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Tom & Jerry The Golden Collection Volume 1 Blu-ray Review

post #1 of 74
Thread Starter 

The Tom & Jerry Golden Collection Volume 1 on Blu-ray is a mixed bag. The good news is that the first 37 of the cartoon short films created by William Hanna and Joseph Barbera featuring Tom and Jerry are finally presented uncensored and in chronological order in high definition. The bad news is that the video quality of the films varies dramatically, sometimes even within the same film. This should not be surprising since most of the original nitrate negatives for the Tom & Jerry cartoons were destroyed in the George Eastman House fire of 1978. All but one of the shorts included in this collection were transferred to high definition from color reversal internegatives(CRI) which have limitations in present technology. Still, we are fortunate that these early Tom and Jerry cartoons survive at all, and this collection definitely presents a definite step up in quality and presentation from the Tom & Jerry Spotlight Collections previously released on DVD.

 

Tom And Jerry: The Golden Collection - Volume 1

 

TOM & JERRY Golden Collection Volume 1 BLU-RAY

 

Studio: Warner Brothers

Year: 1940-1948

Rated: Not Rated

Film Length: 284 minutes

Aspect Ratio: 1.33:1

Audio: English Dolby Digital 1.0, French Dolby Digital 1.0, Spanish Dolby Digital 1.0

Subtitles: English SDH, French, Spanish

 

Release Date: October 25, 2011

 

The Films

 

Tom & Jerry began their cinematic career in an MGM cartoon originally intended as a one-shot, Puss Gets The Boot, which was produced in 1939 and premiered theatrically on February 10, 1940. Cartoons featuring a cat and mouse were fairly common even before 1940 and no one expected that Puss Gets The Boot would become popular with exhibitors and even be nominated for the Academy Award for Best Short Subject: Cartoon of 1940. Tom was originally named "Jasper" and Jerry was originally unnamed, although Joe Barbera said later that his original name was "Jinx." Tom was still called "Jasper" during production of the follow-up cartoon, The Midnight Snack, but was named Tom in the final version. (The original pencil test for The Midnight Snack is included as a special feature in this collection and confirms that Tom was still called "Jasper" during production.)

 

William Hanna and Joe Barbera began their collaboration at the MGM Cartoon Studio in 1937. Hanna and Barbera created 114 Tom & Jerry cartoons at MGM from 1940 to 1957. (Their final Tom & Jerry short, Tot Watchers, was unreleased until 1958.) The Tom & Jerry film shorts created by Hanna and Barbera won 7 Academy Awards for Best Short Subject: Cartoon and received 13 separate nominations for that award. Hanna and Barbera created Hanna-Barbera Studios in 1957 after the MGM Cartoon Studio was shut down that same year. Hanna-Barbera went on to be the most successful TV animation studio and created a multitude of cartoon classics, including Yogi Bear, Huckleberry Hound, The Flintstones, The Jetsons, Top Cat, Jonny Quest, Space Ghost, Scooby Doo, and many more.

 

Tom & Jerry have been revived and recreated many times over the years, beginning with new series of theatrical short created in the 1960s by Gene Deitch and, later, Chuck Jones. Hanna-Barbera Studios teamed them up with the Great Grape Ape and Mumbly for a Saturday morning cartoon series in the mid-1970s, and new Tom & Jerry cartoons continue to be created today, as they have been for every generation for the last 70 years. The Tom & Jerry cartoon shorts from the 1940s included in this set continue to be respected and appreciated today as the high point for the cat and mouse team.

