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David Lynch's DUNE--new DVD (merged thread)

Discussion in 'DVD' started by Bill Griffith, May 4, 2002.

  1. John Sullmeyer

    John Sullmeyer Well-Known Member

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    Thanks Paul. This is just the weirdest thing I have ever encountered with any DVD. I'll see if I can provide an audiobyte just so you all don't think I am crazy. I tried making changes on my reciever and the DVD player, but no luck. It's meshed on the track somehow.
     
  2. CraigF

    CraigF Well-Known Member

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    John: wouldn't mind a time code if you have one, I'd like to see if I could hear it.

    Anybody notice distortion in several places in the right surround track of the theatrical cut? It wasn't subtle, least what I heard, several times too.

    Like Paul, it took me 4 copies to get a fully functioning one. I've spent way too much effort on this disc IMO. I think the PQ is not nearly as clean as it should or could have been. Not very impressive in most cases, but some scenes looked very good. Overall the sound seemed kinda scratchy to me, sure not smooth. I didn't compare with the first disc though.

    Anyway, that's the last nickel Uni will see from me for this film, I don't care what future versions they release, I've paid enough already and have a pretty good idea from what I've seen as to how they regard this film.
     
  3. DaViD Boulet

    DaViD Boulet Well-Known Member

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    John,

    what you say reminds me of a story I have to share:

    When I first got my DAT recorder back in the mid 1990's I digitally dubbed a bunch of CD tracks onto a 120 min DAT to make a "best of" compilation. Later, I decided to re-record the DAT and so I recorded over it...again using an all-digital connection. Because my second recording didn't take the full 120 minutes, the DAT deck continued to record "digital silence" for the remainder of the tape after I had recorded the program material I was interested in.

    Ok...so later I was listening to the DAT recording with headphones...and after the music finished, I heard something very faint in the "silence"...I turned the volume up louder and louder and then I realized I was hearing MUSIC in the re-recorded silence...and I recognized "Kiss from a Rose" by SEAL...one of the songs that I had previously been recorded on the DAT tape.

    I was shocked. How could a digital medium have "bleed through" from a previous recording?!?!?

    I called TASCAM to ask what they thought and the engineer told me it was impossible. BUT I WAS HEARING IT...I wasn't making it up! I could even recognize the song!

    It's bizarre stuff like this that has given me pause when I hear the usual "bits are bits" guys...obviously there is more going on than the official word on digital recording!

    -dave [​IMG]
     
  4. Jon Smith

    Jon Smith Well-Known Member

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    I agree about the PQ, really disappointed.

    Although I thought the sound was very good for a film of its age on the theatrical cut. But i didnt listen out on the surround too closely, so didnt spot any distortion.

    And does anyone else think the PQ on the extended cut is much better than the theatrical cut ?
     
  5. John Sullmeyer

    John Sullmeyer Well-Known Member

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    Craig,

    Timecode is 00:20:29. It's right at the scene where we first see Paul when he is sitting at the desk. I'm working on getting a sound clip.

    David,

    I hear you brother. There is something very weird going on here.
     
  6. Paul Arnette

    Paul Arnette Well-Known Member

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    John,

    Something in the back of my head told me I needed to go and confirm what I told you when I said I didn't hear 'dialogue from the theatrical version of the Princesses opening monologue underneath the scenes dialogue' beginning at the 20:29 mark. Sure enough, you're right. It is there. I guess subconsciously I noticed it. [​IMG]

    Anyway, upon hearing it I immediately flipped to the theatrical version, and, of course, it is not in that scene. Knowing that this really didn't prove anything, I went to my French Dune Ultimate Edition DVD. My suspicion was that this was an intentional 'creative decision'. The same dialog can be heard on the French Dune Ultimate Edition TV version.

    Just chalk it up to another woefully bad editing decision. I think the point was to serve as background noise as the narrorator explained the characters: Gurney Halleck, Dr. Wellington Yueh, and Thufir Hawat in painstaking detail. Still, nothing is worse than dragging that scene on and on while Thufir becomes agitated for what seems like no apparent reason. [​IMG]

    Anyway, John, I hope that puts the issue to rest for you. Sorry if I made you think you were losing it...
     
  7. John Sullmeyer

    John Sullmeyer Well-Known Member

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    Thanks Paul. It just seems so out of place. I also noticed some weirdness earlier in the film, but will check it out just to make sure.
     
  8. Vincent_P

    Vincent_P Well-Known Member

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    The footage that they share in common is identical, however you have to remember that the "new" footage in the Extended Edition would've been transfered directly from the original 35mm negatives that were stored in a vault at Universal, whereas the entire "theatrical cut" came from a color-timed InterPositive which is one-generation removed from the Negative. David Lynch is notoriously fond of having his films be as dark as possible, and in some scenes it really does jump out when it cuts from Extended footage (taken from the original, untimed negative) to Theatrical footage (taken from the timed IP) just how much he had the image printed down in post-production. The "brighter" look of the Extended footage might look more pleasing, but it's really not how the film was meant to look.

    Another thing to note is that a rather large portion of the Theatrical Cut consists of optically-printed footage. Not just the big effects shots, but ALL shots including the blue-eyes Fremen, too, which means for that material in the Theatrical Cut, what we're seeing is actually 4th-generation material (in order to make opticals, the Negative is first printed to in InterPositive, which is then printed with the optical effects added to an InterNegative, and this IN is then cut in with the original Negative, so all the optical shots in the original DUNE negative are actually THIRD generation at that point, and thus become 4th generation on the IP used for the video transfer). In the Extended Version, some scenes have added Fremen material intercut with Theatrical optically-printed Fremen material, so in the same scene you're literally cutting from 4th generation optical material back to the original, direct-from-the-camera Negative. The difference between a 4th-generation optical and the O-Neg is striking, and it's pretty clear to see while watching the Extended Cut of DUNE.

    I agree a lot more could've been done to clean up the printed-in dirt in all of those opticals, and to better match the color timing when they were cutting from Extended footage to Theatrical footage within the same scene. It's also a shame Universal didn't bother to color-tint the Fremen's eyes in the additional footage so it would match the rest of the film. In the HD/Digital realm, that couldn't have been too hard a task.

    Vincent
     
  9. Brett_M

    Brett_M Well-Known Member

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    Got my replacement disc from Universal today. It's a DVD 18. Turn around was very fast. I checked the extended version at the trouble spot and it played fine.

    Their DVDs still suck but they appreciate our business.

    Give it a try.
     
  10. DaViD Boulet

    DaViD Boulet Well-Known Member

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    Officially waiting for HD. Was on the fence but all this mess with faulty discs has sealed the deal...
     
  11. Joseph J.D

    Joseph J.D Well-Known Member

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    Finally got around to watching the Extended version this evening (I had watched the theatrical version and extras without problems several weeks back). Fortunately, the extended version played all the way through without any problems. Phew! It took three tries to get an actual working disc. Glad the disc replacement ordeal is over for me.

    As for my thoughts on the extended edition.....I liked it even better than the theatrical cut even though it missed some scenes as well as the opening from that version. What would be really great is if they combined the two to form an ultimate cut of the film.....just don't release it on a DVD-18.[​IMG]
     
  12. Brett_M

    Brett_M Well-Known Member

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  13. Mark_TS

    Mark_TS Well-Known Member

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    actually the French Ultimate Edition now takes honors as the best looking version. Too bad they didnt get the WS Extended cut-or it would truly have been Ultimate
     
  14. stevenHa

    stevenHa Well-Known Member

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    Do any of the extras show anything concerning Albert Whitlock's matte painting work ?
     

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