Doctor Who Star quits! (1 Viewer)

[andrew markworthy]

No - just trying to point out how silly your comments are.

Take a look around you - who else is beefing about this show?

 

[Gary OS]

Well, I'm not out to make enemies or upset anyone, Andrew. But I don't want Philip to think he's alone. He's not! I'm in full agreement with him. I have yet to see the show since I live here in the States, but at this point I can tell you straight up I have no interest in watching it when it is available. I've read more than enough reviews to realize there is an agenda here, and even if there wasn't and it was all very innocent, I still say there's no place for this kind of sexual innuendo in Doctor Who. If that's the way they want to play this new series, fine. But they've lost a potential viewer in me. And I know I'm not alone.

Gary "the clincher - that this is all intentional - is the comment from Barrowman himself" O.

 

[andrew markworthy]

So let's see - you believe hearsay and won't look for yourself? I always wondered why McCarthy got such a grip on the USA. Now I think I know.

BTW, I understand that Leave it to Beaver is coming out on DVD. I expect that will be a very happy day for you because there can be precious little else on TV that you think is fit to watch.

Have a nice day.

Sorry for the harshness of these words, but one thing that drives me mad is people relying on opinion as fact. If you don't agree with me or others agreeing with me, then fine - that's what makes us tick, and having a good argument can be refreshing. But blindly assuming that one side has the right view and not bothering at all to look for yourself - :frowning:

 

[Gary OS]

This isn't a matter of hearsay. That's for sure, and you know it. We've got clear comments from the actors themselves on this topic, as well as numerous reviews from multiple websites and sources, many of which aren't opposed to the content. Therefore I know it's not a matter of a few "right-wing wacko's" (as you would undoubtedly refer to them) looking for something to object about. It's what it is. Blatant intent to introduce sexual innuendo into what used to be a kid's show that had no such innuendo in the past.

Gary "and, yes, I will be looking forward to the LITB dvd release very much" O.

 

[andrew markworthy]

Gary, if you want to base your life on what other people tell you when all you have to do is sit passively in front of a TV screen to test the facts out, then fine, go ahead. The simple truth is that for every statement you've selectively attended to, there is another saying the opposite or (correctly IMHO) that the whole issue is making a mountain out of a molehill that most kids won't spot.

Now can we get back on topic, please?

For those who are interested, in this morning's Brit papers it was revealed that:

The transformation scene introducing the new doctor - which appears at the end of the last episode - was filmed in January.

In other words, long before any of the news about CE quitting the series was released officially.

 

[Gary OS]

Andrew, I'm sorry buddy, but that dog of your's just isn't hunting. I've already exposed your argument as fallacious. And now you want add to this whole fiasco by using a straw-man argument that you can easily tear down. Too bad it didn't work.

This isn't a matter of kids spotting something or not. It's a matter of the producers, writers, and actors desiring to add sexual situations (even if only through innuendo) to a show where none has ever appeared before and doesn't need to appear now. But I guess they've "just got to do it".

Gary "go ahead and have the last word if you must, I'm done with this discussion" O.

 

[Mikel_Cooperman]

Sexal Inuendo? Agenda? It is 2005 ya know. You wont watch it because you dont agree with the content? How sad!
Just saw Bad Wolf Friday. Talk about great! And the ending to the cliffhanger? Wonderful!

 

[RickER]

The point to me is sex of ANY kind has never been a factor in Dr. Who. I don't mind the show doing new things, but if it has THAT many changes why call it Dr Who? Just like the new Battlestar Galactica (which i LOVE). Why do all new si fi remakes have change everything, and to be like a soap opera. I like my si fi in the form of space opera if anything. Once again, tell a good story. If the story dictates that a guy needs to kiss another guy...OK. But don't do it just to get a rise out of people. Does it advance a story, does it fit with the character. I bet the Dr. goes to the crapper too, but i don't need to see it if it isn't a plot point. If the Doctor didn't sleep with Sarah Jane or any other companion in the last 30 years why have him get all kissy-kissy now? And if i was Adric i would have been all over Nyssa. The show doesn't need to fall in the soap opera rut. I have not seen the show, and i hope my points are not the case. I will of course watch it to see for myself.

P.S. Hope we can keep any anti American talk out of this, as we have gone far enough away from "Dr. Who star Quits" as it is.

 

[Francois Caron]

Has anyone here watched the Doctor Who Confidential segment that followed the broadcast of the show? John Barrowman (Captain Jack) discusses that particular sequence. As for my own opinion, if there's any particular agenda in that single sequence, I just can't see it. Instead, I found it very funny and not at all offensive. (Side note: I found the "license fee" comment in last week's episode to be a riot! Real life isn't that far off! )

What I hated the most about the original series was the cheapness, the tackyness and above all else the level of sterility amongst the performers. And it drove me nuts because I knew the series could be so much better. It had all the basic elements of a great series, but the packaging was horrible.

Now we have this new series which not only gets rid of the tackiness, but brings back much of the original elements that worked and upgrades them big time. And the stories were simply incredible! RTD has managed to create engaging storylines not only in the context of a science-fiction/horror/mystery series, but he accomplished it without creating any elements that appeared overly contrived -- at least not too many of them -- and adding in legitimate feelings between the participants, something I don't think was ever properly shown or even existed in the original series even after Adric died.