 

The cartoon shorts on Disc 1 of this 2-disc collection are as follows:

Puss Gets The Boot(7:13)

The Midnight Snack(9:13)

The Night Before Christmas(9:03)

Fraidy Cat(8:15)

Dog Trouble(7:58)

Puss N’ Toots(7:29)

The Bowling Alley-Cat(8:00)

Fine-Feathered Friend(7:53)

Sufferin’ Cats!(7:56)

The Lonesome Mouse(8:08)

The Yankee Doodle Mouse(7:33)

Baby Puss(8:00)

The Zoot Cat(7:08)

The Million Dollar Cat(7:13)

The Bodyguard(7:26)

Puttin’ On The Dog(7:05)

Mouse Trouble(7:28)

The Mouse Comes To Dinner(7:26)

Mouse In Manhattan(8:14)

Tee For Two(7:06)

The cartoon shorts on Disc 2 are as follows:

Flirty Birdy(7:22)

Quiet Please!(7:40)

Springtime For Thomas(7:46)

The Milky Waif(7:28)

Trap Happy(7:13)

Solid Serenade(7:27)

Cat Fishin’(7:46)

Part Time Pal(7:58)

The Cat Concerto(7:32)

Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Mouse(7:28)

Salt Water Tabby(7:22)

A Mouse In The House(7:57)

The Invisible Mouse(7:23)

Kitty Foiled(7:27)

The Truce Hurts(8:02)

Old Rockin’ Chair Tom(7:36)

Professor Tom(7:37)

 

The first few Tom & Jerry cartoons have the producers still finding their way with the characters and the formula. The defection of Tex Avery to the MGM unit from Termite Terrace at Warner Bros. seems to have had a contagious effect on Hanna and Barbera since their shorts from 1942 and later seem to be faster paced and include more outlandish gags in the Avery style. Although the later Tom & Jerry shorts have their own charm and style, some of the all-time best shorts in this series are included in this collection.

 

It is very nice to see these cartoons uncensored (finally!) and in chronological order. The censorship utilized on the Tom & Jerry Spotlight Collections probably offended more people than would have been offended had the shorts been released in their original form. The original dialogue for Mammy Two Shoes appears to be entirely intact, and the previously censored gags appear to be complete and uncensored in this collection.

It bears mentioning that a complete collection of animated shorts demands to be viewed in chronological order. The character designs, animation styles, and even character personalities evolved over time, and that evolution can only be seen and appreciated in chronological order. (It is unfortunate that the studio continues to release, and re-release, its Looney Tunes and Merrie Melodies in no particular chronological order at all. May the Tom & Jerry Golden Collection herald a change to that infuriating release model.)

 

Video

 

The Tom & Jerry Golden Collection Volume 1 includes the first 37 shorts in this series for the first time on Blu-Ray in 1080p in 1.33:1 aspect ratio. The original Academy aspect ratio for these films was originally 1.37:1. The new 1080p high definition transfers of these cartoons are very good, if somewhat inconsistent. Most of the original nitrate negatives for the Tom & Jerry cartoons were destroyed in the George Eastman House fire of 1978. Original nitrate negatives for 14 of the Tom & Jerry cartoons created from 1940 to 1957 have since been located safe and sound at the UCLA Film Archive in Los Angeles. One of these 14 shorts is Doctor Jekyll and Mr. Mouse(1947) which is included in this collection.

 

The video presentation of Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Mouse is virtually free of film grain with vibrant colors and no apparent compression artifacts. If the excellent condition of Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Mouse is the gold standard, then most of the remaining shorts fall well short of this standard. Admittedly, the remainder of the cartoons in this set were transferred to high definition from color reversal internegatives(CRI) which have limitations in present technology.

 

The first 2 shorts, Puss Gets The Boot and The Midnight Snack appear to my eye to be very close to the same high standard of video quality as Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Mouse, taking into account the different animation styles and color schemes of those shorts created so many years earlier. Film grain is present but minimal, colors are vibrant, and there are no compression artifacts apparent. After that, the shorts on disc 1 show a change in video quality in which the shorts show an abundance of film grain and occasional digital noise. (The later shorts on Disc 2 tend to be much more consistent and of higher quality.) As one example, the last 10 seconds of Sufferin’ Cats goes from being somewhat grainy in appearance to excessive grain until the fade to black which demonstrates the same pattern of noise in solid black, which suggests it is not really film grain at all so much as an extreme readjustment (or lack of adjustment) of digital tinkering. Digital tools can be very helpful when used properly but stand out like a sore thumb when used inconsistently.

