Donnie Darko...a very strange movie - Page 8

As for honking the horn, why couldn't that be manipulated dead Frank doing it. As a manipulated dead character he was able to control space/time beyond the level that Donnie even could.

So perhaps he reached over from the tangent universe to signal to Donnie in the primary universe just as the tangent universe was ending.


BTW, I didn't get that it was a full-on tangent universe, just that there was some splintering of the timeline based around the point where he was killed. The book then told me that the split was before he was killed and a 2ndary universe created in existence.

Of course this splinter branches off and then only continues for a limited amount of time. Whether or not it's demise also results in the end of the primary universe is up to Donnie.

Noah and Drew DO UNDERSTAND that Donnie is this chosen one that must return the engine to the primary universe, but they have no powers other than this understanding. They are trying to guide him, but they have no powers, just a knowledge. Other people do as well, such as the psychiatrist.

Drew, Noah and the shrink helped my first time grasping quite a bit.


BTW, when I mentioned the crosspoint (like when Frank honks the horn) what is to say that the linking of the 2 universes is not longer than just an instant. Perhaps the vortex opens say 5 minutes before Donnie is killed and continues to stay open till around the time the engine hits. Thus that would be the time that dead Frank would be able to reach across like he possibly does.

Do you think Donnie's mother and sister will still be on that plane a month later? If Donnie dies and never sets fire to Swayze's house, then the kiddie porn dungeon won't be found and the dance team coach will still accompany the team to Star Search. I've been able to come to grip with almost all of Donnie Darko, but this engine thing still makes my brain hurt.

I think the engine off that specific plane will still crash into Donnie, but his Mother and sister just won't be on it.

I think the engine is used to create a paradox. A remnant from a time that never took place, but actually did, if you get my meaning. Used to bridge the point where an alternate universe was made to set Donnie on the path to correct his mistakes.

Brian,

If I'm getting your meaning, you are saying "No" which I agree with. That engine is an "artifact" from a time that now no longer exists, which is why, as described in the supplements, there is so much mystery surrounding it. There is never any explanation of where it came from. The engine did its job, so there is no longer any real need for it to fall off an airplane in the current timeline. Donnie's mother and sister may still go on that flight, but nothing out of the ordinary will happen.

I have not dug into the supplements much, because to me that disrupts the illusion of the film. But in the little I have seen, there was a newspaper article from (I think) three years later saying the source of the engine had never been found and that the mystery would probably never be solved.

You may be right and the engine is not needed, the statement I made is only my interpetation of what happened (one of the great things about this film). I just think it's more interesting an idea to have this mysterious engine part be a constant reminder of some alternate event which took place, even if it's not remembered by the people involved.

Strange, definitely. I'm surprised how many people apparently like this movie.

The website implies that they DO id the engine and match it to the one that is still on the plane. Of course it also implies that this is covered up (for obvious reasons).


As for the porn stuff, there is some reason to believe that the nightmare will haunt Swayze and make him either stop or confess. So there is still the possiblity that Donnie's mom might be on that flight.

But I do think the engine is supposed to come from that plane. I think the real world and alternate world engines simply swap places, but both come from a month later than they actually hit.

Certainly room for interpretation of course.

I really just enjoy the tone of the whole film, not it's foolproof logic. I simply don't think it's flawed to any great degree worth noting or complaining about.

well no one has posted to this in a while. but i just got around to watching it.

the thing with the horn honk seemed to be to me that it was donnie's sister's boyfriend who had just dropped her off and honked to say i'll see ya later. this was doen both times in the movie but it seemed louder the second time. it may not have been louder but it seemed it was to me.

i enjoyed the movie and want to ssee it again but i also thought the ending was very confusing. i didnt get it. as were other parts of the movie.

i may have to buy it to go threw all the suplements that are included on the dvd. sounds like alot of interesting things there.

Sorry for commenting so late, but I finally got to rent DD last night. This forum is great: the movie makes a lot more sense now.

One question (and since no one has asked it, please forgive me if I missed something obvious): Why were the two "psycho" students from the school waiting for Donnie, Gretchen, and his friends in Grandma Death's cellar?

My wife asked me this while we watched, and I have no idea...

Thos.

The old woman's house contained a lot of valubale items as explained at the dinner table when the Darko's talk about many people breaking into her house through the years. The boys were in there stealing things when they ran into Darko & co.

