$600 Subwoofer Shoot-Out: SVS PB1-ISD vs. Hsu STF-3 – Test & Review (1 Viewer)

[steve nn]

(stevenm pointed that out) You just cant help it can you SnottCar? Clever guy you.

What are you going to do with the subs now?

I get the ISD unless Ed says no???

 

[Craig Chase]

Shane, Speaking of ol' Marko... I may try something new... agreeing with everything he says...

Do you remember the old Sci-Fi (I think it was an old Star Trek) ... where they defeated an all powerful computer by asking it what ONE divided by ZERO was ? ... and the computer kept repeating "does not compute" ... and finally exploded ?

I am pretty sure that, if either Ed or I ( or both ? ) posted "Marko, we agree 100 %" ... he would have the same reaction...

ok... This is Ed's thread... :b ... back on topic...

 

[ScottCarr]

Both reviews have been on the boxed subs.

Ed and Craig do you have any plans do visit the cylinder lines?

 

[Craig Chase]

Scott, If we tell you that, we have to kill you...

 

[Wayne Ernst]

Hmm ... how about adding the Outlaw LFM-1 into the mix?

Outlaw

Very nice work, Ed. Great job on putting together such a great review.

 

[Bhagi Katbamna]

Wow, great review. I wish SGHT and the other so-called, "professional" magazines would do reviews that were this thorough on the mega-buck equipment that they review.

 

[Lewis Besze]

Thanks Ed,great review!
Other sites could use your expertise and style as well,or at leasr learn from you.
Couldn't agree more,don't be surprised if you get calls from from some online magazines to "contribute" in the future.

 

[ScottCarr]

Craig

Well then I guess you can use my PC Ultras for the test
so will you tell me now. plez pretty plez

 

[CurtisSC]

And how about other brands such as Craig is doing?

 

[ChrisWiggles]

speechless.

awesome review!

 

[Richard_M]

Ed fantastic review..

The whole detail from start to finish was brilliant, and meant that all questions were answered, as can be told by the responses.

I realise these tests are very time consuming, but I do appreciate you taking the time and writing the great review.

 

[Edward J M]

Well, we tried to pick the two names that were most popular (and that should in no way be construed as a dig against any other competitive and similarly priced internet subs). And we tried to pick the two models that stacked up the closest in price and features. In this manner, we hoped to please the largest number of people potentially looking at the $600 class. I think Craig has a bit more gumption than me testing the UFW-10 and the Dharman, and an SVS-PB1-ISD and an Hsu VTF-3 MKII all at the same time. I'll tell ya guys, it was fun, but it was a real bear time-wise. I'm taking a break for a while and then I'm setting my sights on that PB2-Ultra sitting in the corner.

Ed

 

[Craig Chase]

To give all a feel for how we are appraching Ed's review, in our shootout on the Home Theater SPot, we now have a link to Ed's review on the $600 shootout posted there...

Our next $600 shootout starts this week, and includes a Rocket UFW-10 ...

 

[Edward J M]

Craig....in case you missed this; any interest here? I know Hsu was discussing sending you an STF-3 and you really wanted a PB1-ISD all along. In the interest of promoting your $600 shoot-out and getting a second opinion, do you want to work something out? If yes, PM me offline and we can discuss further. Otherwise they will be finding homes locally.

Ed

 

[Craig Chase]

Ed, You deserve a break... hope you don't mind us linking to your review...

I would like your thoughts on measuring max spl's using audible distortion as a barometer... rather than what the LEAP software can measure... Our reasoning was actually started by the Denali.... it bottoms the PR's before even 5% distortion is measured... but it sure is audible...

of course, having a 40 foot long, concrete room, with no audible resonances allows for easy pin-pointing of audible distortion.... and living on 3 acres makes for no neighbor problems...

finally... again, great job, and you now have new friends on Home Theater SPot, it along with HTF...two great forums !!!

 

[Edward J M]

Thanks everyone for the kind words; it is very humbling. Many of you (like Steve nn and others) have been supportive and helpful.

This forum is what we make of it. I strongly believe in the concept of internet based forums; it brings so many enthusiasts together in ways never conceived of even 10 short years ago. I've said all along, we owe it to each other to give something back in return; hence this review and also Craig's incredible work over at AVS and now HT-SPOT.

 

[Craig Chase]

Ed - No need even for a PM... The results you got are so close to what we saw in the pb2+ vs. VTF-3/2 test, and your results are so well written, what I would do would look like a re-write...find both subs a good home...

By the way... We have done some re-measuring in a room with a lot less gain than the original... and, for example, the VTF-3 achieved 97 db (instead of 104), and the PB2+ 109 db (down from 114 db) at 16 Hz/one meter... If you do the math, the pb1-isd should be 8-9 db below the pb2+ ... so about 100 - 101 db for the pb1.. I think you saw 105 db at 18 Hz...

Nice consistency in these products...

look forward to the ultra info !

 

[CurtisSC]

Outlaw LFM-1 and STF-3:



All I know about the LFM-1 is the same that has been posted in other places, that Dr. Hsu helped to design it, but the design considerations were Outlaw's. I suspect the amp and driver are very similar if not the same.

Edward...thanks for taking the time to do this stuff. Just listening to speakers takes a lot of time...but subwoofers is a whole different ball of wax. How much time do you think you spent on the whole thing?

 

[Edward J M]

Thanks, Craig. A good home they will find!

Your findings (again) illustrate how easily THD-limited output can vary depending on method, room size/location, etc.

I didn't post any 18 Hz data, but I do have it on file. 18 Hz was simply too far below the tune point of the STF-3 to be a valid test frequency, and its 10% THD limited output at 18 Hz was extremely limited. The PB1-ISD faired considerably better at 18 Hz, but overall, testing these particular subs at 18 Hz is not representative of the intended product application, and 20 Hz was deemed sufficient.

The VTF-3 you own OTOH, is a different story, and 18 Hz is definitely an appropriate test frequency for that model in the ME mode.

Ed

 

[Edward J M]

Thanks for that insight on the LFM-1, Curtis. If it is indeed a legitimate derivative of the STF-3, I suppose the test results in this report would be representative, but I certainly wouldn't go out on a limb and state that as fact until it was confirmed by Outlaw and Hsu.

If I had to guesstimate (and Craig can probably corroborate this from his own work), I've got at least 70 hours into this review/shoot-out, all told.