Coming, to a theater near you. (1 Viewer)

[BrianWoerndle]

I don't think overkill is a strong enough word.
But, when is overkill ever a bad thing?

 

[Michael R Price]

Holy cow.

I guess we'll wait for Tom to discuss the technical details, because it appears to be something we're not used to. I take it port plugs are used to extend the low end response to 7Hz?

 

[Anthony_Gomez]

7hz ...talk about a MAJOR saddle in the responce (not that you will notice with it below 20hz). ...and even at moderate SPL...talk about some serious chuffing ..then again, tunning to 7z in say 200L will give the same responce as 200L sealed for all practical purposes.

 

[Seth_L]

Underported? You should know better than that ;^) I doubt there is a sub on Earth that has undergone more testing to ensure such was not the case.

I'm sure that you've tested it a lot, but the bottom line is that your air velocities in the ports will be too high at high volumes. There will very likely be audible port noise.

Seth

 

[Seth_L]

I'd like to know how many dB it can hit at 20Hz anechoic with 5kW. I'd also like to know how much cone travel those woofers have. From what I know of driver design and boxes I'd estimate you need a one way x-max of over 30mm at 20Hz to handle 5kW.

I'm not trying to rain on anyone's parade, but there seems to be a lot about this sub and it's very lofty performance claims that violate the iron laws. Made by SVS or not you can't break the laws of physics.

Seth

 

[Anthony_Gomez]

I think I have to agree with seth on this one.
For the SPL capabilities toted, port compression and noise is definately an issue. I have been modeling various drivers in a similar setup and come to the same conclusion.
...but then again, the port noise may not be an issue because the spl from the drivers is making you deaf anyways
No doubt this is a beast of a sub, but things don't add up ..completely . Just waiting for Tom to chime in
...1250watt power handing per driver?.....is that RMS?

 

[Geoff L]

Your making assumptions on something we/you don't even know for sure what the actual design is!
Based on a typical assumption (and the Iron Laws) you'ed be right, but Tom is not typical.
I wouldn't expect him to design it for actual useful or pratical output at that low a freq. Just the ability to possibly reach it with some spl and possibly even doing it clean. All guessing on my part, and to assume, like my father always told me, could make out ass out of both you and me.
I'll wait for the real deal, ~{Mr.TOM}~, to exlain his side and the real in room data, etc to come forth....
Regards
Geoff

 

[Anthony_Gomez]

Porting is porting...it is based on fundimentals of physics. ...but I better wait for tom as we all have been saying to get a better understanding of what is under her skirt

 

[Dan Hine]

Made by SVS or not you can't break the laws of physics.

True. Or is it? Do we really know all there is to know about physics all ready? Couldn't we be wrong about something and learn to overcome certain obstacles? I'm not saying SVS has in fact changed what we know about physics. But without knowing any objective data about this sub we shouldn't be so quick to tell them that they are wrong and could not have done what they claim.

Just my $.02

Dan Hine

 

[Seth_L]

I wouldn't expect him to design it for actual useful or pratical output at that low a freq. Just the ability to possibly reach it with some spl and possibly even doing it clean.

Geoff you need to come hang out in the DIY forum. 20Hz is doable cleanly, and loudly. It's not that hard to do. My current project should be able to do 118dB (anechoic) with 1600W at 20Hz. It is flat to below 20Hz and doesn't suffer from the low frequency rolloff that I estimate this SVS will. (My modeling combined with the frequency response graphs of their other subs seem to indicate it will roll before 20Hz) It also lacks port compression and noise too.

Seth

 

[Anthony_Gomez]

Hey guys, lets just step back for a bit, admire how strange/cool/interesting (choose your cup of tea) it is, and wait for Tom to get his due reply in
..I got an Idea....howabout you SVS people ship me one of them That will end the whole debate ...hehe

 

[Dan Hine]

And a lucky HTF member will be posting soon the results of his test (I expect he'll speak up when he's ready ;^).

I think it would have been nice if there were more than 1 member on the HTF to get a beta. It would offer more variety as far as types of set ups go. Also you KNOW that there will be a lot of questions for him/her. He/she could easily get overwhelmed.