 

Since most of the original nitrate negatives for these cartoons have been long since destroyed, we cannot reasonably expect to have these shorts appear in pristine condition. Many of the shorts in this collection have reissue titles rather than the original titles. Although original title cards are generally preferable over reissues, the fact is that the originals may no longer exist. The shorts with reissue title cards actually tend to have better picture quality than those with original titles in this collection.

 

I have struggled with evaluating the video quality of these discs because I want to give this collection the highest possible recommendation but I cannot. I can say that more than 90% of the video in this collection is excellent. The excessive film grain does not bother me so much even though less is more when it comes to animation on film. The occasional appearance of a hair at the edge of the aperture appearing on screen does not trouble me since I know it must probably have always been there on film. The dirt and debris that was so prevalent on the cartoons in the Tom & Jerry Spotlight Collections on DVD have been cleaned up on Blu-ray so that the remaining appearances of scratches and blemishes are few and far between.

 

My disappointment with the video quality lies with the apparently inconsistent use of digital tools. I will give a specific example in the hope that others will report not seeing this defect and I can conclude that I merely have a defective disc. On Solid Serenade on disc 2, the appearance of Spike at approximately the 0:50 mark has the black definition lines on Spike’s form appearing in alternating pixels of black and white which gives the appearance of digital noise, and that the white dots were intended to be filled in. This goes on for a number of seconds and is not merely nitpicking on one frame of footage. It may be that this lack of definition of Spike’s form appeared on the original negative, however, the alternation of black and white dots has a digital appearance, not a film-like appearance. I have observed similar issues on several other shorts in this collection. I will emphasize that the defects are very short in duration in a 2 disc set nearly 5 hours in length. I do believe, however, that consumers in 2011 have come to expect better and more consistent use of digital enhancement, which is not always a bad thing, than is employed in this set.

 

Audio

 

The Dolby Digital Mono tracks are everything one could hope for on cartoon shorts from the 1940s. This may not be reference quality audio for 2011 but I have no criticism of the audio. There is none of the hiss, popping, or fluctuation in audio level that might reasonably be expected even in the original recordings. The audio is excellent for what it is: an accurate reproduction of 1940s theatrical without any of the possible flaws, which makes it probably much better than what you might have heard while watching these shorts in a theater in the 1940s.

 

Special Features

 

The studio has ported over the special features and commentaries prepared for the Spotlight Collections on DVD, in addition to a new feature created specially for this release. The special features are in 480p, with one exception as noted, and include all of the following:

 

Vaudeville, Slapstick and Tom and Jerry (22:47): This newly created featurette is in 1080p and includes participation from Jerry Beck and others.

 

How Bill and Joe Met Tom and Jerry (27:08): This featurette covers the fortunate union of Bill Hanna and Joe Barbera at the MGM Cartoon Studio.

 

The Comedy Styling of Tom and Jerry (5:30): Features discussion by animator Mark Kausler and MAD TV alums Nicole Parker and Ike Barinholtz.

 

The Midnight Snack Pencil Test (9:01): This plays back the original pencil test in real time with audio from the completed cartoon. Tom is still referred to as "Jasper" on the pencil test.

 

"Worry Song" from Anchors Aweigh (8:11): This is a clip from the 1945 feature film in which Jerry performs a dance with Gene Kelly.

 

The cartoon shorts with commentaries are as follows:

 

Puss Gets The Boot: One commentary with animator Mark Kausler and a second commentary with comedienne Nicole Parker and historian Earl Kress.

The Night Before Christmas: One commentary with author Michael Mallory and a second commentary with comedienne Nicole Parker and historian Earl Kress.

