"High Quality" 2 channel systems and HT (1 Viewer)

[Kevin_R_H]

This goes along with the answer I gave to Doug, who was looking to spend $20,000 on a new system. Throw your money at the 2-channel, and let the HT take care of itself with what's left over.

Mike, you have the same Yamaha DSP amp as I have. It was perfect for what I was looking to do back in 1997. I had a decent 2-channel system that I wanted to add HT capabilities to. The DSP-E492 was perfect for this application. Even now that I hugely upgraded my 2-channel system six months ago, the Yamaha stays in with the big boys.

To me, the way to go is to use a 2-channel rig in with the HT setup. And spending more than $500 on a new HT amp or receiver is just throwing money away. Spend that cash on stereo, since it will have applications in the A/V setup as well. And NEVER let an A/V amp or receiver anywhere near a 2-channel input - it spells death.

Craig, there are MUCH better alternatives to Bryston in that price range. Get out an listen to other stereo amps - you'll be rewarded.

Kevin

 

[Manuel Delaflor]

Craig

Have you considered an all tube solution?

 

[Craig Morris]

I have no interest in tubes. I won't go into the details here. It's a long story.
I also don't believe that my Revels would play well from a tube amp. And my Revels aren't going anywhere.

 

[David_C_M]

Craig

I had that battle between theater and music and I ended up with separates in the end. I would suggest the processor from bryston since the pre amp section is exactly like a bp-25. IMHO you would find the performance of most receivers disappointing for music.

Thats my 2 cents

 

[Manuel Delaflor]

Understood, and just for the record, there are lots of powerful tube amps that will drive very well your Revel's.

 

[Craig Morris]

David,

I have pretty much ruled out home theater separates (although the SP1.7 is a beautiful piece).

I'm entirely satisfied with my home theater performance. If I went to separates, I would need to upgrade my center and surrounds to match their 'quality' to the rest of the system.

I can add a new CD player and a new amp/pre-amp/integrated amp (haven't decided yet) for far less than getting an SP1.7 and 5-7 channels of amplification.

Manuel, I know nothing about tubes. Wouldn't a 'powerful' tube amp be very expensive. Not to mention changing the tubes all the time at great expense.

 

[Manuel Delaflor]

Well, we are talking at more than $3,000 bucks, that's right. On the changing tube costs, it depends on the manufacturer. For example, Margules Audio have an impressive amp U280-SC which works on pure Class A but at the same time keeps the tubes cooler than most Class AB designs, so their duration is much longer. Besides, the cost of the tubes themselfs depends on where is the manufacturer. Currently you can buy inexpensive (yet quality) tubes from China.

 

[BruceD]

Craig,

Be very careful. Tubes do not typically do a great job of controlling bass frequency output to the speakers (read poor damping factor = bass that isn't tightly controlled i.e somewhat sloppy). This is where some SS amps typically excel. With the extensive use of bass frequencies in HT, this could be an important consideration.

 

[BruceD]

Manuel,

Is there a reason why you are always pushing gear from Margules Audio?

 

[Lee Scoggins]

I also don't believe that my Revels would play well from a tube amp. And my Revels aren't going anywhere.

I've heard the big Revel Studios on Audio Research tube amps and they sound great!

 

[Craig Morris]

An acquaintance of mine is seriously considering moving from tubes to solid state. He complains about the short life of his tubes, about having to change a whole set when one blows in order to keep things acoustically matched, about his difficulties sourcing tubes, etc.
His system also hums like crazy. You just walk into his listening room and despite all his efforts (PS Audio power regenerators, etc) his tubes still audibly hum. I can't even stand the fridge going when I'm listening... so I think tubes are out of the question for me.

 

[Scott Oliver]

Not to get this into a tube vs ss thread, but Iused to have a Bryston 5B-st and I could do nothing to get rid of the hum. Now have an Art Audio Concerto MK2 with KR Audio KT-88's and it is dead quiet. With my ear next to the tweeter, I can barely discern some hiss.

If your buddy is having that much trouble with his tubes then he definately should try another tube manufacturer or go with ss.

