A Few Words About A few words about...™ The Searchers -- in High Defintion (3 Viewers)

[RickER]

I think its a damn fine movie and disc. Film changes with age, just like we do. I think Warner did a beautiful job. Looks 100 times better than the first DVD, or any TV viewing i have seen. So i guess strike one more from your EVERYBODY.

 

[Richard--W]

Many thanks for that useful link.
The HD DVD is a NO SALE for me.
Yes it is an impressive restoration, but the color-timing is so utterly misguided it distorts the natural color of Monument Valley and undermines the visual story John Ford is telling.

For all its flaws, the 1998 DVD is a more accurate representation of THE SEARCHERS.

 

[Cees Alons]

Interesting. Didn't even know that existed.

I myself have the 1997 version, which I found rather spectacular when I bought it (November 1997) and since, but in my opinion this HD DVD version is preferrable.

De gustibus....


Cees

 

[ppltd]

Without a doubt, IMHO, this is the finest version (both HD and BD) of "The Searchers" that has been released.

For what it is worth, this link is an interesting interview with Mr. Harris regarding "The Searchers". I do not believe it is posted anywhere else in this thread. Digital Bits Interview

 

[ppltd]

Not by a long shot.

 

[TonyD]

 

[Richard--W]

Yes, I've read it, and my response is here:

http://www.hometheaterforum.com/htf/...d.php?t=235246

Please understand that Monument Valley is red. The sand is red, the dirt is red, the rock is red, the plateaus are red. In fact, Monument Valley has been red for millions of years. It was red when John Ford filmed THE SEARCHERS, and it's red today. It's been red in hundreds of films and programs shot there. In this new restoration, Ned Price undoes what it took millions of years of evolution to achieve: he changes the natural ruddiness of Monument Valley to mustard, yellow, orange and puece. He takes the red out.

I think we can all agree that THE SEARCHERS represents John Ford and Winton C. Hoch at their height of their creative and artistic powers. When they composed shots of the landscape in Monument Valley, they were looking at red, and they intended for red landscapes to be in the film. John Ford shot in Monument Valley for a reason, and it is safe for us to assume that the natural ruddy color is part of his reason. But Ned Price changes the natural ruddy color of Monument Valley to mustard, yellow, orange and puece. He takes the red out. This is not what John Ford and Winton C. Hoch intended.

The restoration is commendable in many ways, but this personal, whimsical, and arrogant corruption of John Ford's color pallet is too radical, too grievous, and too injurious to the film for me to accept. It is also unnecessary. There is no reason in that interview to take the red out. This is THE SEARCHERS after all, and it should be respected.

 

[Cees Alons]

So you finally rented the HD DVD?
Or are you saying this based on hear-say, and perhaps an isolated screen capture?


Cees

 

[Richard--W]

No, I watched it at Circuit City. Used the remote and skipped around, but I watched it.

It isn't worth renting.

 

[DavidJ]

I haven't jumped in to this discussion because there are many others that know far more about this film and its issues than I do, but I would like to point out that trying to judge a transfer at Circuit City on a display that has been adjusted for their selling environment is folly. All the displays that I have ever seen at CE stores like CC have their colors jacked and their brightness and contrast nearly maxed out. Hardly ideal settings for trying to judge the finer points of a transfer.

 

[Richard--W]

That's quite true, but I handled the remotes and made my own adjustment. It's no big deal. It was more than sufficient to judge.

I strongly recommend that consumers steer clear of the HD DVD of THE SEARCHERS. Don't waste your money.

 

[TonyD]

i'm very happy to have it.

it is a great movie.
colors might be off but this might be the best way to ever watch this movie at home.

i won't tell anyone not to buy it.

 

[Richard--W]

They ruined it.

Don't buy it.

 

[TravisR]

Ugh.

 

[DaViD Boulet]

Richard,

lighten up man! When you say "they ruined it" you imply that they actively did something to distort the colors.

What if, as RAH as implied, the best possible film source material had aged and now the BD/HD DVD reflects this? In that case "they" didn't ruin anything... time did. Could they have spent untold sums to shift the color balance (via analog or digital means)? Perpahs. But in this case it's still not a matter of intentional color-vandalism as you so strongly imply.

While we all may disagree with video presenations of films for a variety of reasons, and it's good to express those views as they help guide the studios to continually improve their work, it sounds uninformed to those who are familiar with the restoration-ethics of these very fine technicians to broad-brush a studio's efforts in such a dismissive way.

 

[ppltd]

Well spoken, David.

 

[Dave Mack]

Just watched this last week. Looked amazing.

 

[Douglas Monce]

Did you have a calibration disc with you as well as the colored filters necessary to accurately adjust the color levels? If not then making your own adjustments probably won't give you a very accurate picture as it can be effected by the light levels in the store, the color temp of those lights, the color of the carpet and other surroundings...etc.

BTW have you ever been to Monument Valley? The dirt and rocks are really kind of a rust color. Reddish brown more than red. Regardless I'm not sure it was Ford's intention to accurately reproduce the colors of Monument Valley, but rather to have colors that would help get a particular emotional response from the audience. Does this new HD DVD look exactly like the Technicolor prints from the 50s? Probably not, but it's most likely as close as we can get given the problems associated with the original materials.

Doug

 

[ppltd]

Doug, I couldn't agree more. Living only a few hours from Monument Valley we make an (almost) yearly trek to the deserts around Monument Valley and the Painted Desert just to enjoy a few days of hiking and the beauty of the surrounding. The main color of the area is a rust reddish brown with tinges of yellow and green. Also areas of purple can be seen. this is certainly not the red that can be seen in cliffs and mountains of Sedona or Oak Creek Canyon.

For those that love movies it would be criminal to miss out on this fine release (either BD or HD) do to perceptions, either right or wrong, that the color might be slightly off. What a shame to have the pleasure of watching the movie effected by this 'minor' issue.

 

[Richard--W]

Forgive me, but I'm not the one who needs to be reminded of ethics because I'm not the one who over-saturated THE SEARCHERS with yellow and deliberately drained the red out. WHV, and Ned Price specifically, are well-informed, yet they have broadbrushed John Ford's efforts in a dismissive way. Ford worked with a certain set of tools in 1955/6. WHV's obligation, to the film makers, to the work of art itself, and to the consumer public, is to preserve that vision from 1955/6 in the way that it was understood in 1955/6. To impose a current and arbitrary sensibility just because you like it better is indeed unethical.