Do you think the industry will ruin HD-DVD? (1 Viewer)

[MarcoBiscotti]

It could work to their advantage if it were outlined to the consumers and marketed as such...

It would make demand on releases greater, just as Disney has done with their Platinum / Masterpiece Editions.

If a title were to be announced that posed interest, the consumer would be confident in that release.

Many people are hesitant to purchase a film and have held off for a "new transfer" or "special edition" or a title's upcoming anniversary in hopes that it'd be revisited... with a new format, this would not be necessary.

The studios could outline their intentions to the consumers and stick to their guns, it's proper marketing and business ethics.

In turn, more people would turn out on release day to buy the product. They would have nthing to deter them...

 

[MarcoBiscotti]

Also, how would anyone rightfuly justify spending inflated costs for a movie in high-def format if it's not going to be released w/ commenatry track and significant extras... when that same title is available in such context on dvd?

That's where HDVD would fail right away. The average consumer wouldnt take it. Even with a significantly enhanced digital video transfer, only hardcore theatre enthusiasts would shell out the funds because your average customer either couldnt tell the difference eitherway, or doesnt have the relative set-up nor desire/motivation to invest in such in order to fully appreciate the quality and efficiencies of the advanced format. They'll go for the Special Edition DVD and unless the studios recognize this, HDVD is doomed before it ever kicks off.

That's why I say that the time to pander to us... the salvation, potential and future of new market formats... begins with HDVD.

We are $.

Show us appreciation and recognition and in turn we will support their movements.

Neglect our apprehensions and ability to discern between quality and pretense by exploiting us for what we represent - $ - and this will die out all too quickly.

That's why I say that studios need to get it right the first time around.. we're not talking about a jump from VHS or Laserdisc to DVD.. the variables are much less expressive. HDVD will not succeed on higher resolution alone. It needs to surpass and outmatch DVD in terms of features, quality and all general merits.

That's my 2 cents.

 

[Clinton McClure]

I personally don't care about all the extras and commentaries and bells and whistles included with today's DVDs anyway, so I would gladly pay twice or even three times the price for superior audio and video. That's what HD is all about anyway. You don't pay a hundred grand for a Ferarri because it has a cool looking cup holder and the air conditioner works well. You pay a hundred grand because it performs better than the overpriced Escalade lined up next to it at the stoplight.

 

[Arno Keiler]

I won't buy anything that requires an internet connection to work...

If customers decide to be that stupid to buy such a stuff then I will continue living happily with my "normal" DVD collection anf just look for a new hobby...

 

[Adam Horak]

My greatest fear for HD-DVD is that they will downconvert to 480i or 480p over component. My current display does not have DVI inputs, so that would effectively eliminate me from the HD-DVD market until I bought a new display ($$$):frowning:

 

[Mark Zimmer]

Marco, I think Columbia's Superbit line is a test marketing of exactly what you're outlining. Will people spend more for a better quality picture but no extras (never mind that the regular version is intentionally downgraded, or that the SB version doesn't actually come anywhere near maxing out the bit rate). Since they still issue SB discs, I'd have to say that they consider it a success and the model for their HD-DVD releases.

 

[Glen C]

As a former LD enthusiast, I can safely say HD-DVD is going to have a rough time in the market existing, even as a niche. DVD is entrenched in our society like CD-audio is and any "dvd upgrades" such as HD-DVD is going to faulter at retail like audio "upgrades" like dts-cds, dvd-audio, SACD have.

In short, the average person will not see the benefits of going from DVD to HD-DVD as they did going from VHS to DVD

(or going from LP/Cassette to CD).

Maybe in 5-7 years actual HDTV demand and hardware installed base will make the software side remotely realistic. Of course they will still try and have the obligatory format wars.

 

[JimmyK]

This is my concern as well. There are many, many people who have sets that lack DVI inputs.

Personally, I won't buy into HD DVD if it won't work with my current HDTV.

JimmyK

 

[Nils Luehrmann]

Of course studios are also not going to release HD versions of their films without the best possible copy protection. As consumers we already pay more than we should due to the now common practice of bootlegging, but the distributors/studios have also lost profits due to bootleggers and as such, I don’t expect the majority of these companies to compromise on anything but the very best possible CP format for HD-DVD. So far, the best possible CP format is through DVI only.

On the positive side, DVI offers a significant improvement in PQ over component so it is safe to assume anyone who is interested in HD-DVD is also interested in using DVI in order to get the best possible PQ.

Otherwise, if one is willing to compromise PQ due to a cable, then standard DVD scaled to 720p on an HDTV will probably satisfy that type of consumer and as such I can’t see why they should care about HD-DVD regardless of the type of cable required.

 

[Scott Merryfield]

This is only true with fixed pixel digital display technologies, such as LCD or DLP. If the display is a CRT, it's debatable whether there is much difference in picture quality between analog or digital connections from the source component to the display. The video signal must get converted to analog at some point anyway.

My current display does not have a DVI connection. I will not upgrade the display just for HD-DVD. It will get upgraded when I'm ready for other reasons. If HD-DVD arrives in the marketplace before that time, it had better work with an analog component video connection or I will not buy it, either.

 

[Brent Hutto]

There are two issues that I see on the horizon, one that will damage HD-DVD and the other that has the potential to kill it completely.

The issue that will damage it from my perspective is the cropping of 4:3 and Academy format material into a 16:9 box. IMO this is a near certainty and I just hope that OAR material continues to be available in the current DVD format, at least for a long while.