The Yankee Doodle Mouse: Commentary with author Michael Mallory.

The Zoot Cat: Commentary with author Jerry Beck.

Mouse Trouble: Commentary with author Michael Mallory

Quiet Please!: Commentary with animator Mark Kausler.

The Cat Concerto: Commentary with animator Eric Goldberg.

Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Mouse: One commentary with author Michael Mallory and a second commentary with comedienne Nicole Parker and historian Earl Kress.

Kitty Foiled: Commentary with author Jerry Beck.

 

Also included is an attractive illustrated booklet that serves as an index with a list of the shorts and special features on each disc. 

 

The packaging deserves honorable mention because it actually features character models of Tom and Jerry consistent with their appearance in the 1940s;  the studio has too often used generic modern style artwork on past releases that fails to reflect the original character designs. (For example, The Flintstones, Jetsons, and Jonny Quest season sets that had bland and unattractive modern designs on the packaging. The Looney Tunes Golden Collections also had unattractive modern-style artwork.)

The cover artwork here is appropriate to its era and pleasing to the eye.

 

Conclusion

 

The fact that these cartoons are presented uncensored and in chronological order for the first time is reason enough to pick up The Tom & Jerry Golden Collection Volume 1. The video presentation is not perfect but is still a quantum leap in quality over the Spotlight Collections, which suffered from an abundance of dirt and blemishes as well as censored audio replacing Lillian Rudolph’s original performance. I still believe that digital enhancement could have been applied more adroitly and consistently but those defects are minimal, and these shorts have never looked better on home video. The audio is as good as or better than theater audiences enjoyed in the 1940s, and the special features offer plenty of context from behind the scenes. The Tom & Jerry Golden Collection Volume 1 on Blu-ray is recommended to casual fans and cartoon aficianados alike, in spite of its video shortcomings.

post #2 of 74

Tim,

 

I have never been a fan of Tom & Jerry, however it is my hope that

fans will finally have the collection they have always wanted now that

these shorts are being released uncensored and in chronological order.

 

Thank you for the review.

post #3 of 74
According to a credible review, , ten of the shorts have been remastered from mediocre CRI sources and in general look worse than the Spotlight Collections and even the older laserdiscs. "Puttin on the Dog" in particular looks horrible.

Two steps forward, one stumble backwards, huh?
post #4 of 74
Spotlight Collection on Left, Golden Collection on right.

tnjcomp.png

This kind of regression in quality for a BLU-RAY is INEXCUSABLE.
post #5 of 74
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin Martinez View Post

Spotlight Collection on Left, Golden Collection on right.
tnjcomp.png
This kind of regression in quality for a BLU-RAY is INEXCUSABLE.

I'm baffled. Doesn't the picture from the Blu-ray on the right look better? Or is it the color which is wrong?
post #6 of 74
Quote:
Originally Posted by Douglas R View Post


I'm baffled. Doesn't the picture from the Blu-ray on the right look better? Or is it the color which is wrong?



It looks better to me and the color looks more correct without Tom looking like a blue cat.  Thanks for the review as I'll pick this up one day.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Crawdaddy

 

post #7 of 74
Quote:
Originally Posted by Douglas R View Post

I'm baffled. Doesn't the picture from the Blu-ray on the right look better? Or is it the color which is wrong?

Me too! It looks much better....and I'm fairly certain that Tom was never supposed to be blue. He was blue for my entire childhood, but those were screwed up TV prints. biggrin.gif
post #8 of 74
The source for the Blu-Ray looks like a faded Eastmancolor element. Look at how much detail is missing, particularly with Jerry and the dog mask. Look at how dead the foliage looks.

The Spotlight copy isn't perfect. The comparison is there just to show how much clarity and detail (and color) has been lost in the version Warner has assured us has been restored.
post #9 of 74
I have generally been in favor of using screenshots in judging picture quality, but how are we supposed to judge the clarity and detail of a Blu-ray from a screenshot that has been shrunk to less than 15% of its original size?
post #10 of 74
I'm sorry but i'd hardly class that external review as "credible."