As far as there being a so-called "agenda" in the series (whatever *that* is), I don't believe it for an instant. With the exception of documentaries, agendas in movies and TV series are about as credible as conspiracy theories.

Now we have to wait until Christmas for a new episode? Man what a long wait that's going to be! When will BSG start up again?

 

[PhilipG]

Just to finish my ratings, for anyone interested:

10. The Doctor Dances - 7
11. Boom Town - 4
12. Bad Wolf - 7
13. The Parting of The Ways - 7

Overall, a good series (6 out of 10). Very inconsistent though. Much room for improvement, particularly with regard to story structure and pacing. I can't help but wonder how much better it would be if RTD and Mark Gatiss switched jobs. But that's not going to happen (soon).

Gary, IMHO you *should* give the series a chance (at least, see Dalek and The Empty Child). But I respect your opinion if you choose not to.

 

[andrew markworthy]

Gary, merely gainsaying isn't disproving an argument. I was at pains to point out that you were basing your argument on what other people had told you. All you did in return was retreat into solipsism and deny that what you were being told was a valid counter-argument. At no point did I say that if you didn't like the series you should carry on watching it, only that you shouldn't base your actions on hearsay and should watch and decide for yourself. I offered the *opinion* that the critics were wrong and that this is the view of the majority, but I've never presented it as the irrefutable truth. If you can provide a logical case as to why I'm wrong, then say it. If you remain silent, I'll take it that: (a) you acknolwedge I was right and (b) you retreat into a sulk when beaten.

 

[andrew markworthy]

On an entirely separate note - for those who can watch the new Doctor Who without seething with moral indignation, the new Doctor will appear in a new adventure at Christmas (at least in the UK).

 

[PhilipG]

Gary, my friend, just ignore this troll.

 

[Jonathan Kaye]

The new Doctor Who has worked (and, in modern ratings terms in the UK, worked spectacularly) because it's relevant to life in 2005. Yes, Captain Jack is obviously bisexual, or even omnisexual when you consider his attitude to the Trinny And Susannah droids in 'Bad Wolf'!,
but this is 2005 and such things are not taboo any more!

Nothing inappropriate was transmitted in the new series, and nothing of an "innuendo" nature was cut by the BBC other than a rear shot of someone's bare bottom (the only cut imposed on the whole series by the BBC). The innuendo there was in the series was no worse than that in the dear old Carry On films!

As for the kissing in the final episode, it was entirely relevant to the plot, unlike the gratuitous (for this fan of "old" Doctor Who) snogging going on in the TV Movie: Captain Jack is going off to his seemingly-certain death, tells Rose she's worth dying for and gives her a short kiss on the lips, then laughingly tells the Doctor he wished he'd never met him, and gives him the exact same kiss. Nothing romantic, just a goodbye kiss to two friends, one of whom happens to be male (well, in Gallifreyan terms, at least!). Then at the end of the episode, the Doctor saves Rose's life by kissing her, to transfer the time vortex energy to him. Again, not romantic.

As I say, I've been a fan of Doctor Who since long before the new series, and whilst there is a level of relatively-childish innuendo, it's nothing beyond an early-evening BBC1 timeslot.

 

[andrew markworthy]

Oh dear, Philip, I thought you were above this sort of thing. Pointing out that yours wasn't the only point of view seems to have brought out the worst in you. Over the last few posts I've tried to veer this thread back on-topic, but in spite of the majority saying that the new Dr Who is just great, you really do want to bang your drum.

The response to Gary was done in the spirit of his earlier posts - just try reading them without solely noticing the bits that support your side of the argument and you'll see what I mean. A troll is someone who disrupts a thread with insults, not someone who disagrees with your point of view.

Look up 'solipsism' in a dictionary sometime.

 

[PhilipG]

That's one definition. Another is: a poster who is doing his or her utmost to elicit a response using whatever flamebait they can scrape together. You, sir, are simply being petulant (and I won't insult your intelligence by suggesting you should look that one up).

Welcome to my Ignore List. For the love of humanity, add me to yours too.

To the rest of you: I'm sorry for wasting your time with this (unless you enjoyed the exchanges, in which case - you're welcome )

 

[PhilipG]

?! The question I'm asking is: are these lines necessary? They take up no more than a few seconds per episode. Will people stop watching Doctor Who if the innuendo is removed? I don't think so.

WRT the awful TV Movie, I didn't find that kiss gratuitous at all, but I won't say you're wrong to have that opinion.

 

[Nigel McN]

Andrew don't forget that the title of this thread is extremely misleading, Christopher Eccleston was always only doing 1 season of the show. A transformation at the end of season 1 would have always been on the cards and not needed to have been added in anyway.

 

[Francois Caron]

As for all the sexual innuendo in the series, I've seen COMMERCIALS that were far worse than that!

 

[Mikel_Cooperman]

I feel the same way. I remember watching when I was younger and liking it and enjoying it but there seemed, to me, to be some emotional involvement missing. A companion would leave and the Doctor would look a bit sad and then they would be forgotten by the next episode. The new show is the opposite. Sure, it can be a bit soapy at time but any Drama has Soapy ingredients. It's called Drama.
The new show has expanded upon everything that the old show was and I think, done a good job at it.
If you don't like the sexual innuendo, I'm sure there is something more homogenized on for your viewing pleasure