scott, and Tim T'Cheater couldn't join him. No excuse for these sorts of calls and Eddings should have been fired on the spot.

 

[george kaplan]

Mark,

I understand what people are trying to say with that saying, I just find it bogus. We don't know if the Angels were enough better than the White Sox to win last night or if the White Sox were enough better than the Angels to win last night. What we do know, is that a game that, if properly officiated, was going to be decided by which team actually was better in extra innings, was instead decided by a botched umpire who called a third out, and then was suckered in by a player into changing the call, and who bald-faced lied about it in the post-game news conference.

And the fact that the White Sox were able to capitalize on getting an inning with 4 outs in it, doesn't somehow justify the win. A. J. is (with this stupid smirk on his face that shows he knows he's lying) trying to spin it as justified because the next guy got a hit.

Guess what, A. J.? If you give the Angels 4 outs every inning instead of 3, they'll beat you too. Does that prove that they're better than you and deserve a 4th out? How the hell does Crede's hit justify the umpiring error? Would Crede getting out have been proof of the error? What the hell Crede did with an undeserved ninth-inning at-bat has absolutely nothing to do with whether or not the umpire blew the call.

Bottom line - that saying is basically 'blame the victim' nonsense. That loss wasn't the Angels fault, it was the umpires. The Angels played well enough to get into extra innings, the umpires did not umpire well enough to give us a legitimate outcome. The Sox might have won the game legitimately, but we'll never know.

 

[Craig S]

There WAS a baseball game played tonight. Astros win their first postseason game in St. Louis ever and knot the series 1-1. Oswalt gets the 4-1 win with 7 great innings of work.

Clemons will take the mound on Saturday against Morris, and Minute Maid will be ROCKIN'!!

 

[Ray Chuang]

Folks,

Despite what the traditionalists say, I think what happened last night will finally force MLB to implement some sort of instant replay system within the next few years.

The reviewable plays will probably be these:

1. Whether the baserunner is really out at all bases.

2. Whether the ball is a home run.

3. Whether a fan interfered with a play.

The managers will be allowed three challenges per game for instant replay review.

Note that there are NO plans for using instant replay to call balls and strikes--nobody wants that for way too many reasons.

 

[Jeff Gatie]

How come the only ones I ever heard this from were coaches and goalies?

 

[Rich Romero]

Sox silence the doubters. My prediction for them ending it in 6 still stands. The Angels honestly do not have a chance. They're outmatched in all categories.

 

[george kaplan]

The only category they're outmatched in is having incompetent/unethical umpires on their side. Right now, from a legitimate point of view, this series is tied up, with 1 Angel win, 1 Sox win, and 1 unknown. The fact that an asshole umpire is being supported by MLB who are giving the Sox undeserved credit for that undetermined game, does NOT mean that the Angels are outmatched. If the Sox do win the series, all we'll know is that they legitimately came within 1 game of actually winning it.

 

[Robert Crawford]

I thought there wasn't any crying in baseball.

By the way, I thought the ball hit the ground, but that's my opinion.






Crawdaddy

 

[george kaplan]

Not crying Robert, simply stating facts.

Well, I know you're telling the truth, so that makes you the first person I'm aware of to honestly think so. I saw dozens of people on tv talking about this, and the only ones who said it hit the ground, after watching the video, were the umps and A.J., and they were all lying.

 

[Jeff D Han]

Yeah, George, I agree with you that the ball was caught,
and there should have been extra innings. Eddings call was
bad, but understandable (those kinds of calls at the plate
give the umpire no angle to see the ball- he just has to
make the best guess he can), but he screwed up by not backing up his bad call by telling the catcher that the
ball hit the dirt. It's no surprise that Eddings wouldn't
admit to a mistake (it seems to me that umpires in general
are arrogant and think they are above criticism). I agree
with the posters that say that baseball will (or definitely
should) adopt a form of instant replay, at least for post-
season games. Important contests should never be won or lost on a bad call. Instant replay can work in baseball
if it's limited to calls at the plate, home run calls, and
possibly fair/ foul ball calls down the lines. Baseball
needs some form of instant replay, especially after that
debacle, and if the umpires don't like it, TOUGH SHIT!!!

 

[Rich Romero]

George, your tirades are becoming tiresome. Bad call or not, the White Sox WILL win this series, and were going to win it even without that call, when they wrap this up in 5 or 6, you'll see. I don't know a single analyst that actually picked the Angels, for obvious reasons.

 

[george kaplan]

Well Rich I find your ignoring the vital fact that the umpire has spotted the Sox a game equally tiresome. And I'll tell you what I tell anyone who starts complaining when they hear me tell the truth and don't want to hear it anymore. Put me on your ignore list, and then you won't have to hear my tiresome recitation of the truth anymore.

 

[Robert Crawford]

George and Rich,
If you guys can't be civil to each other then you need to drop it!





Crawdaddy

 

[Brian Perry]

I know this is a few days late, but in Game 1 of the White Sox/Angels series (the "drop-third strike" game), why was Joe Crede credited with a double in the 9th? I thought that if you drive in the winning run in the bottom of the final inning --and it's not a homer -- you only get credit for a single, even if it would have been a double or triple under other cirmcumstances.

 

[Michael_K_Sr]

That was game 2, Brian. I think it was credited as a double because the winning run was on second base and it isn't assumed that the runner would score on a single, although with Ozuna's speed, he probably would have.