As has been mentioned, these are 60-70 year old 'toons, where the best possible elements just don't exist anymore and so they are using the best of what exists.

Like the others, out of the two, I'd go for the right hand screenshot as being more accurate.

I've ordered my set and very much looking forward to seeing them again, thanks WB.

M
post #11 of 74
Quote:
the best of what exists.

That's obviously not true. The elements used to create the current Cartoon Network prints (and thus the copy on the Spotlight Collection I showcased above) for those ten cartoons are in much better shape, and those were also secondary elements.

Look at the guy's comparisons for Mouse Trouble (from an IB tech print). Look at all the disastrous changes in color.

TROUBLE-comparison.jpg

Why does the newer super-duper 1080p HD Blu-Ray use elements that are patently inferior to what was used for the previous unrestored DVD made with 10-year-old TV copies.
post #12 of 74
Thanks to the one guy for calling me out for a lack of credibility. I suppose you didn't dare assume that I simply know more about these cartoons, that I've handled original surviving nitrate elements, and also have a better idea of what exists on them than you do.

If you guys think that the copy of Puttin' on the Dog is how the cartoon is supposed to look like and that it's the best they can do, then by all means, continue thinking so. But I daresay your lack of skepticism and undying faith in WB is a little unnerving.
post #13 of 74
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThadK View Post

Thanks to the one guy for calling me out for a lack of credibility. I suppose you didn't dare assume that I simply know more about these cartoons, that I've handled original surviving nitrate elements, and also have a better idea of what exists on them than you do.
If you guys think that the copy of Puttin' on the Dog is how the cartoon is supposed to look like and that it's the best they can do, then by all means, continue thinking so. But I daresay your lack of skepticism and undying faith in WB is a little unnerving.



 

Well, we're sorry we disappointed you or made you unnerved.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Crawdaddy

post #14 of 74
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThadK View Post

Thanks to the one guy for calling me out for a lack of credibility. I suppose you didn't dare assume that I simply know more about these cartoons, that I've handled original surviving nitrate elements, and also have a better idea of what exists on them than you do.
If you guys think that the copy of Puttin' on the Dog is how the cartoon is supposed to look like and that it's the best they can do, then by all means, continue thinking so. But I daresay your lack of skepticism and undying faith in WB is a little unnerving.


LMFAO. You tell 'em, man.
post #15 of 74
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin Martinez View Post

LMFAO. You tell 'em, man.


Actually, he hasn't told us a thing so we're waiting for more information.

post #16 of 74
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Crawford View Post



Actually, he hasn't told us a thing so we're waiting for more information.

Actually, I did tell you, in the very external review that was mocked for lack of credibility. But I'll paste what I wrote here (I mean, that review is a lotta words, who has time to read all of it?):

"Unfortunately, this is not a perfect release. Unlike with other Tom & Jerry offerings, it’s not due to censorship. The huge plus in this release’s favor is the chronological and uncut presentation. Standards slipped however on the following ten cartoons, all mastered from lesser CRI elements (more on this later), so they fall very short of meeting the standards set by the other outstanding restorations contained therein. The quality ranges anywhere from serviceable to downright garbage quality. The tell-all sign is their retaining of the 1960s MGM lion logo (with no mention of Technicolor – because there was no intention of these versions ever replicating it).