Also, on the commentary it is said that in myths, treasure caves and such always have a monster or beast to fight. The filmmaker simply wanted to use that precept.

************Spoilers A'Comin'!****************************

I just watched this last night, and my impression is that Donnie is somewhat "Christ-like". One big clue is that the 2nd movie listed on the maruqee at the theater is "Last Temptation of Christ". Like Christ on the cross in that movie, he is being "shown" an alternate future if he lives through the engine crash, and he sees that if he lives then Gretchen will die. Now, it could also be explained that he is actually able to time travel back to the point where he was in bed after seeing that if he dies then Gretchen would never meet him and live. Now, how the Patrick Swayze pedophile not being caught is a good thing eludes me. Maybe the point is that you take the bad with the good when you change the future? In any case, it seems to me that Donnie sacrafices himself for Gretchen.

If all this has been said before, I'm sorry. I didn't feel like reading all 8 pages.

I've just recently watched DD for the first time and I have to agree with most of the messages in this thread : it's a damn good movie.

I don't want to "over-analyse" things, but there are still some things about DD that I would like to hear your opinion about :

- who wrote the list of names on the Notes page in the Time Travel book ? IMO, I can't have been Donnie, as it mentions the date JC died, which is something Donnie couldn't have known. Drew ? Noah ?

- there's something about the notepad (or how do you call this thing) on the door of the fridge. It pops up three times : at the beginning of the movie, when Donnie gets home in the morning; at night, when he is called by Frank (why does he take the marker with him ?); and during the Halloween party, showing a note written by Frank.

- When Donnie is up in the mountains, just before sending the engine back to the PU, he is repeating the amount of time left, as told by Frank on October 2nd. You hear both his voice and Frank's voice, with his voice taking over near the end. However, when he says I'm going home, we can only see Donnie's back. I've listened to it a couple of times, and it's not clear to me if it's Frank or Donnie saying this.

Intriguing movie ...

Hooray for threads brought back from purgatory. I saw this on display at the local video rental...given the passion exhibited in this thread, I'll give this one a try.

Well the Sparrows book also says that many people will fear the Chosen One and want to attack him, which explained the running hostility from Mr. Phantom Planet including the final attack.

I thought Sparrow had scibbled names down in the notes section as they came to hear in dreams or something. At least that's how I looked at it. Didn't really check the handwriting to see if it matched.

Peter....Go for it. This is my favorite film of 2001, though it is in a virtual tie with The Man Who Wasn't There, both which are head and shoulders above everything else. If it isn't too late, try to read as little about as possible before seeing it. it will be much better if you go in "blind."



Whoa Seth! Who is "Mr. Phantom Planet?" I haven't watched it in a while. In fact, I gave away my copy and haven't replaced it yet, but that doesn't ring a bell.

Yeah...just who is Mr. Phantom Planet?

Bruce

I just saw this movie last night, so I'm coming to the party late. I loved this movie, but I'm still trying to process it. So many themes and so much going on, my thought of the movie aren't very coherent at the moment but I'll write them down as they come, in no particular order.
(I apologize if some of my interpretations have already been made, this thread is a bit long and I haven't read through it's entirety yet. I also haven't listened to the director commentary.)



Edit: Not sure is this is an "Official" discussion thread, but in case it's not, **** Spoilers ahead ****



I've always loved stories about time travel, but they always pose a paradox. The engine that falls on Donnie's house is sent back in time by Donnie. But if it kills him, the he won't be there in the future to send it back. But it seems this movie is not just straight forward time travel (if there is such a thing), but an alternate timeline or divergent universe. At the point where Donnie sleep walks, and is not killed by the engine a divergent timeline is created. One that shouldn't exist and Frank is there to guide Donnie down a path that will restore the correct timeline.

The reference to the "Last Temptation of Christ" I think is more than just Donnie being a Christ figure. I think the "Evil Dead" and "Last Temptation of Christ" are shown as two extremes to parallel the "Fear--------Love" theme.

Did any notice in the beginning of the movie, after Donnie wakes up and rides his bike home, Frank's car passes him by. Maybe meant as some foreshadowing of how their paths will later intersect?

Man, my head is still spinning. I have to watch it again tonight before I return it. I will definitely be buying this one.

