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Formula 1 2004 (1 Viewer)

Keith Mickunas

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Don't worry, you didn't kill it Chris. It'll pick up when the next race comes up, or if some new rumors start flying. I'm still waiting to see if Kimi will get in trouble for pushing the marshall after his car died.
 

Yee-Ming

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The usual lament is that had Senna not been killed, we could've seen a Senna v. Schumacher duel with the then-ageing king and the young pretender. We did see a Hakkinen v. Schumacher battle a few years ago, but at that time McLaren had a far superior car and Hakkinen, while technically sound, just doesn't generate any "buzz". At least now we get to see two pretenders, JPM and Kimi, to the Schumi throne. As JPM put it, he wants to win the title while Schumi is still driving, and it's a laudable (even if a bit cocky) sentiment -- no doubt JPM doesn't want the "he won only because Schumi retired" tag. But at this rate it may well be that neither JPM nor Kimi can win until Schumi leaves, even if this is in some part attributable to the presently-superior Ferrari -- and to be fair Schumi had a big part in developing the Ferrari to the car it is today.

As an aside, re Schumi's fitness, I remember the commentators talking about the G-forces involved in driving and how exhausting it is, and the camera was following Jarno Trulli at the time, who's head, they pointed out, was flopping left and right as he turned: it appeared he had to brace his head against the side of the cockpit as he seemed too tired to hold his head straight. Next cut: Schumacher -- who in contrast held his head straight up, no trouble at all even through the tightest and fastest turns. And remember the photos of Alonso being hauled out exhausted after a race last season? Schumi always, without fail, springs out of his car, and is almost literally jumping and hopping about (if he's won or done reasonably well).
 

Paul McElligott

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F1 Decade on the Speed Channel will be showing the 1994 San Marino Grand Prix next week. For those who don't remember, that was the race where Senna was killed.
 

Chris Derby

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I was going to mention that... I really enjoy watching F1 decade.

watching races from 10 years ago really illustrates how far car development has come.

the next one is going to be a tough one, though. =(
 

Yee-Ming

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One reason: US market. F1 although having global reach, is not particularly big in the US, where it has to compete with NASCAR and Indycar.

It's similar to football (the "real" kind played with a round ball and feet) -- it's the "world's game", but in the US plays poor cousin to NFL, NBA, MLB and NHL, so top football stars are not quite in the top rank of highest-paid sportmen yet -- with the one-off exception of David Beckham.

What is somewhat surprising to me, and has been all these years, is that a golfer, of all people, is the top earner. Years ago Jordan was undisputed #1, and that was no surprise at all. But golf? Seems like such a "limited" game in terms of participation (i.e. number of people who actually play it). But perhaps because those who do play it have the money, making it a lucrative market, and therefore worth the advertising dollars paid to Tiger.
 

Keith Mickunas

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That's exactly my point Yee-Ming. If it was an athlete from one of the big three sports in the US I could understand it. But we're talking about an American golfer of all things being number one. On the other hand, F1 is very popular in Europe, Asia, and South America and there are very few drivers compared to the number of athletes in most other sports. The fan to driver ratio is astronomical for this sport. Now football has a ton of players and every nation that follows it has its own players. Therefore the revenue available for advertising and such is going to be split across a good number of people.

Golf just doesn't have that big of an audience, at least an audience that is going to be swayed that much by marketing. Tiger is a great athlete, but he's a golfer, which doesn't have that type of demographics one would need to spend a lot of money on to advertise to. Do you really think anyone has bought a Buick because of Tiger Woods? Buick drivers and golfers have been a part of the same population group for a long, long time.
 

Chris Derby

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but tiger is "black", too. his demographic is larger than just the standard golf demo. if tiger was white i don't think he would be getting the endorsement deals that he gets.
 

Yee-Ming

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Ah. I see your point Keith. Perhaps because the Big 3 sports in the US are team sports, so even if there's a "star player", it's diluted by his teammates, and his team brand. Tiger, on the other hand, is his own 'team' so to speak, and stands (and falls) by himself.

Even F1, in some part, is a team sport, with the driver as the figurehead; for instance will JPM "lose" some fans who are also Williams fans when he moves to McLaren?

It certainly is an interesting question. Funny, haven't there been studies as to the appeal of Tiger? I mean, if there's an annual study into which football club is the richest (perennial winners: Manchester United), surely there must be one out there on Mr Woods?
 

