Vivendi and RHI Press Release: Laurel & Hardy: The Essential Collection - Page 3

It can make for a sharper DVD transfer, and when your flatscreen is under about 40" the difference is not going to be very dramatic anyway from across the room. But still, even with HD source transfers, for old films with some damage or artifacts remaining or some level of grain, DVD compression artifacts can easily rear their ugly head without a very careful consideration of bitrate and trying not to cram too much on a disc. I'm sure RHI/Vivendi would do a proper job of that though, I just think the value proposition for many of us who already have the UK box set would be enhanced if we could get these in HD. Not to take away from other releases but to me L&H is so much more and as much or more deserving of such a release.

A bit late to thread, but absolutely excited about this news! As a long, long time fan of L&H, I have waited on pins and needles for literally the better part of the last ten years (since I've been building my DVD collection) for a comprehensive L&H release in R1. I have deliberately avoided the probably quite acceptable out-of-region releases simply because I always worried that they would eventually be usurped by a R1 release, but after several years it seemed that I would have no choice but to go multi-regional if I ever wanted a good collection of their films. Still it always seemed an impossibility to me that a R1 set would never come along, given the relative stature of L&H among film fans, so I am glad that I waited.

Beyond that, it's good to see so many enthusiasts (and experts) about L&H here on the forum. Not that it entirely surprises me, given the older film-centric demographic of posts here, but it's good to see that L&H are still relevant to many besides me in this day and age. I have been a fan since a kid, first seeing some of their shorts at the local Shakey's Pizza, and then later many of their features on TV, and at a neighbor's who had an 8mm projector and many of the Blackhawk releases available at the time. When I was 14, I picked up John McCabe's great "Every Film They Ever Made" book, just about the most comprehensive synopsis of all their films. And since getting into collecting films on DVD (over 3600 titles at the moment), I have picked up just about everything of theirs available in R1. So a longtime L&H buff here, and gratified to soon be owning a (hopefully) great collection of all their sound work - a real dream come true for me, after all these years.

 

Oh my goodness....I thought I was the only one who remembered L&H at Shakey's.  Great times!  (And great thin crust pizza that went downhill and into near oblivion but that's another story).   They were a staple of TV for the longest time also before disappearing.  I never had a 8mm or 16mm projector but our local library had tons of the Blackhawk prints that I wished we could play.  Some fortunate collector probably wound up with those as the library weeded them out.

 

There has been mention of the UCLA restorations.  I've been fortunate to see the WAY OUT WEST restoration (35mm) and if it is any indication of things to come over the next several years, we will be in for a treat.  I'll gladly wait for a BD release if/when UCLA completes this project.
 

 

What's the argument for buying this over getting a region free player (as low as $30 on Amazon) and importing the R2 set? From what I can tell, the R2 set is at least properly packaged, so there wouldn't be concerns about getting damaged discs due to plastic-free packaging.

Portability - I have the UK set but only can play it on one player in the house.  This set will play anywhere, including on my main display and will upconvert via the BD player.

 

Improved transfers (these are all using HD transfers for the first time)

 

The UK set included an edited version of Blockheads and a nasty splice in the Trail of the Lonesome Pine sequence. Those will be corrected and many of the shorts will have the original titles includded. 

 

The UK set takes up a lot more room and the disc count is inflated with worthless (to me) badly colorized versions. 

 

This set will help reintroduce L&H to a new generation of fans and remind longer term fans why they were fans to begin with thus increasing their exposure and hopefully providing more funding to UCLA to do their restorations.

 

Buying American.

 

And the list goes on.  The above is not intended to slam the UK set.  It was much appreciated at a time with L&H was sorely missing in R1.  I plan on keeping mine and displaying it.   However given that this will use better transfers, more complete prints, and is value priced (currently $69.99 on Amazon and I bet it can be found cheaper via Sam's Club) this is a no brainer.  RHI is actively using L&H scholars like Mr. Bann and Mr. Skretvedt to plan and participate in this release thus ensuring it will be a high quality release using the right prints with the right title sequences.