Vlad,

I had noticed Frank's car, but there is a bit more to it. You may or may not want to read this.

Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)

John,

Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)

I'll check out that scene again.

Alex Greenwald plays Seth in the film and is the lead singer for the band Phantom Planet. He was also seen in some of those Gap commercials where people were singing to songs (like "I just can't get enough")

Ok, it was bugging me so I had to look it up. Donnie (played by Jake Gyllenhaal)was in October Sky. I knew he looked familiar but I couldn't place him. Another interesting side note, Donnie sister was played by Jake's real life sister Maggie Gyllenhaal.

Seth,

Thanks for the clarification. BTW, I always get a kick out of the fact that the primo dirtball in the film is named Seth!


Vlad,

That's right. They are real brother and sister. I have to say, she looked mighty fine in the witch outfit as well. She has a new, very dark film out called Secretary. I've heard radically mixed reactions to it. Jake was also the title character in the severely and unfairly maligned Bubble Boy. It was a victim of our out of control Politically Correct society. It is actually one of the funniest films I have seen in quite a while. He is also in a new film with Jennifer Aniston, which is supposed to be quite good.

On the previous topic....
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)

John,

Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)

I haven't seen Bubble Boy, but I think I'll have to check it out. If you haven't seen October Sky, you should also see it when you get a chance. Jake delivers a really fine performance.

I have seen October Sky and it was good. I'm not going to guarantee you will like Bubble Boy. It's not for everyone.

I brought this thread back yet again from the dead. I've finally watched my DVD of the film and the commentary (I'm really behind in my DVD viewing)and it is definitely one of my favorite films of the past year. It's thought-provoking, ambitious and screams out to be watched a multiple of times (my favorite kind of film).


SPOILERS
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At first I thought the film was a reverse "It's a Wonderful Life". But after listening to the commentary, it's clear that is not the case. I understand everything about the reason Donnie was chosen to perform this task, how he does it and the people who help & guide him, however I'm still a little confused about the following:

What causes the alternate time-line? At first I thought it was Donnie not dying that caused it, but on re-watching and listening to the commentary, I see that I was wrong. Frank (the bunny) wakes him up before the engine hits and at the end, Frank honks his horn to wake him up & signal that everything is okay (the time-line seems to start at 12 o'clock).

Did Donnie have to die at the end, since his death does not cause the alternate time-line?

Sorry for arriving so late on the scene for this marvelous film.

This film is best enjoyed if you can accept that the director may have gotten carried away with his own ideas.

Riveting
A joy to watch
Better than 99% of stuff that came out in the last 2 years
Greatly acted
Greatly directed

Just don't waste to much time trying to make sense of it. Well that's my advice. Coming to grips with this allowed me to respect myself - after buying the DVD - knowing the problems with the flick.

I disagree that one can't make sense of the film. My feeling is that Donnie didn't fit, not just in school but in that world. He was a tormented soul and, after having completed his task, he was allowed to leave.

Jay, based on the time travel book written by the old lady it appears that no definate explanation of WHY these rifts originally occur, only that someone will be chosen to close them.

So something unknown within the film world causes the split and Donnie must fix it. The split occurs just a bit before Donnie is killed. Therefore, the act of fixing the split becomes Donnie's suicide...though of course the book also tells us that if he doesn't fix it then both universes will be totally destroyed.


Now why doesn't he get back up once he fixes things? Well, I took it to be that at the end he was his "other" self (not the one in the split universe) and only had that dreaming awareness (like the others did) of this alternate reality. Like he sort of realizes what his fate is but that he also has done a good thing, etc.

That's a rather convenient shot in the dark.

Quite simply, I think if Donnie got back up, it just wouldn't have been as good a story. I think the writer intended Donnie's death to be significant to the film (notion of sacrifice to save the world, etc), but somehow he got lost in the whole thing.

Bryant,

Why is it that you always seem to pop up to knock this movie?

Yes, I know you qualify your statements with how much you love it, but in the end, it all comes back to how you think it's "rubbish storytelling"(from one of your fist posts earlier in the thread).

It just feels to me like you're trying to kill the discussion. I am happy to entertain the notion that the film makes no sense but rather than throwing around easy to make statements, why not bring up specific points in the film so we can discuss them. Isn't that the point of this thread and board after all?

Sorry to sidetrack. Back to the film!