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- Robert Harris
The Blu could have had a great deal more information.
This is what I've found in most reviews. Now, I'll have to wait to see it for myself, but as I have never seen it in the theatre (the best version of it I've seen is the first SD DVD release), I suspect I will be quite happy with it.Robert Harris said:, and will not be incorrect. If you don't know that something is missing...
The technical reason is temporal filtering with correct motion estimation. There might be other ingredients in the sauce. But getting the motion estimation right is key.Robert Harris said:Lowry has a proprietary system. Where their processing can take many seconds per frame, others can move frames through at much higher speeds.
Both remove grain, as can numerous other software packages, but only Lowry can reduce the grain while losing nothing of the image. I've seen their system in action, and find it amazing.
That's one part. The other is budget. Are you willing to pay for an auto pilot run only or for hand tuned and human supervised processing? The latter costs more.Stephen_J_H said:To be fair, the algorithm used in Citizen Kane was an early version. One would hope the technology has improved in 8 years.
I don't understand your point here.Robert Harris said:1. This cannot be seen in screen grabs.
RAH
Project it large and you see the missing detail if you are familiar with really detailed 1080p material.Ken Koc said:I must have my 60" HD Sony Wega on some sort of a different setting. I had a showing last night with some of my friends who also love Patton. We were all blown away by the detail....in the pores of Scotts face ( too much of his heavily made up eyebrows)....to the detail of the ruins of Carthage....to the intricate detail of the ceiling in Patton's room in the last scene before intermission.
There is no home format that can display a 4:4:4 color space, so where would DVD Beaver get screen captures at that level?Michel_Hafner said:I don't understand your point here.
If the screen grab is 1:1 1080p and looked at in full resolution from a monitor or projector the lack of HF detail can certainly be seen. The Beaver shots are essentially SD and useless for examining fine detail on the HD (they show the difference between DVD 4:2:0 and SD 4:4:4).
Are you talking about dynamic versus static aspects of perceived detail?
I think this is part of Mr. Harris' point. It looks good, but it could look better. Or more to the point it could look more like the film that was projected in theaters.Keith Paynter said:. I watched my 2006 version of TLD on my PC and almost and felt I needed new glasses, it is so soft on my DVI display. All my BD's look amazing, so I look forward to these releases.
I'm still not sure what you mean. The stills as on the disc (the film after decompression is nothing else but a series of stills played at 24fps) are not different from what you see when you play the disc at regular speed. 1080p stills direct from the disc are used all the time to analyse static aspects of the images including sharpening, detail, DNR, colors, contrast.... Even if they are (moderately) JPEG compressed (when they are put on the net for downloading) you see pretty much all you can see from single frames. Played at 24fps you get a somewhat different impression since the HVS integrates over time. For example the grain may really stand out on a single frame while at 24fps it looks less grainy. But how stills do not show lack of detail while playing them at 24 fps shows it, I do not understand. It is not the case in my experience. If the stills show superior detail then film shows it and vice versa.Robert Harris said:Michel,
Yes, very difficult to discern as a still image, which does not contain all information anyway.
We are talking abou the detail on the BD disc which is 1080p 4:2:0. This detail you can judge playing the film at >= 24 fps or looking at single stills (either by pausing the disc or extracting the stills with software direct digital with 1:1 pixel mapping, which is done all the time to judge what is actually on the disc). It's not a 4:4:4 issue. We don't compare the BD to the DI here.Douglas Monce said:There is no home format that can display a 4:4:4 color space, so where would DVD Beaver get screen captures at that level?
Doug
You may laugh, but I recently had to "erase" some pockmarks on an actor in one brief shot of a sequence in an HD project. Using Apple's Shake and some of its rather good filters, my first pass looked quite acceptable - even stepping thru the frames of the short shot. All other detail looked intact. Stills from the "fix," which I emailed to the clients as an example of how it was going (BIG mistake) - looked fabulous. However, when run at normal speed, things looked...wrong. Detail, which was present in the stills, appeared smeared in motion. The eye senses something is not quite right, because the filter(s) are moving things around, frame by frame. It's as if you put a dot that's under the threshold of the filter on one part of the screen, and when you step frame by frame, you still see the dot, but when run at full speed, that dot slightly shifts around the frame and appears indistinct as the filter erases the bigger stuff around it while nudging the dot around in the process. But it's rock solid in the stills, I sayMichel_Hafner said:I'm still not sure what you mean. The stills as on the disc (the film after decompression is nothing else but a series of stills played at 24fps) are not different from what you see when you play the disc at regular speed. 1080p stills direct from the disc are used all the time to analyse static aspects of the images including sharpening, detail, DNR, colors, contrast.... Even if they are (moderately) JPEG compressed (when they are put on the net for downloading) you see pretty much all you can see from single frames. Played at 24fps you get a somewhat different impression since the HVS integrates over time. For example the grain may really stand out on a single frame while at 24fps it looks less grainy. But how stills do not show lack of detail while playing them at 24 fps shows it, I do not understand. It is not the case in my experience. If the stills show superior detail then film shows it and vice versa.
So I was asking where they would get an SD version that was 4:4:4.Michel_Hafner said:Quote:
The problem is the situation is a Catch 22.Paul Hillenbrand said::frowning:
I've decided to vote NO with my wallet on this one.
Paul