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Speculation on 'Contact' - Design Impact of Chair

post #1 of 104
8/21/01 at 3:37pm
Thread Starter 
This thread concerns the film, 'Contact' and the scene where the Jodie Foster character, Ellie Hathaway, argues vociferously for the removal of the chair that the engineers who have constructed the Machine have included, violating the original design schematics.

She argues that they should trust the original "blueprints" and not include any supplemental features. Well, during her travels through the wormhole, we see her getting tossed around violently and with extreme force, even seeing the space she occupies become distorted across some sort of time continuum. When she detaches herself to retrieve the compass given to her by Palmer, the chair is violently retracted toward the ceiling of the pod.

I have always wondered what would have happened to her had her character prevailed in eliminating the chair. Would her body have imploded? Would she have been tossed around like a rag doll?

What are the thoughts of the HTF?

-Hector


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[Edited last by Hector X. Cruz on August 21, 2001 at 05:50 PM]
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post #2 of 104
8/21/01 at 3:47pm

Spoilers ahead...

When she got up out of the chair, she was floating, as if weightless. The stress being put on the chair, causing it to wobble violently and detach, was coming from the bottom of the transporter.

I suspect that she would have just floated around in the middle of the transporter, not bothered by the intense vibrations of the transporter's shell. In fact, when the chair gets flung against the wall, she's unharmed because she's floating inside the transporter. Had she been in the chair, she would have been flung against the wall, and quite possibly injured.

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- - -- - -
Colin Dunn
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post #3 of 104
8/21/01 at 3:51pm
Thread Starter 

That's an interesting speculation, Colin. I hadn't considered that the violence in the transporter was DUE to the inclusion of the chair.

But it is true that she was floating gingerly in the center of the pod, even with the chair vibrating.

Any other thoughts?

-Hector


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post #4 of 104
8/21/01 at 5:42pm
I agree with Colin, the chair was somehow amplifying the vibrations; without it, she would have been probably suspended or otherwise weightless.

cheers!

Josh
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post #5 of 104
8/21/01 at 5:50pm
CONTACT II: JODIE'S IMPLOSION.


Can't wait...
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post #6 of 104
8/21/01 at 8:19pm
Quote:
I suspect that she would have just floated around in the middle of the transporter

this is exactly what I thought the first time I saw the movie.

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Rich

"A) You can never go too far and B) If I'm going to get busted it is NOT going to be by a guy like DAT."
My Website

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post #7 of 104
8/22/01 at 1:51am
Had she stayed in the chair, she would most certainly have been seriously injured, or even killed. That was the whole point of showing her compass floating gently in front of her while she's being violently shaken. That's when she realizes why the aliens had no chair in their plans.
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post #8 of 104
8/22/01 at 6:00am
The stupid thing that has always bothered be is:
Spoiler:
why did the chair bang against the side of the pod when it disconnected? Wouldn't it just float like Jodie if it was disconnected from the pod?
It makes no sense and pulls me out of the movie every time I see it.

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-JQJ
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post #9 of 104
8/22/01 at 6:11am
This is interesting. I’m glad you mentioned it. I don’t remember when but long ago I posted a similar topic about this. I mentioned that not many viewers might get that the violent vibration was because of the chair in it contrary to the design and that she was saved by the compass. I think the meaning of the compass is important here.

[Edited last by Sam Davatchi on August 22, 2001 at 08:14 AM]
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post #10 of 104
8/22/01 at 7:15am
James,

I always thought it was because of the tremendous magnetic field created by the machine. Remember when the battleship actually lurched towards the machine because of the intense magnetic pull?

I assumed that the chair, not supposed to be there, was pulled into the wall of the transport by the magnetic field. Ellie was saved because she noticed the compass (it may save your life one day) floating in front of her calmly.



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Ric Perrott
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post #11 of 104
8/22/01 at 4:50pm
Good stuff here!

I never really thought about that particular sequence, and Colin's and others comments make sense.

Now I have to re-watch Contact to re-consider pod segment.
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post #12 of 104
8/22/01 at 5:53pm
What happened to the chair once the sphere stopped? I'm thinking of the sequence where she is on the beach talking with her dad. I mean, was she still inside the sphere at that moment? With the way the air rippled when she tried to touch it gave me the impression that she was still inside the sphere but it was completely transparent. If that is the case, where did the chair go? It couldn't have become invisible because it wasn't part of the original sphere design-just like Ellie. That's what's bugged me most about that sequence. Was she still in the sphere or inside some other type of transport that took her to the beach world?

