The WWE™ - Page 12

Does anyone have any predictions on who put Shawn Michaels' head through the car window?

It looked like the "too obvious" answer would be the Anti-Americans because they said they had "one more piece of unfinished business" on RAW. The Big Show was also shown following Shawn Michaels around. This would make sense since last week, Show was talking about getting super-kicked with "tough love" from Michaels when they were NWO. Of course, this could all be there just to throw us off.

Any guesses/opinion?

Actually, I'm not positive him going through the window was a work. There seemed to be an awful lot of people out there and concerned

Andres, I can't remember all the circumstances, but somehow it had been arranged that Austin was finally going to get McMahon one on one (I think Austin was even going to have one hand tied behind his back). They did the entrances, and were ready to start (as the show was about to run out of time) when Mick Foley came out as Dude Love, interfering on McMahon's behalf, and thus setting up the corporate Dude Love vs Austin feud that ran for quite a while afterwards, with McMahon constantly trying any which way he could to get the belt off Austina nd onto Foley.

And Jeff, dunno if you were being sarcastic or not, but if not, no worries. They did the same angle with Michaels a few years ago (without the "whodunit" mystery involved) with the exact same scenario (bloody hole on a windshield, Michaels on his back with fake blood poured all over his face). My bet is that since they are saying in the RAW preview that Michaels had a "concussion", that we will have a pseudo amnesia angle where Michaels can't rememer who it was or never actually saw who it was, while Hunter runs down all the red herrings they threw at us leading up to them finding Michaels (Booker, Big Show), only to reveal that it was HHH himself all along in the end, thus setting up the money match at Summerslam or even Survivor Series (depending how long they string it out). Whichever way it goes, I'm also thinking it will first involve HHH and Michaels tagging together, since word has it that Michaels would rather make a jump back in the ring slowly as opposed to jumping right into a singles match and showing any ring rust which might have accumulated.

I watched Confidential this saturday and they touched up on another event that helped bring WCW down...Bret Hart.

They mentioned that Bret Hart "was screwed" at SummerSlam (can't remember the year. I believe he fought Shawn Michaels and lost the title). He then left WWF and went to WCW where he got paid an insane amount of money. It was supposed to be a move that would hurt the WWF but ended up hurting WCW a lot more.

Anybody knows the scoop on this? I can't believe how much I missed in the years that I stopped watching wrestling.

WWF was in financial trouble, WCW was killing them and Bret had a fat contract. Vince asked him to take WCW's offer, and so he did. Bret Hart's contracted stated he had "reasonable creative control over his character" for the last 30 days in the WWF.

Bret refused to drop the belt in Canada, and Vince told him "Bret, I can't have you showing up on the other guy's show with my belt" (which had happened with the women's title). Bret said he's show up on RAW the next night and drop it publicly, but you know that stuff like that has to be at a PPV. Vince said he'd think about it, and in the end told Earl Hebner to count a pinfall instead of letting the runin happen that Bret wanted.

Bottom Line:

Bret was being a brat, and Vince should have made clear to him on no uncertain terms that he was dropping the belt at the PPV, and it was not negotiable

Try the documentary Bret Hart: Wrestling with Shadows

Thanks Jeff for the summary.

I remember I used to like Bret so much and he was champion for the longest. Remember the Yokozuna days? Good old days.

I wish I could've seen Bret's face when he lost the title. That must have been a shock.

So anyway, he went to WCW and got paid a lot more money than everyone else. But the guys said that they paid that money for nothing because Bret didn't do that many appearances on WCW. They didn't get their money's worth.

I wouldn't say Bret was being a brat. He disliked Shawn Michaels a lot and didn't want to lose the title to him in his home country. His creative control clause gave him the right to refuse this job to Michaels. Simple as that. They should not have assumed Bret would walk onto Nitro to disgrace the WWF title, when there wasn't really any evidence. And as I remember, Bret didn't appear on WCW until a week or two after the Survivor Series.