Puss n’ Toots
The Bowling Alley Cat
Sufferin’ Cats
The Lonesome Mouse
The Zoot Cat
The Million Dollar Cat
Puttin’ on the Dog
Mouse Trouble
Quiet, Please!
The Milky Waif

I am not aware of all the inner-workings of this release. [Addendum: Because I wasn't there, I don't know why or how decisions were made as to what to use for each cartoon.] But, for the record, there is not a single set of CRI negatives for the MGM cartoons as has been perpetuated all over the Internet. Often, they have as many as two or three in existence. Some look amazing, as close to Technicolor as you can hope for, while some look absolutely putrid because they were made on the cheap (hence the later Metrocolor title cards). Puttin’ on the Dog in particular seems to be taken from faded Eastman elements. Seeing these versions mastered for Blu-Ray is akin to if WHV decided to remaster the old Turner material of the 1940s Warner shorts in high-def.

I know for a fact there are various CRI elements because MGM/UA Labs used them for the 16mm prints they distributed to TV stations and sold to collectors. Quality could vary wildly on the same title depending on how high on chemicals the lab technician was that day. Almost always, they looked absolutely fantastic. My print, struck in 1983, of Mouse Trouble looks wonderful, nothing like the embarrassing version seen on this latest release. Same goes for Lonesome Mouse and Quiet, Please!. On the other hand, some later 16s have passed through my hands that looked like hell because they were taken from what I’d like to call “Metrocolor” CRIs. One of them was Million Dollar Cat.

Perhaps it’s harsh to call the move of settling for the worser CRIs for some of the titles idiocy, but to invest thousands of dollars in brand new High-Definition transfers from source material that looks awful to begin with is pretty asinine. A lot can change in the thirty years since those pristine 16s were struck, but I have my doubts that the masters here were from the only CRI elements they had access to. Even the earlier Spotlight Collections looked better than the offending versions here. This is simply a continuation of WHV’s long pattern of ineptitude with the MGM cartoon library."
post #17 of 74
There you go. You heard it from the horse's mouth.
post #18 of 74
I can't believe that there's an animation release that makes the fans complain. That never happens.
post #19 of 74
Quote:
Originally Posted by TravisR View Post

I can't believe that there's an animation release that makes the fans complain. That never happens.

There are many where there's been no complaints of any sort. Most of the Disney Treasures and Looney Tunes Golden Collections are perfect. Tom & Jerry will be screwed for as long as time goes on, however.
post #20 of 74
Quote:
Originally Posted by TravisR View Post

I can't believe that there's an animation release that makes the fans complain. That never happens.

I can't believe TravisR has come into a thread which he has NOTHING to contribute to to complain about other people's complaining. That never happens.
post #21 of 74

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin Martinez View Post

There you go. You heard it from the horse's mouth.



We heard it from somebody's mouth.  I don't know this person nor his qualifications or expertise with these film elements.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Crawdaddy

 

post #22 of 74
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThadK 
There are many where there's been no complaints of any sort. Most of the Disney Treasures and Looney Tunes Golden Collections are perfect. Tom & Jerry will be screwed for as long as time goes on, however.

Yes, there are the rare times when fans don't complain. However, it happens so much that I and probably many others can't take the complaints seriously any more. Unfortunately, that means that actual problems will be ignored because of the times that things have blown out of proportion or the times that fans have cried wolf.

When the Looney Tunes sets Blu-ray, I'll be surprised if there isn't some 'horrible' defect discovered and ranted about.

EDIT: Just to clarify, you may be 100% right and I'll gladly take you at your word that you know what you're talking about but like I said, it's hard to take complaints about an animated release seriously any more.
post #23 of 74
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Crawford View Post







We heard it from somebody's mouth.  I don't know this person nor his qualifications or expertise with these film elements.







Crawdaddy

He's the one who compared his own IB Tech 16mm print with the copy on the new Blu-Ray to show you how bad the quality of the latter is. Doesn't that speak to his expertise a little?
post #24 of 74
So don't believe me. Live in a mousehole blind and watch pristine copies intermixed with 60s Eastman remasters without knowing the difference. Bye.
post #25 of 74
Quote:
Originally Posted by TravisR View Post

Yes, there is the rare time when fans don't complain. However, it happens so much that I and probably many others can't take the complaints seriously any more. Unfortunately, that means that actual problems will be ignored because of the times that things have blown out of proportion or the times that fans have cried wolf.
When the Looney Tunes sets Blu-ray, I'll be surprised if there isn't some 'horrible' defect discovered and ranted about.