CharlesD

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Is professional golf a US-only sport (like NFL) or do people in other countries follow it? If there is a global interest in watching people play golf maybe that would explain why Tiger Woods makes even more money than Michael Schumacher.
 

Peter Kim

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Golf is making/has made huge inroads in the Asian arena, particularly Japan and South Korea - they are really crazy about the sport.

Keep in mind - Tiger is half Asian, his mother being Thai (oddly, this is rarely marqueed as much as his black ancestry). As a result, his appeal runs the gamut and widens his popularity and recognition through much greater parts of the world.

Should add...not to mention golf's birthplace in europe (Scotland?) and its status and wealth of superstar players from a vast array of European countries (not to mention India, S. Africa, and Australia...well hell, basically everywhere).

Ironically, golf is a much more accessible sport...relative to F1. Also strange - the tobacco ban in many western countries, while damaging short-term to F1, may ultimately broaden F1's popularity and boost its current, flagging vitality - see Bahrain and China circuits.
 

Keith Mickunas

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To some extent, yes, I think the team matters some. JPM may lose some fans when he switches. Schumi drives for Ferrari, and that is significant. You can't buy a Williams, very few can buy a McLaren, but Ferrari's are something many of us can at least dream of one day having. However, Schumi has so many records, even if he switched teams as long as he was winning I think he'd still be one of the favorites of most fans.
 

Yee-Ming

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Ah yes. Just to jump in, his mother is half-Thai half-Chinese, and IIRC his father is, ironically, only a quarter black, the other quarter being either Caucasian or maybe Hispanic, and the other half being the other (I think). Kinda makes Tiger the poster boy for the modern world of mixed-race people, where race should not be a consideration and a person should be "judged by the content of his character".

I suppose in Singapore there are plenty of people like that, I remember my former boss, who's of mixed descent, and who's wife was half-Chinese half-Eurasian, telling me, when one of his kids asked "what am I" in relation to race, he answered "Singaporean". So Tiger is "American", no prefix-hyphens required.

(BTW, "Eurasian" around here doesn't literally mean a person with one parent European and one parent Asian, it's usually attached to descendants of such a union in the past, as there are many of them and they have a distinct culture of their own.)
 

BrianShort

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If anyone is interested in reliving Ayrton Senna's tragic crash in the 1994 San Marino Grand Prix at Imola, that race will be shown tonight on Speed Channel as part of their F1 Decade series. Basically it's the entire race compressed into 1 hour. I can't remember if they include driver interviews or not, but this will be very interesting to see, especially since I didn't follow F1 back in 1994.

Brian
 

John Nelson

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I have some trepidation about watching that tragic race, but it's such a[n infamous] part of F1 history that I'll be turning to Speed Channel. They likely won't show Roland Ratzenberger's fatal practice crash or Rubens Barichello's severe shunt. What a strange and tragic weekend. The planets seemed aligned for tragedy, what with those events, Senna's death, the start accident that injured spectators, the pit accident that led to the current pit lane speed limits. They just kept pushing ahead hoping things would get better and they just got worse. It's going to be eerie and dramatic watching Senna getting into his car while knowing the fate that awaits him. :frowning:
 

BrianShort

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Just finished watching it... first off, I was a bit dissapointed in the number of commercials... they came almost every 5 minutes!

Anyway, I knew about Ratzenberger's crash, but not Barichello's... that looked NASTY! They're lucky he didn't die too. I also didn't know about the crash at the start that sent debris into the crowd, or the pit lane crash. I'm really surprised they didn't have speed limits with all those people standing around. It's like they were just asking for trouble.

I watched a few races from 1993 that they showed last year. That year at least, I learned they carried enough fuel for the whole race, so there was no fueling during the race. The pit crews would be decked out in shorts and tshirts some of the time! Crazy!

Brian
 

John Nelson

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Wow, what an unexpectedly powerful episode of F1 Decade. Though marred by too many commercials and the showing of a considerably abridged version of the race, the footage looked like it could have been filmed today. The episode was opened and closed by a somber Steve Matchett, mechanic for Team Benetton on that day. For anyone who is interested and who missed this episode of F1 Decade, here are Steve's eloquent and emotional closing comments on that dark day in Formula One history ten years ago:
 

Chris Derby

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if anybody still has this recorded, i'd be interested in obtaining a copy... my tivo got powered off somehow :angry: and my season pass didn't catch it.
 

JeremySt

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Looks like Ferrari is well on there way to securing the Constructors and drivers championships by mid season.
 

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