Andres, you should watch Wrestling with Shadows. It was shown again on A&E a couple of days ago. I saw the Survivor Series live on PPV, and the look on Bret's face was of total disbelief, anger, and sadness.

WCW failed to utilize Bret properly. After jumping over to the promotion, he was assigned as the special guest referee for the huge Hogan vs. Sting match at Starrcade. Then he had a pretty good feud with Ric Flair that lasted about a month. After that, they just didn't know what to do with him. I remember he was the U.S. champion, which is a step down from his world championships, and once he had to job to Will Sasso, the actor on Mad TV. In the fall of 1999, when Vince Russo was working for WCW, Bret started to get main event status: he wrestled Bill Goldberg for the world title at Starrcade and went on to lead the NWO until his concussion suffered at Starrcade put him out of the ring forever.

Bret suffered a serious stroke from a motorcycle accident a while ago. It was announced recently that it'll take a year for him to fully recover.

~T

How long ago did Wrestling with Shadows come out? I'm assuming Bret's stroke is not included in the coverage?

Ill never forget watching Hogan come out on PPV with a attitude,walk to the center of the ring and and then laying on the mat so Sting could pin him.
People paid money for tat PPV and to attend.
They only care about themselves. Doing "jobs" is part of the business. EVERY wrestler has to do it.

Brett(and Hogan) should have done the Job and thats that.

Did anyone see the Eric Cartman as Stone Cold "Screw you guys, I'm going home" sign on RAW last night? Brilliant!

I totally agree.

Bret's head got a little too big there. How pompous can you be to expect to leave the champion? In Vince's eyes, he would have walked away and thrown the WWF belt in the trash; simply a disgrace to his organization.

This was taken a little to the extreme on Vince's part, but I in no way side with Bret.

Even though Wrestling with Shadows is biased in Bret's favor, every time I watch it, I can't help but be disgusted with his attitude.

Where is the proof that Bret intended to go to WCW with the WWF belt? Bret had the creative control clause in his contract--if he didn't want to job, he didn't have to. Am I missing something?

I'd like to know what their original plans were for Bret and the title. There was a known finish to the match, a DQ with Bulldog and Owen running in. What was going to happen after that?

~T

Bret wanted to hand the belt over on RAW the following night.

Why would McMahon go for that??
That way, WCW would now have a guy that could say there was NO ONE in the then WWF who could beat him, and further discredit any champions from that point forward by saying that technically, he was still the champion.

By the way, after last night's promo from the UnAmericans, I think I'm done with the WWE.
That was appalling.

Joe McCabe, I could not agree more. I am a Canadian and am proud to be your neighbour to the North. Every few years the wwf(e) pulls this s**t and it irks me to no end. After the heartfelt emotions that most superstars did on the first show back after the attacks, I thought we would not have to put up with this crap, but here it is again. How do the "actors" agree to spew it? There is no way they can feel good about it...

That's what I was saying over a A1Wrestling.com (a wrestling board I also post on).
If I was Lance Storm, I would have refused to say that garbage, no matter what the repercusions were.

I wouldn't even mind the "We hate America" stuff so much as a gimmick, but to directly goof on 9/11, is just beyond disgusting.

The Canadian angle is something they yank out when they're short on ideas


No it said "REASONABLE" creative control. Leaving the company with the belt is NOT reasonable, and Bret should not have been such a brat

Vince also should not have screwjobbed him. If Iwere in his shoes, I would have come out on the mic and stripped it from him right there.

Wrestling With Shadows was made in 1998 by The National Film Board Of Canada, airing on TV several times, originally intending to be a documentary of one of Canada's most famous pro wrestlers. The angle changed with the screw job.

The documentary was made available on VHS and sold for Christmas 1998 (it was widely available in Wal-Mart). The videotape is still available at places like Amazon. Definitely a great investment, and well worth it for the footage of the fallout from the 1997 Survivor Series (While we don't actually see it, Bret punched Vince McMahon in the face in disgust after the match, and Bret's wife really tore into the other superstars following the incident.

