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Is the b&w era of TV on DVD slowly coming to an end? - Page 5

post #121 of 591
2/15/12 at 12:08pm
I think that, originally, it was Warner's intent that everything be released in the archive. One major stumbling block for television is that people do expect to buy it in at least half season chunks, and that involves a lot more film than an 80 minute movie. Also, WAC now says it has increased it picture quality standards for its releases, as opposed to the original intent to release whatever transfer they have. That is another obstacle to getting out television.
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post #122 of 591
2/16/12 at 9:46am
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeDoakes View Post

I think that, originally, it was Warner's intent that everything be released in the archive. One major stumbling block for television is that people do expect to buy it in at least half season chunks, and that involves a lot more film than an 80 minute movie. Also, WAC now says it has increased it picture quality standards for its releases, as opposed to the original intent to release whatever transfer they have. That is another obstacle to getting out television.

It shouldn't be that big of a stumbling block. All of the Turner/MGM shows, which Warner now owns, were beautifully remastered onto 1-inch tape when Turner bought the MGM library. And many of the older Warner series were also remastered when they made the big sale to ALN about a decade ago. So, except for a few shows that may have fallen through the cracks, they should have perfectly acceptable copies of many of their series.
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post #123 of 591
4/3/12 at 6:33am
Thread Starter 

For fans of Mannix, Dynasty, and The Streets of SF, I know the latest update is good news.  And as always, even though I'm not going to pick up any of those titles, I am happy for devotees of those series.  But knowing what I do, via my ever faithful crystal ball, there's a tinge of bad news in these announcements.  You see, there were 3 well-known b/w shows that CBS/P had tentatively scheduled releases for in the months of May and June, and the fact that none of these have been announced yet, while the 3 color series above have been announced for July releases, definitely concerns me.  I fear it is more evidence that b/w shows are dying on the proverbial vine.  I hope we get some news from CBS soon about some of these b/w shows I know were on the schedule.  Heck, I'd like to hear an update about The Fugitive too.  Right now it looks like Timeless may be my primary outlet in 2012 for vintage TV on DVD if some of the other outfits don't pick up the pace soon.  Wish I were a bigger fan of 70's/80's material, as that seems to be getting a lot of play right now.  But alas, I'm not.  Oh well...

 

 

Gary "hoping CBS can at least get a couple of b/w releases out by the end of 2012 - I can't remember if they've released even one yet this year" O.

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post #124 of 591
4/3/12 at 6:49am
Thread Starter 

I just double-checked the release schedule at TVShowsonDVD.com, and unless something changes soon, it appears that CBS/Paramount will not release even one b/w show in the first half of 2012!  That's unbelievable considering they've been the best major studio over the last decade at releasing vintage material.  What a sad state of affairs. 

 

 

Gary "did they hire some new kid exec that hates b/w TV?" O.

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post #125 of 591
4/3/12 at 6:55am
Would those tentatively scheduled b/w series have come out as the 6th and Final Season Vol. 1, the 4th and Final Season Vol. 1, and the 7th Season Vol. 1? I will certainly understand if you can't share more, but if it is those series, which looked so likely, then things are certainly bleak...
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post #126 of 591
4/3/12 at 7:06am
Thread Starter 

Lee, there's still the 2nd half of the year where some other b/w material is still on the tentative schedule, so all is not lost - yet.  That's where one of the shows you hinted at is sitting for release.  But two of the ones you mentioned were indeed scheduled for May/June releases.  So yes, things do look somewhat bleak. 

 

 

Gary "and that Fugitive release seems to have fallen off the face of the earth" O.

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post #127 of 591
4/3/12 at 7:25am
It's a real bummer when CBS/Paramount holds the rights to many of the shows you really want to see continue on DVD. And of course, all are black and white: Gunsmoke, Rawhide, Have Gun-Will Travel, Perry Mason, The Untouchables. You're reduced to hoping that both you and the DVD format lasts long enough to see some further seasons.