 

[Brian Bunge]

Tony,

I'm with you. I'll never argue sims vs. Tom's real world testing. I'm sure whatever the specifics are, this sucker will be one awesome subwoofer.

 

[SVS-Ron]

I just spoke to Tom. He'll be along later. About 699 other things to take care of first, a typical day at SVS.

And as noted, if it's one thing we've learned over the last few years... it's the utility of, and great limitations of... simulations.

You can bet your bottom dollar on one other thing. Tom always conservatively states performance results on any design.

PS We have tremendous respect for all the discussion on the DIY forum. We have even more respect for calibrated professional mikes, RTA gear and lots of quasi-anechoic testing that can be repeated in classic peer review fasion. It's what the science of subwoofers is all about.

I can tell you even Tom is often suprised by results you could never anticipate with simulations. Only dozens of design variations under consistent test conditions let you wade thru fact from fiction, reality versus simulation. Fortunately we have shop crew with nothing better to do than whip up Tom's latest change. ;^)

Ron

 

[Edward J M]

The specs on the TC Sounds dB-12 driver are proprietary, AFAIK. I do know a great deal of R&D went into the motor design. It costs $275 through the SVS website and is only available to SVS customers.

FWIW, here are the specs on the new Stryke AV12 driver also made by TC Sounds. This driver retails for $175, and is currently being sold for $140 pre-order.

Granted, this is NOT an apples to apples comparison, but it might get you DIY design guys into the ball park for running some calcs.

Based on price point alone, it would be prudent to assume the SVS/TC dB-12 driver will outperform the Stryke/TC AV12 driver in at least some (if not several) of the key operating parameters.

Hope this helps rather than hinders.

Ed

AV12 T/S
Fs: 21Hz
Qms: 4.41
Qes: .399
Qts: .366
Vas: 88 L
Re: 2.97 ohm
Z: 4 ohm
BL: 15 Tm
Cms: .25 mm/N
Mms: 228 g
Pe: 500W
1W/1m: 85.5dB
2.83V: 89.5dB
Xmax: 23 mm
Xsus: 30 mm
Sd: 498 sq cm
Vd: 2.33 L

Retail $175
Preorder $140

 

[Geoff L]

Seth

I hang their all the time, just don't post much. Yes your correct in what you state, but as to SVS's newest design, I still stand behind what I said above.

The Laws of Physics are what they are as we know in Sub building.
But I'm not going to assume anything with this sub, ~{guessing, modeling stuff, & prior Sub design and build experiece, etc, certainly helps us to understand do's and dont's, of sub building.
But this SUB that we know nothing about aside from pic's and chit chat here and their at the many forums, I'm going to just leave alone till, as stated above the real deal comes to explin and data comes in!

We can only try to draw what we can from the pic's and what Ron posted. Guessing at anything is crazy as you know when building a sub (Real World) testing can sometimes be VERY different from something modeled when we "really have" ~{all the proper information to begin with}~, and of which we certainly don't in this case.

I'll just leave it at that.

Cheers
Geoff

 

[Johnny Mac]

For Ron/Tom

I was curious as to whether SVS would be selling a box sub utilizing the PCi guts in the near future? And if so, would you be making just the cabinets available for those of us who might be interested in that sort of thing?

 

[SVS-Ron]

Johnny,

Yes, the entry level box (to be called the PB1-ISD) will use PCi "guts" in a custom SVS designed mid-sized box.

No plans to release just the box at this moment but we're flexible if nothing else at SVS ;^)

This entry level box sub will be finely made in a new USA CNC shop we're working with, but it'll have a tough pebbled black finish vice wood like the costly B4-Plus.

Pics could be up in less than a week, still want to get pricing/availability sorted out before we are accused of hyping vaporware.

Ron

 

[Phil_DC]

I have stereo 350THX subs and they rock my whole house; I can’t imagine what two of those SVS’s with 5000watts each would be like but I sure would like to find out!

 

[Seth_L]

I can’t imagine what two of those SVS’s with 5000watts each would be like but I should would like to find out!

Add your local power company to the list of people who would like you to find out also
Seth