The only hang up for me is the packaging, which really is regrettable for a set like this. If it only had standard plastic holders, I would have pre-ordered this the second I could have. But after a bad experience with the I Love Lucy complete set (which also was plastic-free), it makes me think twice. I'm also an old school wrestling fan and some of those sets used sleeves and I've resisted buying those because there are multiple reviews of them where discs were received scratched or even cracked. For pricey sets like those and this, it doesn't strike me as a great risk. It won't matter how well the material looks if the discs are compromised by cheap packaging.

I guess the WILD, WILD, WEST set was also done in by comparable packaging though I don't have it.

http://www.amazon.com/review/R3O2LK3U8P1CR9/ref=cm_srch_res_rtr_alt_8

PAL Speedup....no other reason needed

You will only get PAL speed-up if your TV can go to 25 fps and the player does go to that speed. If the player downsyncs the DVD to 24 fps, however, you also won't have a speed-up.

 

There's much misinformation floating around about the "PAL-speedup".

 

 

Cees

The UK set is very good, but the compression from cramming 4 hours per disc sometimes takes it toll on the image quality.

As for the packaging, I really wish more studios would adopt thinpaks in a slipcase. It's extremely classy on Flicker Alley's Chaplin Keystone set and Criterion's Eclipse collections. Kino even used Blu thinpaks on the new Keaton Shorts set.

Sony did their Stooges sets similar to that. Heck, even 5 cases with 2 discs each (like Sony did with Icons of Screwball Comedy) would have been more than fine.

The UK set uses dual layer DVDs, about 2 hours per layer, which is fine. The compression artifacts are caused by the rough condition of some of the films and limitations of DVD's old MPEG-2 compression and the format's supported bitrates.

European sets include the silents. This set does not.

The only way to access the silents officially over here is through the long out of print Lost Films of Laurel and Hardy.

Luckily, I don't have a problem with "PAL-Speedup" (or NTSC-slowdown). I suspect for many people if you do a blindfold test- they will hear a difference.l  A few years, I bought in the US for someone , the NTSC version of the BBC Planet Earth. The timing of it agree exactly with the PAL version.

Halelulah! I didn't think a set like this would ever come out in Region 1.

I'm glad to see that the films seem to be offered in chronological order. I am also excited that there are foreign-language versions included as I have never seen them before. "Los calaveras" was mentioned. I hope "Politiquerías" is also included as I've heard this is very different than "Chickens Come Home".

But the important thing is that the core films are finally coming out properly and in H-D, no less. I generally don't pre-order but this will likely be an exception.

Would it be too much to dream of a Charley Chase set?

I certainly hope so. Now that RHI has finally gotten a competent distributor/parent company, I look forward in seeing if other Hal Roach comedies get released. I believe Charley Chase is the only other marketable comedy series that could get its own set, though I'm sure they could release others in some sort "Slapstick Classics" collection or such.

I would love to see a Charley Chase collection, especially those rare 1928-1929 films that are rarely every shown. I have heard that many of the soundtracks for the early talkies have been found in recent years... it would be great to see them synced up with the film and released on DVD.

If we cant get a big Charley Chase set, I would settle for a "Hal Roach" themed series of DVD with Chase mixed in with Thelma Todd/Zasu Pitts and Boy Friends shorts.

The main reason, aside from buying American, is that these are entirely new transfers made from the best surviving film elements in the world. Here is the definitive statement from Richard W. Bann, who has been working on all aspects of this set for well over a year:

LAUREL & HARDY VIVENDI PRESS RELEASE ADDENDA

Having been besieged with inquiries, e-mails, and phone calls yesterday and today, there is only time for a fast summary response in hopes of clarifying some few details beyond what was conveyed in the much more official Vivendi press release.

First, no colorization. Second, no silents. Third, we do have all the sound shorts and features still part of the HRS library, including all extant foreign versions, except for the Spanish PARDON US. [The French "Blotto" and German "L&H Murder Case are not included.]

Fourth, or number four, or quatro, as the case may be, if you are serious about understanding what’s happening here, please read the four part essay on film preservation at www.laurel-and-hardy.com.