Encore Westerns is starting to show Gunsmoke Season 6. It looks like they'll show most of the episodes from that year, 37 out of 39 I think. That might be the best way of getting them. They're also starting to show the later years of Rawhide.

To anyone who has been watching, has Encore's episodes of Season 4 looked better than what was released on DVD?
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post #128 of 591
4/3/12 at 3:47pm
Thread Starter 

     Quote:

Originally Posted by jdee28 View Post

It's a real bummer when CBS/Paramount holds the rights to many of the shows you really want to see continue on DVD. And of course, all are black and white: Gunsmoke, Rawhide, Have Gun-Will Travel, Perry Mason, The Untouchables. You're reduced to hoping that both you and the DVD format lasts long enough to see some further seasons.


Well said, John.  thumbsup.gif

 

 

Gary "I'd certainly expect Perry Mason survive at least one more year, but I think all the others are probably coin flips at this point" O.

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post #129 of 591
4/3/12 at 6:19pm
How many great, long-running and popular black and white shows are still absent on DVD? Here's some of them:

Dragnet, The Lineup, Burns and Allen, December Bride, Our Miss Brooks, Life of Riley, Love That Bob, Bachelor Father, The Millionaire, Death Valley Days, The Jack Benny Show, 77 Sunset Strip, Dr. Kildare, Adventures of Rin Tin Tin, Lawman, Sea Hunt, Sheriff of Cochise, Dobie Gillis, Hawaiian Eye, The Defenders, The Gale Storm Show, My Little Margie, I Led Three Lives, Whirlybirds, Bat Masterson, People's Choice, Private Secretary, The Ann Sothern Show, Henessey, Colt .45, Roaring 20s, Surfside 6, Sugarfoot, Bronco, The Nurses.

A lot of really popular, filmed series, which are all residing intact in the vaults.
Edited by Neil Brock - 4/3/12 at 6:31pm
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post #130 of 591
4/3/12 at 6:52pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neil Brock View Post

How many great, long-running and popular black and white shows are still absent on DVD? Here's some of them:
Dragnet, The Lineup, Burns and Allen, December Bride, Our Miss Brooks, Life of Riley, Love That Bob, Bachelor Father, The Millionaire, Death Valley Days, The Jack Benny Show, 77 Sunset Strip, Dr. Kildare, Adventures of Rin Tin Tin, Lawman, Sea Hunt, Sheriff of Cochise, Dobie Gillis, Hawaiian Eye, The Defenders, The Gale Storm Show, My Little Margie, I Led Three Lives, Whirlybirds, Bat Masterson, People's Choice, Private Secretary, The Ann Sothern Show, Henessey, Colt .45, Roaring 20s, Surfside 6, Sugarfoot, Bronco, The Nurses.
A lot of really popular, filmed series, which are all residing intact in the vaults.

Makes me yearn for the days of the old CBN Network from the early 80s (which eventually morphed into Family Channel, then ABC Family Channel). Many of those shows listed ran on CBN at some point. Burns & Allen, Dobie Gillis and Jack Benny were my favorites--I'd buy season sets of those in a heartbeat, along with I Married Joan (big Jim Backus fan)
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post #131 of 591
4/3/12 at 7:06pm
I really want quality Jack Benny and Burns & Allen sets. These should have happened by now.Hopefully with antenna TV exposure, something is in the works though I have heard that they are only airing PD episodes. I have heard tale of a more solid collection of all PD Jack Benny coming but I don't know when.
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post #132 of 591
4/4/12 at 8:36am
Thread Starter 

     Quote:

Originally Posted by Neil Brock View Post

How many great, long-running and popular black and white shows are still absent on DVD? Here's some of them:
Dragnet, The Lineup, Burns and Allen, December Bride, Our Miss Brooks, Life of Riley, Love That Bob, Bachelor Father, The Millionaire, Death Valley Days, The Jack Benny Show, 77 Sunset Strip, Dr. Kildare, Adventures of Rin Tin Tin, Lawman, Sea Hunt, Sheriff of Cochise, Dobie Gillis, Hawaiian Eye, The Defenders, The Gale Storm Show, My Little Margie, I Led Three Lives, Whirlybirds, Bat Masterson, People's Choice, Private Secretary, The Ann Sothern Show, Henessey, Colt .45, Roaring 20s, Surfside 6, Sugarfoot, Bronco, The Nurses.
A lot of really popular, filmed series, which are all residing intact in the vaults.