Bruce

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Welcome aboard the Satellite of Love
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post #13 of 104
8/22/01 at 8:43pm
i remember thinking that the chair was not supposed to be there and that was what caused all vibrations in the pod.
and i thought the ship lurching was caused by the wave created by the spinning of the machine.

as soon as the chair popped of its base the vibrations stopped didnt they.

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"who needs padding when you can have quality over quantity? more isn't always better." just my 2 cents on post count padders.-----
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post #14 of 104
8/23/01 at 8:57am
Bruce:

I had assumed that everything she saw on the beach, including her father and...the beach, were communicated directly to her mind.

Whatever the case, if they were technologically advanced enough to greet her as her father, pet-names and all, then I wouldn't put it past them to make a chair unnoticable for a few minutes.

-Dave
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post #15 of 104
8/23/01 at 9:04am
It was fairly obvious to me that the vibrations were caused by the chair, and she would have been better off without it. The whole point of the scene, IMO, was to show that the intelligence of the aliens was far more evolved than that of earth's scientists, and that we should trust them more.

And yes, I too believe that the chair was flung to the wall because of the magnetism.

/Mike
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post #16 of 104
8/23/01 at 9:13am
I hate to nitpick one of my favorite films, but what to compasses measure? Yep, magnetic fields. So why if its a magnetic field that flings the chair against the ceiling does the thing just float along without a care in the world?
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post #17 of 104
8/23/01 at 9:13am
Thread Starter 

The entire sequence on the beach is debatable. The key to whether or not it actually took place is in the fact that her recording mechanism captured 18 hours of static, as stated by Angela Basset's character.

Given that it did take place, and that the scenario was constructed for her by the aliens, pet names and all, then I think it is fair to say that they were technologically advanced enough to obscure the chair momentarily.

The inclusion of the chair, it seems, violated the design principles of the craft, and caused these shifts in space-time continuums.

Another topic altogether is why an alien species would go to such lengths to merely make contact for the purposes of creating mental scenarios specific to only the passenger of the pod. I would think that with their sophistication, they would want to send along a civilization-spanning message.

But that is another thread, now isn't it?

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post #18 of 104
8/23/01 at 10:52am
Good topic for discussion here. I always thought that the chair was always shaking so violently, and eventually being detached, because it was not part of the design. I agree with the thoughts that she would have just floated in the middle of the pod through the whole trip. The violent shaking of the pod was transferred through the hull and up the chair into Elly's body. The part where the chair totally rips off and gets thrown into the wall confirms that it wasn't supposed to be there in the first place. I think that if Elly didn't unloose herself towards the end, she would of been very seriously hurt or even killed. *and doh! that would reck the movie!*

The whole beach scene... I know the aliens "downloaded" her thoughts and memories, but I think the conversation took place in a room outside the pod. You'll remember that she was able to touch the sides of this high-tech, virtual reality-type, 3D cube. I don't think that would have happened if she would have had the whole experience transferred into her brain by the aliens.

I read the book a while back, but I don't recall it saying anything specific about the chair's ultimate fate.

Have fun!
Ace
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post #19 of 104
8/23/01 at 11:06am
Another topic altogether is why an alien species would go to such lengths to merely make contact for the purposes of creating mental scenarios specific to only the passenger of the pod. I would think that with their sophistication, they would want to send along a civilization-spanning message.

In the book they did. The goal was to get humanity to learn how to read God's messages to us.

For those of you who haven't read the book, you should. The movie changes the whole tone of the original work.
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post #20 of 104
8/23/01 at 11:40am
Quote:
The goal was to get humanity to learn how to read God's messages to us.

Are you sure about this? I only read half of the book (Sagan was much better at non-fiction than fiction), but this would really surprise me, being that Sagan was a strict atheist.

I'd be shocked to know that this was Sagan's "message".
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post #21 of 104
8/23/01 at 12:02pm
Quote:
Another topic altogether is why an alien species would go to such lengths to merely make contact for the purposes of creating mental scenarios specific to only the passenger of the pod. I would think that with their sophistication, they would want to send along a civilization-spanning message

Didn't ellie ask that question to "her father" during the beach scene only to have them reply that this is the way its been done for milleniums?