The issue that could kill it is so-called copy protection that becomes de facto pay per view. I really think that at some point in the future (and what better time than the rollout of HD-DVD in 2006-ish?) the entertainment conglomerates are going to make a full-out run at doling out their content on a recurring-revenue basis. I'm not sure what I'll do if that succeeds one day. At least my immediate reaction will be to Just Say No. OTOH, my wife and I seem to be quite addicted to home theater as our preferred method of watching movies (although we still go to the multiplex 12-15 times per year).

The biggest brake on that possibility is the perception of DVD in its current form as a revenue generating miracle that I think was totally unanticipated by the major studios. They may not want to trade off sure money from inexpensive, high-volume, high-profit DVD sellthrough for taking a risk on even higher profits from a model which limits the number of viewings (at the expense of much, much lower perceived value for the consumer).

 

[Lew Crippen]

Not at all a challenge Brent—but I’m curious as to why you would think that. Given that initially HD-DVD will only appeal to enthusiasts, and techno geeks, I would expect the correct ratios to be mostly observed.

 

[Jeannette Walsh]

I was going to say something about that too. I currently have HDTV through cable (Sony CRT HDTV set) and I was using component from the start. When I read commments about the superiority of DVI I bought one to see and not only is it not better I would say it's worse than component. I only use the component cable now. Of course this could be different for other types of TVs.

My big worry over HD DVD is that they won't bother restoring prints before the master them. Scratches and spots that are quite prevelant on most DVD look even more pronounced in HD as does grain. Have you ever seen Minority Report in HD? Jeez

 

[Dan Rudolph]

As others have noted, tilt and scan doesn't really work as you have to cut off paarts of people's heads in close-ups.

 

[Brent Hutto]

I guess "near certainty" is an unreasonably pessimistic reading of the situation. I guess I'm envisioning a convergence of HDTV and HD-DVD way beyond what has happened with the current DVD format. Both of the concerns I brought up assume a lot of control over the way in which "content" (I hate that word passionately) is delivered on the part of the mass entertainment producers.

With respect to the cropping issue I'm guessing that there will be a temptation to standardize aspect ratios once most television is being produce in 16:9 format. I think there will be pressure to have everything black-bar-free which will be pan-and-scan for 'scope movies and some sort of cropping of older 4:3 ratio TV-on-DVD stuff.

The old Academy format movies are a niche and they are certainly only appealing to a market that will be unforgiving of any non-OAR presentation. I'm not as convinced that HD-DVD will be allowed to stay very long as a geek format, which gets back to my fear that it will offer a temptation to recapture control of delivery into a non-ownership model. In reality, I hope my views are ridiculously alarmist. Maybe I'm offering more of a worst-case scenario than an actual prediction.

 

[Ted Todorov]

Exactly! And I think that the above three are pretty much guaranteed. The format war alone will cause it to bomb.

Also: does HDTV even exist outside the US -- in Europe for instance? DVD is a worldwide phenomenon -- a US only HD-DVD will go nowhere fast.

And if HD-DVD does go worldwide, for "art" film lovers like myself it is very important that the region coding system is very easy to circumvent -- if HD-DVD comes up with hard to defeat region coding, they'll lose plenty of customers.

Ted -- normally an optimist, but not when it comes to HD-DVD

 

[Rob Gardiner]

Another couple reasons why we will never see the "definitive, final release" of any given film on HD-DVD or any other format, any more than we will ever see The Who's "final" tour:

1) Film-to-video transfer technology continues to advance.

2) In the case of older films, new elements are discovered all the time, and restoration techniques continue to advance.

Unless HD-DVD can provide the same quality as a pristine, archival quality 35mm print (and I believe it falls quite short of this), there will ALWAYS be re-masterings and re-releases.

 

[Lew Crippen]

This is much more likely. I think that many people won’t see that much of a difference between a good DVD transfer and HD, at least on the smaller sets. And many of those who can see the difference, won’t care.

As in the case of audio, almost everyone bought into Hi-Fi, because everyone could easily hear a big difference. The same with stereo. CDs were an easy technology buy in because of convenience to the consumer. But it takes pretty high-end equipment to be able to even hear much of a difference in the new audio formats—and many who have such equipment, don’t care.

I do believe that this could be slow to catch on, simply because of a lack of perceived increase in quality vs. the difficulty and expense of obtaining that quality.

This just argues for a slightly longer period for the format to stay in the hands of the enthusiasts (and hence a prolonged period where OAR will be important).

What classic film lover is going to by an alerted copy of Casablanca, Gone with the Wind or Citizen Kane?

 

[Adam Horak]

I have to disagree with your reasoning. I am VERY interested in seeing the best possible PQ that I am able to reasonably afford. I bought the best display I could reasonably afford two years ago and it does not have DVI in.

I am am VERY interested in HD-DVD but I am NOT willing (or probably able) to shell out several thousand dollars to get the advantages of it.

I am not "willing to compromise PQ due to a cable", its not just a cable, its a whole new friggen multi thousand dollar television.

That said, if the industry allows HD over compenent, its a moot point and I will be happy as a clam

 

[MikeMcNertney]

1) The DVD players wouldn't be running Windows. The codec has nothing to do with the OS.

2) The major selling point of the coded is most definitely not DRM. It is that it provides better quality/space than anything else out there. The DRM isn't even under consideration yet, it is up to the studios to decide what they want for DRM. No matter what codec is chosen, there will be DRM. Studios don't want HD versions of their movies available for everyone to download. That is a separate issue from the codec choice.