Once you comprehend everything there, I can add (or repeat) that we spent millions of dollars (bought with Euros) painstakingly restoring and preserving the Hal Roach library between 1985 and 2002. The work was done for the copyright proprietor in the Eastern Hemisphere, CCA, which licensed the Universal boxed set in England. We did this work in Los Angeles at Film Tech, relying primarily on the nitrate that came out of the HRS Culver City vaults and its labs and its storage depots on the East Coast in the 1960s that were subsequently housed for years at the LOC before we pulled everything out of there and brought it all back to Los Angeles to do this project, before I finally steered these same elements to UCLA where they reside today. And as Hal Roach would ask if he were explaining this, “Is that clear?”

As we labored long at Film Tech, we sent both a 35mm fine grain and 35mm dupe neg overseas to Munich, and offered a twin of the fine grain to RHI in Los Angeles, at cost. They elected to take fine grains on all the sound Our Gangs and Laurel & Hardys, which were supposed to last from here to eternity (1953). Almost immediately, however, RHI (including when it was controlled by Hallmark, now happily out of the picture) proceeded to misplace or lose a bunch of them. Hence the several unpleasant circumstances surrounding the Our Gang DVD release by the ironically named Genius Products, LLC. Leonard Maltin and I tried to tell them…they wouldn’t listen. So now they’re out of business.

RHI’s new licensee, however, is Vivendi. We made sure that this time RHI physically turned over to Vivendi’s standards conversion house the 35mm fine grains I gave them originally, and for the ones they lost or misplaced we got access to the corresponding duplicate 35mm film elements in Munich.

That leads to the answer many want to get at: yes, these are newly performed conversions of 35mm fine grains. We did not rework old tape masters. We went back to Kodak Fine Grain Film. F-I-L-M. So we did not start with video; we started with film, the kind with sprockets. Plus, the new masters derived therefrom have indeed been digitally enhanced, so that these subjects can be presented in superb Hi-Def for the first time anywhere by anyone.

Are they perfect? No. Are you perfect? Probably not. Joe E. Brown said it for everyone, “Nobody’s perfect.” Is any little frame missing? Is anything missing? What are you missing? Do you look as good as you did 80 years ago? Do you notice any new lines and abrasions? Are you as sharp as you were 40 years ago? How about 10 years ago? How much is a digital enhancement going to improve any of us?

So, again, brand new film transfers in High Definition using the same 35mm fine grains we created between 1985 and 2002 from the best surviving nitrate preprint material we could locate anywhere in the world. Plus digital cleanup, digitally enhanced. In addition, we have also just restored – again, for the first time ever, anywhere – all of the original, authentic distributor opening title card sequences with their unique and imaginative design, so coveted by fans for so long. Including by me, as my old boss Kent D. Eastin of Blackhawk Films could testify if he were still here.

The Vivendi DVDs are not connected to the new, long term project now just beginning at UCLA, which will first have to raise the money for this task, then do the work. WAY OUT WEST and HELPMATES were done within the last few years, and I believe SCRAM! is next in line. So the worthwhile but lengthy and arduous UCLA effort is only beginning. In any case, remember the copyright rests with CCA and RHI in their respective halves of the world, not with UCLA.

I hope all that will answer some of the key concerns.

Finally, some comments on UCLA’s project, and the essay they asked me to write, the full version of which, as mentioned, appears on our website in Munich.

All of us want to believe we are doing something useful with our lives, something that matters, something that leaves lasting marks. Something that speaks to future generations, to show we were here, and made a difference. Time travel is an important component of my attraction to classic films. Did all that talent in these great Hal Roach comedies realize they were communicating with millions of people not yet born at that time? Those of us who receive that communication today and in the future...how can we respond? What should we do?

We want to let these artists and technicians know they didn't do all that work for nothing. That we enjoy and honor the entertainment value offered, and that we treasure the living history they have unwittingly given us. And one meaningful thing we can do and one way we can respond is to support film preservation efforts. It is important to do so. Yes my essay will make some fans cringe. The story is painful; in fact it is worse than you know. I softened and concealed some of the worst incidents. And yes it is easy for us to look back and criticize the careless custodians of these treasures. The studios, the distributors, the exhibitors, and all those people weren’t perfect. We are not perfect, either. In fact we have some responsibility here too, because we have an opportunity now to be part of the film preservation effort at UCLA. To make another run at saving these films, from a different point of view. The more preservation the better. Corporate preservation in Munich. Institutional preservation in Los Angeles. This second opportunity is something all of us can get involved in, at any level of participation.

