Is 2-channel SACD noticeably better than CD? (1 Viewer)

[Lee Scoggins]

Let me threw in my 2-cents here because I've been wondering the same thing until very recently I added a Pioneer DV-45A to my system.

Charles,

I don't mean to be harsh here but the Pioneer 45A is well known to have a poor Super Audio output in terms of sonics. You can find several discussions on this in the archives. It is still a great machine, just not the last word in Super Audio sonics. The implementation of the output filters somehow got done poorly. Many who use the machine find DVDAs to sound better than SACDs as a result, but it is hardly a fair comparison.

 

[Zane Charron]

Donald, I just listened to a few SACD's yesterday for the first time (with a Pioneer DV-47A). First one was Alison K.'s New Favorite. Amazing. The spaciousness of the recording, the detail in the timbre of the instruments, the lifelike quality of the vocals. Incredible disc. I listen to most of my music through Sennheiser HD-600 headphones and a Creekaudio amp. I also listened to Appalachian Journey, which was another amazing disc.

I just wish there was a bit more music that I enjoy on SACD and DVD-A.

 

[Lee Scoggins]

I also listened to Appalachian Journey, which was another amazing disc.

I like this one too.

 

[KeithH]

Seth, do some searches on the Audio/Video Sources board for information on the '963SA and 'NS755V. The early word on the '963SA is that it is a very good machine. The 'NS755V has gotten some good and bad reviews from what I have seen. The '963SA looks to be the better player on paper.

 

[cwhite]

Lee, I have read some of the other threads about the DV45A and none of them dissuaded me from purchasing the player simply because it was the only multi format disc player in my price range. The Kind of Blue disc was disappointing but the In A Silent Way disc easily made up for it. Of the 2 DVD-A discs I have, I don't have the Red Book CD versions so I cannot make any comparisions for improved sound quality.

 

[Serge Ch]

I would prefer to keep the 2-channel setup for space reasons, but is the 5.1 experience the true reason for SACD?

As for SACD/DVD-A music I would place surround speakers in front in stead of behind me. What do you guys think?

 

[RobBenton]

I have to say that while i agree that SACD sounds better then regular cd's I don't think it is as huge of a difference as some people on here would make it out. If you have a very high end system and a golden ear you might hear a big difference but for most people the difference is there but not that big. Also the difference is mainly heard in certain ranges and instruments which were limited by conventional cd's. I have to say the selling point for SACD was surround not high quality stereo. I really do not want to spend all that money to get a slightly better stereo sound as it really doesn't seem worth it but when you get some great 5.1 music it does add a whole new dimension to music listening...

there are some people on here who are adamant stereo people who insist that 5.1 is gimmicky or a fad but I really think that is where music is going and more and more stuff will be in that format.

Even some of the music that is really aggressive as far a surround mixes go can sound really cool. Amanda Marshall's SACD has a lot of action in the rears but is just a really fun disc to listen to and if you have friends over it will really grab their attention.. it is things like that I believe will sell these formats to the general public.

Just my 2 cents.

 

[Rachael B]

Rob, 5.1 analog outputs makes it hard, too hard and expensive, to do M/C SACD right, presently. It's a pain to buy scads of cables and maybe a bass manager like the Outlaw unit. It's darn easy to do stereo SACD!!! M/C SACD will bloom when it digital connections become the norm. If not??? Who knows? Best wishes!

 

[RobBenton]

How is analog 5.1 hard? You need 3 more cables which isnt that many and you dont always need a bass manager.. a lot of the sony units have bass management in them.

 

[Jon-C]

I just picked up the Sony 650 5-disc changer yesterday ($189 BB clearance)and the stereo sacd sounds fantastic. I can't wait to run the 5.1 analog through my Denon 1802.

 

[Rachael B]

Rob, my system has a about a kilometer of cables already. Six more adds to the mess. M/C SACD needs to be easy enough for joe average....one digital connector to the head unit. Bass management belongs in pre's. Sony's bass management is better than any of the DVD-A players I've had. It can be helpful to some extent but ultimately their bass management sounds best set to ALL-LARGE with SUB and big speakers all around IMO. Unless you have a digital connection like Pioneer Elite has or the others soon to come, of course. Rob, it's not E-Z to get proper bass out of M/C SACD. It's totally easy in stereo. M/C needs to be and certainly could be that easy. Best wishes!