So far my switch has been a very, very pleasant switch.

 

[Manuel Delaflor]

BruceD is right about the bass "issue", that is why (well, also the price to be honest ) I use an Hybrid Integrated, tubes pre and ss amp.
I like very much the Margules gear BruceD, I own three of their equipments.

 

[BruceD]

Manuel,

Yes, I think you have an interesting combination (tube pre + ss amps). I've never listened to Margules gear, so I can't really comment about it.

 

[Craig_Kg]

When calibrating your receiver, set the receiver flat on all channels, then adjust the volume on your pre/integrated until it matches the center and surrounds. Then remember that position.

You can just set the preamp volume to some easy to remember spot (like 12 o'clock) and then calibrate the receiver as if your mains had different sensitivity to the other speakers.

 

[Alex F.]

Craig's suggestion is the same advice I received from McIntosh. I set our Mac MA-6500 integrated amp's volume control to 12 o'clock when we occasionally view a surround-sound movie via the den system. I calibrated the other speakers around the integrated amp's setting, and it works very nicely.

 

[John Royster]

Barring any equipment limitations...I still say the biggest problem of integrating a HiFi 2 channel system with a home theater is the room and speaker placement.

I get a pretty good soundstage from my main speakers with NO sub, but there is still this big 65" TV smack dab in the middle...cramping my speakers. Most speakers benefit from having them "out in the room", so they can project that killer soundstage we all strive for.

Unfortunately that position doesn't work so well in my home theater given that I have a RPTV. So in the next venture of having a world class 2-channel, multichannel hi-rez, home theater system all in one room I'll be looking very seriously at front projection.

Integrating all of them component wise is pretty easy, it is the placement issues I'm struggling with.

 

[Alex Dydula]

Hello,

To get to the point to where you can really enjoy the music and not the system is one of my goals, the 'Live VS the System" mentality...I want the source to be in my listening room...aint never going to happen, no matter what for 99.99999% of us in audio - hi-fi land.

Attend a concert come home and put 'there' CD in and weep!!
(smile!). It just does not sound the same, does it??

So with that said, I sold my last high-end system and my goold old 8yr old Mirage M-1's, fullrange towers, all 180lbs of them, before it was Maggies, Acoutstats, etc...

Now its a small HT room over the garage.

I have worked very hard to get something that would be great HT and great 2CH in a relatively small space.

I have succeeded beyond what I thought could be done in such a small space, 18" long, 12' wide, 8' ceiling.

I kept the old 2Ch electronics, the $3K amp, the $2k cd deck etc...and added a $641 dollar SONY HT Reciever.

Speakers are the new Dahlquist QX10's, and the compliment of surrounds and a matching sub.

The results are just awesome HT and awesome, really nice sounnding 2Ch stereo. I AB back and forth between the high dollar electronics and the 'crummy' low dollar reciever, and it is not all that different!!!

It required much more attention to speaker placement, to the point of driving me (type A) nuts...but we have found the acoustical sweetspots.

I have found 'high-quality' HT and 2Ch stereo and am very pleased, now back to listenting!

Alex

 

[Charles Gurganus]

Craig, by adding a 2 channel amp PLUS the Sony TA-P9000es analog preamp (with Home theater bypass), you will improve your 2 channel setup by leaps and bounds. The P9000es is a wonder at combining HT with 2 channel, IMO.

 

[Alex Dydula]

John,

It sounds like you need two seperate rooms!
(smile!)

I have this big 57" SONY RPTV and I have moved it out of the room and tested with and without it.

The Soundstage is not all that different when I close my eyes and listen, but when I look at this giant RPTV the mind takes over a plays tricks on you!!

Its hard to be objective...

I play some stuff (CD) and the SAX is right there in the middle, like the TV is NOT there at all...

I have played with moving the speakers out a foot more than the TV to being in line with it and being behind the TV, more towards the rear wall....the bass seems to be more effected by these moves, I now have them in line, parallel to the from of the TV, but towed in to my listening position, this is bringing me very acceptable bass respons without any Sub woofer....and very acceptable imaging...

Life is a compromise
Alex