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post #22 of 104
8/23/01 at 1:07pm
Well, it's been 4 years since I read the book. But I believe the quote used above is accurate. If you take God as a representation of order in the universe and a "master plan" as it were. Wonderful book and fantastic movie in my opinion. One of the first SE DVD's as well, and it still stands up with today's loaded DVD's. Back when WB was DVD's champion. Take care.

Chuck
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post #23 of 104
8/23/01 at 2:45pm
The impact would have broken her neck. She was smart to get up when she noticed how calmly the compass was floating around the cabin while her chair (and her) were violently shaken around.

orangeman

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post #24 of 104
8/23/01 at 3:06pm
Quote:
I hate to nitpick one of my favorite films, but what to compasses measure? Yep, magnetic fields. So why if its a magnetic field that flings the chair against the ceiling does the thing just float along without a care in the world?
While true that compasses "react" to magnetic fields (they don't really measure anything) they are not magnetic in and of themselves. Therefore the compass, which was made of plastic, would not be affected by the violent magnetism that caused the chair to fly into the wall of the sphere.

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Ric Perrott
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post #25 of 104
8/23/01 at 8:48pm
quote:
Another topic altogether is why an alien species would go to such lengths to merely make contact for the purposes of creating mental scenarios specific to only the passenger of the pod. I would think that with their sophistication, they would want to send along a civilization-spanning message.[/quote]

In one sense, the initial signal (with the prime numbers) was such a message. Also, they can read her mind once she gets there and craft the message for her. But they don't know the state of all civilization on Earth; Ellie doesn't know it or represent it. (The book is a little better in that five different people go.)

But more to the point, as they say in the movie, "Small moves."

Before the events in the film, there are some that have claimed extra-terrestial intelligence (mostly in the form of visitation), which most people disbelieve, and maybe the government knows the real truth. At the end of the movie, there is a substantial claim of ETi, which some people disbelieve, and the government does know the real truth You have to give civilization time to change its thinking of where it stands in the universe.

An opposite approach would be to land your flying saucer in Washington DC, to proclaim that humans are not alone. We all know what happens then: you get shot.

//Ken

[Edited last by Ken Chan on August 23, 2001 at 10:52 PM]
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post #26 of 104
8/24/01 at 8:12am
Are you sure about this? I only read half of the book (Sagan was much better at non-fiction than fiction), but this would really surprise me, being that Sagan was a strict atheist.

Yes, I'm quite sure. In the book, Ellie is shown absolute proof that God does in fact exist, and that the universe was created by design. (Remember that this is a SF novel)

You are right about Sagan being an Atheist. I think the point of the book was to ask "If God does exist, why can't we find proof that survives the scientific method?" In the book Ellie asks just such a question, and ultimately finds the answer in a provable way.

However in the movie, Ellie asks the question, and is told by the aliens that they have never found anyone but each other. And she is then forced to act on "faith" alone, which gives credence to the religeous folk.

Its a complete hash of the original message and why I think the movie is probably one of the worst adaptations ever of a book. It totally throws away the authors message.
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post #27 of 104
8/24/01 at 8:57am
Sorry, but I didn't get that message out of the book when I read it. In fact, I got the opposite. That there are more advanced beings out there, even more so than the aliens we met in the book/movie. They are the ones who made the "subway system" that Elly travelled on. It wasn't God. The aliens never gave any mention of God either.

Ace
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post #28 of 104
8/24/01 at 1:38pm
In the book, while the aliens never mentioned God by name, they did imply that a higher being had created the universe (by virtue of the undeciphered message embedded deep inside the numbers of pi.)

While I like the film overall, I agree with Danny that the book's ending message (as I interpreted it) was missed. That is, there are scenarios in which the theories of evolution/science and creation/faith can coexist.



[Edited last by Brian Perry on August 24, 2001 at 06:57 PM]
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post #29 of 104
8/24/01 at 1:54pm
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post #30 of 104
8/24/01 at 1:58pm
Thread Starter 
This is an interesting discussion.

I didn't read the book, unfortunately, so I am not in a position to comment on some of these points.

Based solely on the information presented in the film, however, there is absolutely no mention of God as it pertains to the creation of the "subway system."

I didn't think a thread on the chair would become so philosophical or turn into a theological debate.

-Hector


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[Edited last by Hector X. Cruz on August 24, 2001 at 03:59 PM]
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