If these films mean something to you, please do get involved. Or, as recruiting Sergeant Tom Kennedy said so eloquently in PACK UP YOUR TROUBLES, “How about it?”

Meanwhile, if laughter is what you are after, sit back; relax in depth, anticipating that very soon you will be able to enjoy the best of all shows – the immortal Hal Roach comedies of Laurel & Hardy. This cherished collection brings them all back, into exceedingly sharp focus. They look better than ever.

-- Richard W. Bann

I recently checked Amazon and while the Lost Films DVDs are out of print, a few of them appear to be currently in stock at the moment (as in "really" in stock, not through Marketplace sellers). Right now Vol. 3 is "on sale" for $19.03, but it says they only have 4 in stock. This is actually one of the more "essential" volumes, including:

Liberty (one of the best silents with a great synchronized Victor score, and oddly, starts with the M-G-M lion followed by Film Classics titles)
We Faw Down (a short built around a scene shot for Liberty but deleted from the final released version, these are kind of fun to view back-to-back)
Lucky Dog (L&H's very first film together)
Love 'Em And Weep (original version of the film remade as Chickens Come Home with James Finlayson in the Hardy role)
Along Came Auntie (Glen Tryon silent short with Oliver Hardy)
Bromo And Juliet (Charley Chase silent short with Oliver Hardy)

Volumes 4, 7 and the "unofficial" tenth volume (Laurel And Hardy And Friends) also are available "new" at varying prices, but much less than "resale" prices. The latter is a compilation of talkies including an unedited version of the Our Gang short Bear Shooters (though it has the wrong M-G-M lion fanfare, but I guess you can't have everything) and Charley Chase's Whispering Whoopee. They are not perfect, but I'm glad I snagged these when they were available.

(Volume 7 includes their first talkie, Unaccustomed As We Are, and a 1960s redubbed "talking" version of the silent Double Whoopee. Volume 4 includes They Go Boom! and an alternate silent version of Unaccustomed. As of yet it isn't clear if these two talkies will be on the Essential set -- they appear to be under different ownership in the US -- so these might be worth grabbing while you can.)

A "heads up" for those who are still looking for these!
Edited by Mark Y - 7/24/11 at 6:57am

Hey everyone, listen to Randy Skretvedt and stop all the negativeity. I just registered at this site so that I could make a couple of points.
First, I read over and over again about the packageing. What a bunch of worry worts. I recently bought the blu-ray set of the Alien movies. I believe that the way they are packaged is very similar. They slide in and out. The backing from were they slid is very smooth. My discs are niether broken nor scratched. But if after I buy the this set if I am concerened I can either keep them somewhere else or use my Antistatic cd (or dvd) sleeves sold by www.dustygroove.com that wrap around cds and dvds and protect them from scatching.
Second, I have the L&H UK box set also. Okay fine, now I will spend $70 more and get a wonderful upgrade on the Hal Roach sound features and shorts. These wonderful movies will be in better condition than I have ever seen them before. Life is short guys. I'm going to spend that $70 and get something that is really great. Something that I will enjoy for the rest of my life.

Because they can hold more information as in the recently released Rathbone-Bruce versions of Sherlock Holmes. And because they're less prone to scratches.

This film does have both but not as a pair. The "star" is Laurel, I read somewhere that it was long after this film that they became a pair. This film is not on

the UK set but on the german, I expect in a few days to post my german blurb . I don't consider it to be a rehash of the dutch site. This film was on one of the german disks but as an easter egg! It can be gotten in another disk (I assume also in the UK. I will post it more to indicate what is available rather than someone wanting to purchase the disk.

If it's being produced on 10 dual-layer DVD's then it should be fine. There won't be any silents or colorized versions and NTSC resolution is 20% smaller than PAL resolution so more bits are used for each frame.