And that really is a tremendous list of shows, Neil.  It's just incredible that there are still so many great b/w series that have never seen a release.  I'd be in for many of the ones you listed.

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeff*H View Post

Makes me yearn for the days of the old CBN Network from the early 80s (which eventually morphed into Family Channel, then ABC Family Channel). Many of those shows listed ran on CBN at some point. Burns & Allen, Dobie Gillis and Jack Benny were my favorites--I'd buy season sets of those in a heartbeat, along with I Married Joan (big Jim Backus fan)


Yep.  Those were the days!

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tory View Post

I really want quality Jack Benny and Burns & Allen sets. These should have happened by now.


Agreed.  Let's keep our fingers crossed.

 

 

I'm still blown away by the fact that, unless something changes quickly, CBS will have gone through the first half of 2012 with zero b/w releases!  If that doesn't demonstrate how grim the outlook is heading forward, I don't know what does.

 

 

Gary "thank goodness for Timeless" O.

 

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post #133 of 591
4/4/12 at 10:52am
Maybe there's a hold up with these b&w shows because they haven't been fully HD transferred yet, neither final seasons of HGWT or The Untouchables have as far as I can tell. This of course never prevented Paramount in the past from releasing titles not remastered, Cannon case in point, so if that's not why then I wonder too.
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post #134 of 591
4/4/12 at 11:09am
Hey Gary I wanted to ask if you knew that Streets of San Francisco Season 3 was coming? Streets had been stalled for over 3 years I believe. Also, Gary do you think with Streets being continued after over a 3 year wait, there is much of a chance of Cannon Season 3 and Barnaby Jones Season 2 coming out on DVD after being stalled for over 2 years? Thanks And God Bless!

Robert
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post #135 of 591
4/4/12 at 1:24pm
Gary OS

While you're being asked about other shows, is there any news on upcoming Timeless releases? I keep hoping to see that the complete Restless Gun and Seasons 3,4 and 5 of Tales of Wells Fargo are on the horizon.
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post #136 of 591
4/4/12 at 1:54pm
Thread Starter 

     Quote:

Originally Posted by MCCLOUD View Post

Hey Gary I wanted to ask if you knew that Streets of San Francisco Season 3 was coming? Streets had been stalled for over 3 years I believe. Also, Gary do you think with Streets being continued after over a 3 year wait, there is much of a chance of Cannon Season 3 and Barnaby Jones Season 2 coming out on DVD after being stalled for over 2 years? Thanks.


Robert,

 

I actually did NOT know Streets was coming.  But since I'm not interested in that title it may simply be that my crystal ball bypassed that one the last time I checked.  biggrin.gif

 

I believe Cannon fell out of the release rotation pretty quickly.  I'd have to go way back to verify that, but I'm pretty sure that's correct.  On the other hand, Barnaby Jones was scheduled for more releases early last year but didn't quite make the cut.  I wasn't happy, to say the least.  Whether or not either has a shot at being un-stalled is anyone's guess.  The only thing I can say right now is that neither has appeared on the horizon in my crystal ball.  Sorry. 

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by mmyers View Post

Gary OS
While you're being asked about other shows, is there any news on upcoming Timeless releases? I keep hoping to see that the complete Restless Gun and Seasons 3,4 and 5 of Tales of Wells Fargo are on the horizon.


Mike,

 

All I'm allowed to say is that Timeless is NOT going to disappoint us this year when it comes to b/w material.  Many neat things are on the horizon.  They may not have the instance name recognition that the CBS shows do, but they'll be fun releases nonetheless.