 

[RobBenton]

I still dont think 5 cables is that hard for the average person to set up. I understand having lots of cables already as I do too (even more since i have both DVD-A and SACD into 1 reciever) Digital would be nice but the current state is not that horrible.

 

[Michael St. Clair]

Rachael,

Technically, 'All Large + Subwoofer' is a straight passthrough of all 6 channels on the disc unaltered. It actually isn't engaging 'Bass Management' at all - it is the absence of BM.

 

[LanceJ]

If people are worried about the expense of three pairs of cables, well, for most Regular Joe's they will probably just use the interconnects that came with the player. Or, they'll spend a whole six bucks on three pairs of cheapies hanging next to the Cokes & TV guides at Kroger.

I know that may make some here cringe but hey, at least they'll hear something! And if they can read the letters "FL", "FR", "C", "SL", "SR" and "SUB" I'm pretty sure they can hookup a surround music system.

LJ

 

[Dan Joy]

Technically, 'All Large + Subwoofer' is a straight passthrough of all 6 channels on the disc unaltered. It actually isn't engaging 'Bass Management' at all - it is the absence of BM.

Then what does multidirect do?

 

[John-Miles]

I am by no means saying there isn't a difference between sacd and cd, BUT and i say this with respect to both SACD and DVD-A

in my opinion MC is the driving reason behind both. I have for example the metallica black album a title i am very familiar with and yes i noticed a night and day difference in the dvd-a over the cd. but liek i said i am VERY familiar witht hat disc, so i noticed all the little additions to the sound. but when i listened to the rolling stones London Years on sacd I never noticed the same wow that i did witht he metallica disc. and that is 100% for the reason that i am not as familiar with the rolling stones. I dont know any one track well enough to point out the difference in the cd and sacd.

on the other hand as soon as you hear the MC even if you have enver ehard the cd mix you notice a difference, whether you like that difference is personal taste, but you do notice it.

 

[Rich Malloy]

Rachael,

Technically, 'All Large + Subwoofer' is a straight passthrough of all 6 channels on the disc unaltered. It actually isn't engaging 'Bass Management' at all - it is the absence of BM.

We should probably take care to specify equipment here... the above is not true of my Sony C555ES.

Seems like they should be the same, but a quick listen in both modes plainly reveals that they are not. The usual degradation of sound quality that accompanies the use of the bass management circuitry is as apparent on the "5 Large + Sub" setting as with any of the other bass management settings.

I recommend "Multichannel Direct" and "Two Channel Direct" on this machine to avoid loss of sound quality. And an Outlaw ICBM-1 for bass management. But, even before I added the ICBM, I preferred the "Direct" mode settings to any of the bass management settings.

 

[Rachael B]

I was trying to make the point that I am dissatisfied with any player generated bass management I have tried. I am unwilling to buy a Sony or Outlaw bass manager. I have too many cables and black boxes now. My point is that average joe's cannot or won't cope with too many complications. Having a DVD/SACD player with 8 to 11 cables coming out of it is preposterous. Add a bass manager and you've got 6 more cables. I choose to add large side speakers instead of more cables and a BM/extra pre. It better be made as easy as the Elite 47ai to VSX49's connection for everybody soon. All these bleeding analog connections aren't exactly ready for primetime, mass consumption, yet.

 

[Michael St. Clair]

I choose to add large side speakers instead of more cables and a BM/extra pre.

So you aren't doing multichannel music, I assume?

 

[Lee Scoggins]

John,

I agree with you that MC is a driving variable, up to a point. For mainstream acceptance, this is probably very true as it represents enough of a "new thing" to move some into hi-rez. I do feel there are a large number of audiophiles who, right or wrong, are not compelled by anything besides just a better version of 2 channel.

Hopefully there is enough critical mass among both camps to keep interest levels and high and insure a steady supply of major quality albums in both formats.