I wandered into this thread - I'm not a wrestling fan (not since I was a kid) but I saw Wrestling With Shadows and I didn't think Hart was "whining" at all. Hart had McMahon on tape agreeing to what Hart wanted to do. Not only that, but it was only at McMahon's impetus that Hart was leaving in the first place. All Hart wanted to do was go out on top in Canada and then lose back in the States. It doesn't seem like such an unreasonable demand to me, especially considering his history with the company.

What did the UnAmericans say about 9/11? I saw Raw but I must have fast-forwarded through that part.

You see, here's the difference

Back then, there really were only 4 really important PPVs, Wrestlemania, Summerslam,Survivor Series, and Royal Rumble. The belt HAD to be dropped at the PPV, not only because of how the story had to work, but because Bret was no longer under contract

You can't have him just go on video and say "I surrender the belt" on RAW, that's not good TV, and that's not reasonable control

He had to do the J-O-B. If he didn't want to do it in Canada, tough shit, he should have extended his contract to Royal Rumble

Why don't they just put Lance Storm back in his old WCW tights and be done with it? I haven't seen this week's RAW yet, but those tirades by the UnAmericans are sure getting tiresome. Is this the best Steph and her lackeys can come up with? This and the whole Brock Lesnar push really do show a lack of imagination, and if it wasn't for the appearance of Bischoff (OMG!) I would've tuned out ages ago.

And sadly I didn't get to see Mae Young and Moolah get the crap beat out of 'em, as Sky Sports occasionally censors the late-night (ie 'uncut') version of the show over here to protect the kiddies who shouldn't be watching anyway!!. F*ckin' Rupert Murdoch!!

The UnAmericans cut a promo saying that America is weak and our President is weak. They said that our President couldn't even protect his people, and in a so called act of retaliation, only succeded in sending the military to bomb innocent people. They then said that in the end, America has failed at obtaining any revenge.

See, if they want to cut a promo suggesting that America is immoral, and corrupt etc., that's fine.
But to directly touch on the events of Sept. 11, and it's aftermath is just wrong.

Scores of people's family members died that day, and it just doesn't need to be worked into a wrestling angle.

The comments made be Lance Storm did seem a little out of place, and it's obvious what WWE is trying to do: Get these guys over as heels as hard and as fast as possible!!

This does seem to come up every few years; The Bolshaviks (sp?) from the U.S.S.R in the 80s, Iraq supporter Sgt. Slaughter with Colonol Mustafa in the early 90s. How long has the *U S A!* chant been around anyway?

If they want to continiue with this angle, they need to add someone NON-Canadian to the group. Why all of the Un-Americans Canadian? What happens when WWE goes to Canada next time. Are the fans supposed to boo their hometowners?

Apparently the Un-Americans promo was toned down from what was originally written (!). Lance Storm basically publically apologizes for the promo on his website (www.stormwrestling.com) and says (in a subtle, don't wanna ruffle any feathers way) that he will be requesting that the writers tone it down and don't cross the line. You also have to realize that when wrestlers that aren't established stars (like Undertaker, Rock, Hogan) or aren't sleeping with the head writer (HHH) complain about the material given to them, they are usually punished in some way.

In celebration of Stacy Keibler moving to RAW, check out this cool thread posted over in After Hours.

How I wish i couldve been lawler watching stacey dance. mmmm. But Damn! I hate that stupid kid rock legs song lol

According to various news sources, Steve Austin turned himself in to the autorities today on charges of spousal abuse.

http://www.cnn.com/2002/SHOWBIZ/News...eut/index.html

Moe.

Ok, sorry for the dumb question (I don't follow wrestling much...) What's the diff between WWF and WWE? Thanks!

WWE= WWF with a new name ("Entertainment" instead of "Federation").

/Mike

WWE = World Wrestling Entertainment

WWF = World Wildlife Fund

~T