 

 

Gary "very excited about what Timeless has on tap next" O.

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post #137 of 591
4/4/12 at 2:52pm
I hope not thiers about a season and a half of the untouchables and I would like twelve o'clock high I would like to see get released
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post #138 of 591
4/5/12 at 3:14am
Wish my wish list was that small. It's frusturating when there's probably over 100 seasons worth of unreleased black & white material if I added it all together that I'd buy without hesitation.

Just the William Bendix seasons of Life of Riley alone account for 6 seasons so I doubt I'm exagerrating if I were to start looking up season totals and start adding things up.
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post #139 of 591
4/5/12 at 3:54am
I think this year will be 'make or break' for older black & white series. Sadly it looks more 'break' than 'make' at present. I'm sure Timeless will have a few items to lift the spirits later this year but it seems CBS are calling time on their monochrome material.

I know several people expect Warners to escalate their MOD programme to include their old detective/western series but I just can't see it happening.

The target audience for old series is decreasing as each year passes & old series eventually will have the marketability of silent films.

Now I understand that there are all kinds of reasons for companies not releasing their archive material. The bottom line though is surely ,'is it worth the investment & what will the profit be ? '

An astute business should be keen to maximise all its assets. In the case of old black & white TV series the alternative is to let them rot away in the vaults as for sure they are never going to play on TV again. I think maybe Universal/Revue realised this which is why they did a deal with Timeless. Judging by the amount of material Timeless has released would indicate that it has paid off.
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post #140 of 591
4/5/12 at 8:42am
There seem to be a lot of 1950s series that were popular in their day but never did much in syndication. I started watching tv in the early 1970s, and I never remember seeing anything like Life of Reilly. Some series were rescued in the 1980s by TBS and CBN/Family Channel like Father Knows Best, Ozzie and Harriet, Hazel, Mr. Ed, Dobbie Gillis, Make Room For Daddy, Burns and Allen, and Donna Reed. In terms of westerns, Gunsmoke lasted into the 1970s, Bonanza and other 1960s color era westerns did well in syndication, and Maverick had a syndication revival in the 1970s thanks to the success of The Rockford Files. Although some of those shows have had varying performances on DVD, there are a lot of other shows that I bet even classic tv fans like myself have never seen.
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post #141 of 591
4/5/12 at 9:24am
If Barnaby Jones came close to release last year, it means they'd gone with prints not remastered since by all accounts only the first season's been cleaned up. That's fine with me I just want it, though there really is quite a world of difference to tell in picture quality and that goes without saying. But if they're concentrating on '70s titles now as it seems maybe we'll get lucky, I certainly didn't see Streets of San Francisco coming. It just shows they haven't really given up on any of them, I guess.
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post #142 of 591
4/5/12 at 9:41am
Quote:
Originally Posted by silverking View Post

I know several people expect Warners to escalate their MOD programme to include their old detective/western series but I just can't see it happening.

Why not? We've seen two seasons released of "Cheyenne" already, and the word is that music clearance issues tend to be much harder for these older series and that Warner evidently wants to make sure all matters are straight before they'd release a title.

I think there's one other factor to consider for a lot of these Warner B/W shows. From what I understand, Warner was pretty notorious in those days for recycling scripts of movies and even at a higher level recycling scripts from other TV shows (Roger Moore mentioned how many episodes of "The Alaskans" were recycled "Maverick" scripts), and who knows if that causes further legal headaches they need to sift through first.
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post #143 of 591
4/5/12 at 10:40am
I'm still waiting for the WB Archive to release Conflict, their anthology show that ran for 20 episodes in the 1956-57 season and has been rarely seen since, if ever. I think they first mentioned that back in 2009.
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post #144 of 591
4/5/12 at 11:31am
The news about Have Gun, Will Travel is a real bummer. I had truly expected it to finish up this year after restarting in 2010/11. I was less hopeful of an Untouchables release (though I'd have certainly welcomed it). I assume that the only B&W releases from CBS for the fall will be Perry Mason and Gunsmoke (and I'm only interested in the latter), with Rawhide being another "coin flip" type of show. I guess I'll be thankful for the B&W shows we'll be getting (Route 66, Maverick , the aforementioned Gunsmoke, and the shows that Timeless will be releasing). I don't hold out much hope for anything worthwhile from WB Archive.
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post #145 of 591
4/5/12 at 11:40am
Thread Starter 