Case in point. Hallmark of a guy with nothing to contribute.
post #26 of 74
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin Martinez View Post

Case in point. Hallmark of a guy with nothing to contribute.

While this thread would be just fine without my input, I think I make a point. You want people to know about a problem (and, I assume, hope that Warners will respond to the problems with a corrected disc) and I'm trying to tell you why it may be tougher than usual to get anyone to realize there is a problem.
post #27 of 74
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin Martinez View Post

Quote:
the best of what exists.
That's obviously not true. The elements used to create the current Cartoon Network prints (and thus the copy on the Spotlight Collection I showcased above) for those ten cartoons are in much better shape, and those were also secondary elements.
Look at the guy's comparisons for Mouse Trouble (from an IB tech print). Look at all the disastrous changes in color.
TROUBLE-comparison.jpg
Why does the newer super-duper 1080p HD Blu-Ray use elements that are patently inferior to what was used for the previous unrestored DVD made with 10-year-old TV copies.

The second set of screen caps show that the blu-ray is better - same as the first!

Tom is supposed to be grey/black - not blue - equally the paper in the book he's reading is white on the blu-ray edition and a shade of light blue on the dvd! It's also sharper and more film-like on the blu.

As for Thad's credibility, or not, all his site says is he's a freelance animation writer, who once worked on titles for a label that lost its disney franchise a few years ago - gemstone - it gives no real indication of his skills or knowledge, so I stand by my original comment.
post #28 of 74

What I really notice and I think others do also for animated films, shorts and the like is when we see the HD version when done correctly (Not saying these are or arent) but the main thing people notice is color saturation. We always recall watching cartoons as a kid etc and the colors were always turned up so much, when we see them (this is true with films also) the palette can look more restrained.

 

I recall a friend at work being dissapointed with Thief of Bagdad from Criterion against his old MGM DVD, and like I mentioned the transfer on the older release had the color much more saturated.

 

I hope I explained this decently.

 

 

post #29 of 74

Add me to the group that thinks the bluray pics look better. They look more "right" as far as colour and detail. I'm surprised the DVD shots look as faded as they do, I remember being impressed with them when they cam out. :P

 

As Mark mentioned, the white on the book looks white instead of bluey pink, that should be a pretty good indication that the colour is correct. Jerry is a proper brown and not orangy too.

 

Look forward to the set. :)

post #30 of 74
I know I called it quits, but maybe I'm finally getting what you're saying. You're overwhelmed with the clarity and sharpness that you think that's the truly better picture quality. Fair enough. The new transfers have a mark in their favor overall, as T&J have never had cleaner transfers. But let me ask you, why do you say the new pictures are 'accurate'? Are you sincerely saying they should look that dark and muddy? That's closer to the original picture? Really? So why are there cartoons from the same year that look absolutely fantastic, with popping colors, transfers I have gladly conceded are as perfect as we'll ever get?

The bottom line is, there _are_ better CRI elements than some of the ones used on this set. This _is_ a fact whether or not you want to believe it. (It's okay, whole cultures are based on that ideology.) WHV just dropped the ball on about 1/4 of the cartoons. The rest _are_ fantastic, perfect, and nobody should feel ripped off buying this regardless of the flaws given its ridiculously low price.

I know I'm wasting my time in general discussing this, but what galls me are the attacks, especially the armchair expert who stands by saying I have no credibility on this issue. I'm sure you, my friend, have handled and viewed various elements, including nitrate year-of-release positive prints, consulted with old pros who were in the MGM Labs for years, and asked to help with these releases (including the second volume of this very series!). Sometimes expertise isn't synonymous with income. Maybe I should update my profile page.
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