Aspect Ratio Documentation (2 Viewers)

[Doug Bull]

Thanks Bob.

I'm thrilled to think that I actually saw both "Young Bess" and "Escape From Fort Bravo" on MGM's giant PANORAMIC screen back in the 50s.
I still remember seeing the films, but sadly I don't remember what impact the Widescreen had on me at the time.

Here's a hard one: When did MGM adopt the MetroScope credit and what was the first title to use it?

 

[Douglas R]

Thanks Bob.

I'm thrilled to think that I actually saw both "Young Bess" and "Escape From Fort Bravo" on MGM's giant PANORAMIC screen back in the 50s.
I still remember seeing the films, but sadly I don't remember what impact the Widescreen had on me at the time.

This cutting is from Bob's website. I'd be extremely interested in seeing the widescreen version of YOUNG BESS if MGM did indeed recut and make alterations, instead of simply cropping the picture.

 

[Bob Furmanek]

Here's a hard one: When did MGM adopt the MetroScope credit and what was the first title to use it?

Doug: it was introduced in the UK circa January 1955. I would start from there and look at the new MGM releases in the UK to find the first one.

 

[DVDvision]

The "boxy is beautiful", alien beings from a dying planet. Their destination: regress to cathodic television days. Their purpose: to keep it their post 1953 movies world. Bob Furmanek has seen them. For him, it began one lost night in a lonely library, looking for a widescreen proof documentation that he found. It began with a zoomed in 4/3 transfer, and a man too long bothered by too much headroom to continue watching it in 1.33:1. It began with reading denials on a forum from another galaxy. Now Bob Furmanek knows that the "boxy is beautiful" martians are here, that they have taken human form. Somehow he must convince a disbelieving world that the nightmare has already begun.

 

[theonemacduff]

Wow. Somebody else besides me remembers the Roy Thinnes series, the architect who sees aliens. Love this.

 

[Gary16]

Wow. Somebody else besides me remembers the Roy Thinnes series, the architect who sees aliens. Love this.

One of my all-time favorite programs.

 

[seangood79]

So you refused to buy a movie you love because the studio decided to offer an alternative to viewers who may not have had widescreen tv's at the time.
That showed them then.
All that achieved was you missing out on a movie you love for several years.

I could accept that 4:3 versions were released on DVD, I could not accept that Disney would actually try to steer customers to purchase the version that had been altered from the original theatrical release by calling it "Family Friendly Full Frame". Didn't see why Disney needed my money, that was my choice, and didn't mind the wait for the Blu Ray.

As this documentation has apparently been around for more than 2 years we have to suspect that MGM , Hammer , Studio Canal , Network and others might have their own documentation relating to the product they own rather than some news reports from trade publications

The claim in Bobs posts say info was partly obtained by looking at studio archives - presumably not the archives of any of the aforementioned companies

I think one of the points of this thread is to show that studios don't have accurate information or choose not to pay attention. That some have listened to him and made changes to the planned aspect ratios says a lot about what studios know about their archives.

 

[Bob Furmanek]

The moderators have removed two groups of rambling postings from bluelaughaminute within the last few days.

 

[Douglas R]

TREAD SOFTLY STRANGER is a reasoably good 1958 British film produced by Renown Pictures, starring Diana Dors and George Baker. It's been released on DVD by VCI in the US and Odeon Entertainment in the UK; both being 1.33:1.

I came across a mention of it in a feature in Kinematograph Weekly, highlighting forthcoming productions, in which Renown state that it will be filmed in the Cinepanoramic process. So we can chalk up another one as being correctly either 1.66:1 or 1.75:1.

 

[Bob Furmanek]

That's very interesting, Doug.

Cinepanoramic was a French-designed anamorphic system similar to CinemaScope. It was first announced in July, 1953.

On August 24, 1955, Republic announced the system and on September 9, "The Maverick Queen" began shooting in the process. On November 16, 1955, Republic changed the name to Naturama.

 

[Gary16]

Anyone know why Fox continues to release many of their archive titles in full screen (4:3) only including scope movies in pan and scan? Recent titles include:Esther and the King (1960)Sodom and Gomorrah (1962)Tender is the Night (1962)April Love (1957)Etc.