     Quote:

Originally Posted by silverking View Post

I think this year will be 'make or break' for older black & white series. Sadly it looks more 'break' than 'make' at present. I'm sure Timeless will have a few items to lift the spirits later this year but it seems CBS are calling time on their monochrome material.
I know several people expect Warners to escalate their MOD programme to include their old detective/western series but I just can't see it happening.
The target audience for old series is decreasing as each year passes & old series eventually will have the marketability of silent films.
Now I understand that there are all kinds of reasons for companies not releasing their archive material. The bottom line though is surely ,'is it worth the investment & what will the profit be ? '
An astute business should be keen to maximise all its assets. In the case of old black & white TV series the alternative is to let them rot away in the vaults as for sure they are never going to play on TV again. I think maybe Universal/Revue realised this which is why they did a deal with Timeless. Judging by the amount of material Timeless has released would indicate that it has paid off.


Well said on all accounts, Chris.  I'm in full agreement.  As you said, the longer the studios wait on getting out the b/w material, the more and more the potential purchasing audience shrinks.  And I just don't see any way that we have a renaissance of 50's/60's TV a decade or two from now where we suddenly have a new generation that's interested in this material.  I just think that's nothing short of a pipe dream, therefore all delays only hurt sales at this point.  But YMMV on that opinion.

 

I'm also with you, Chris, on not seeing WB Archives being some savior of b/w TV material.  I'll believe it when I start seeing that portion of their library being released on a regular basis.

 

Gary "Timeless and Universal both made an excellent decision when they partnered up - and it has definitely paid off in a big way for fans of vintage material" O.

 

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post #146 of 591
4/5/12 at 3:47pm
Encore Westerns aired a season 6 episode of Gunsmoke today for the first time, and it was not digitally remastered. That might not bode well for a season 6 release.
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post #147 of 591
4/5/12 at 5:42pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdee28 View Post

Encore Westerns aired a season 6 episode of Gunsmoke today for the first time, and it was not digitally remastered. That might not bode well for a season 6 release.

They might have not gotten around to making the new transfers,or they haven't been made available to Encore.

If you see the pattern of CBS's DVD releases, they tend to rotate the classic tv shows., going long gaps between releases.
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post #148 of 591
4/5/12 at 6:21pm
The problems with many of these shows are great. Some shows, for example, December Bride, Our Miss Brooks, The Millionaire and The Lineup, never had any national cable syndication. These shows haven't had much exposure in decades. Combine that with the fact that there aren't even any tape masters on these shows, save for a couple of dozen Millionaires. So, new masters would have to be struck and there's just no way that there exists the sales potential to justify that. Then there's the "Fox factor". Basically, any show of a certain vintage that they own, you can forget about ever seeing. They have zero interest. Hell, even some of their older color shows, like Julia, Ghost and Mrs. Muir, Nanny and the Professor, they likely won't ever do anything with. As for the Warner shows, they make a lot of positive statements which give hope but so far there's little to show for it. I just think that so many of those shows had people like Connie Stevens and Dorothy Provine singing up a storm that any releases might be impossible to clear.

BTW, a few other shows I thought of: Racket Squad, I Married Joan, Farmer's Daughter (I know, last season was color).
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post #149 of 591
4/5/12 at 7:13pm
Yes, but Fox did do something with NATP. They put most of the episodes on Hulu, a streaming video site.
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post #150 of 591
4/6/12 at 6:58am
Should mention that it would seem they've actually HD transferred all of The Untouchables after all, or season 4 momentarily anyway. Again according to their page, so a good guess is the last season will likely come out eventually.
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