 

[Bob Furmanek]

I don't have an answer to your question. Personally, I think releasing a 4x3 pan and scan copy of a 2.55:1 (or 2.35:1) film is ridiculous.

Yet some people feel that the studios know what they're doing and would never hire somebody who didn't have a complete understanding of their history.

Yeah, sure.

 

[Doug Bull]

Lost & Found:
Lost somewhere in rural Australia. The top of Mickey Rooney's Head.
Last seen in a film can at MGM's Film Exchange Sydney.
Reward for finder.
Contact Bob Furmanek.

Doug.

 

[lukejosephchung]

Bob, I just read on a Twilight Time Entertainment thread post by Nick Redmond that "April Love"(1957) just underwent a full restoration at Fox and is being tentatively scheduled for blu-ray release in OAR at TTE for 2015...

 

[Gary16]

Bob, I just read on a Twilight Time Entertainment thread post by Nick Redmond that "April Love"(1957) just underwent a full restoration at Fox and is being tentatively scheduled for blu-ray release in OAR at TTE for 2015...

And yet in the meantime they put it out on DVD pan and scan.

 

[Vahan_Nisanain]

And yet in the meantime they put it out on DVD pan and scan.

IMDB is correct on that film originally being in 2.35:1.

 

[FoxyMulder]

Bob, I just read on a Twilight Time Entertainment thread post by Nick Redmond that "April Love"(1957) just underwent a full restoration at Fox and is being tentatively scheduled for blu-ray release in OAR at TTE for 2015...

I wonder if they will get the colours correct on one of their catalog releases this time.

 

[Doug Bull]

I wonder if they will get the colours correct on one of their catalog releases this time.

 

[theonemacduff]

Anyone know why Fox continues to release many of their archive titles in full screen (4:3) only including scope movies in pan and scan? Recent titles include:Esther and the King (1960)Sodom and Gomorrah (1962)Tender is the Night (1962)April Love (1957)Etc.

Not sure about those titles in particular, but I have heard (i.e., read online, source and fount of all wisdom) that in some cases, studios simply grab an available master, and shovel it out the door. If said master was prepared for VHS, out it goes anyway, in all its cramped and stamped glory. Similarly, The Satan Bug was released, I think last year or the year before, on a DVD-R, and they used a master that had originally been prepped for laserdisc, with predictably horrid PQ.

 

[JoHud]

Not sure about those titles in particular, but I have heard (i.e., read online, source and fount of all wisdom) that in some cases, studios simply grab an available master, and shovel it out the door. If said master was prepared for VHS, out it goes anyway, in all its cramped and stamped glory. Similarly, The Satan Bug was released, I think last year or the year before, on a DVD-R, and they used a master that had originally been prepped for laserdisc, with predictably horrid PQ.

Fox's MOD program is the chief offender here. There is absolutely no consistency or quality control in their product, as if it's being run by Mr. Magoo. It's the only MOD line where they have the gall to sell pan & scan and non-anamorphic widescreen transfers, along with ancient transfers mixed in with some decent and excellent ones. Though the bad tends to far outweigh the good, especially in terms of CinemaScope films. It's like putting up with an abusive love/hate relationship with a deaf-mute considering the concerns poor presentation and sometimes outright vandalism of these film continue to go unheeded.

The now-defunct MGM MOD line had its share of problems with OAR with the lion's share of its mid to late '50s output being presented open-matte. Yet even that chintzy outfit (operating while MGM was functionally bankrupt) cared enough about the consumer to fix early letterboxed discs with anamorphic transfers and made sure not to release any film in a pan & scan transfer. Some of the newer Timeless Media DVDs that are licensing MGM titles are unfortunately continuing to circulate old transfers with either open-matte or letterboxed aspect ratios.

The other studio MODs (WB, Sony, Universal) are of a better pedigree since they go through the extra expense of creating new video masters and almost never release a film with the wrong OAR, and never P&S.

The Fox Cinema Archive on the other hand seems solely interested in spending as little money as possible on its MOD line, which despite its name, I would seriously question whether any one of its employees ever stepped foot into 20th Century Fox's film vaults and archives.