TCM earlier this year aired both "Unaccustomed as We Are" and "They Go Boom" as part of their run of LAUREL & HARDY shorts and features. They were suppled by RHI along with the sound other shorts (one or both had BLACKHAWK FILMS title cards!). So it's a situation where both parties have the rights to these talkies. (Something to do with the fact there were silent versions of both as well,. although the original silent "They go Boom" no longer exists.!)

That's interesting, thanks. The history of the "split" ownership of the Hal Roach library and specifically the Laurel & Hardy films is a complicated but interesting (at least to me) subject. In the "Eastern Hemisphere" it's all under one roof. As I understand it, Unaccustomed As We Are and They Go Boom were not part of the TV packages prior to 1986 at all. I know in the case of the former, the soundtrack discs were missing and not discovered until the late 1970s. Not sure what the deal was with the latter. If I recall correctly, Unaccustomed As We Are was included in the 1986 Laurel And Hardy Show TV package, but They Go Boom was not (a couple other talkie shorts were left out of that package too). (Right?) Neither title was among those released on Beta and VHS by The Nostalgia Merchant in the 1980s -- The Hoose-Gow was included on a tape with three other Hal Roach shorts starring other comedians and The Nostalgia Merchant never released The Chimp at all. I don't believe Unaccustomed or Boom ever aired on the AMC cable channel, though as mentioned above both were shown as part of a TCM marathon earlier this year. They Go Boom had some weird "produced on video" titles with the "modern" Hal Roach Studios name (not Blackhawk) -- I know HRS released it as part of a (post-Nostalgia Merchant) VHS series along with a few of the "cut-down" shorts edited from the feature films such as Doughboy Daze and Where To Now.

As far as the "silent versions" stipulation -- I remember reading some newsgroup posts (if I recall correctly, by one of the two L&H authors who have posted in this thread -- by the way, I have both authors' books and they are essential) that Feiner & Co. managed to successfully claim rights to certain films like Charley Chase's On The Wrong Trek (in which L&H have a brief cameo) due to creative interpretation of wording in a contract to the effect that they were granted rights to all of Laurel & Hardy's "non-speaking" films. Supposedly, Our Gang's Wild Poses has been added to that list for the same reason. Regardless of how "legitimate" these claims may or may not have been, at the time I was pleased because certain films ended up being released which otherwise would have remained unavailable in the US at the time, so that was fine with me!

Another advantage I'll like with the new set is that all the films will be in chronological order. This will make it much easier to locate individual titles you may want to find. I didn't like the way the shorts and features were all mixed up together by "themes" on different discs in the UK set.

Does anyone have a list of the movies included on this set and possibly what is on each disc? I'm dying to see exactly what we are getting.

Edit: Ryan's informative post below supercedes this one (Thanks, Ryan!)

Edited by Steve...O - 7/26/11 at 4:52pm

Disc by disc rundown, via Lou Lumenick of the NY Post -

And finally, here's a complete breakdown for the 10-disc "The Essential Laurel and Hardy'' set that will be released by RHI and Vivendi on October 27. It includes all of their surviving talkie features and shorts at the Hal Roach studios, excluding "The Devil's Brother'' and "Bonnie Scotland'' (still in print from Warner) and "Babes in Toyland'' (available from MGM under its reissue title "March of the Wooden Soldiers''). I understand two additional films in which the team appears -- MGM's oddball all-star revue "Hollywood Party'' and the Roach-produced Patsy Kelly vehicle "Pick a Star'' -- may be available from WAC by the end of the year as well.

DISC 1:
UNACCUSTOMED AS WE ARE 1929
BERTH MARKS 1929
MEN O' WAR 1929
PERFECT DAY 1929
THEY GO BOOM 1929
THE HOOSE-GOW 1929
NIGHT OWLS 1930
LADRONES (Night Owls, Spanish) 1930
BLOTTO 1930

DISC 2:
LA VIDA NOCTURNA (Blotto, Spanish) 1930
BRATS 1937
BRATS 1930 ORIGINAL VERSION 1930
BELOW ZERO 1930
TIEMBLA Y TITUBEA (Below Zero, Spanish) 1930
HOG WILD 1930
THE LAUREL & HARDY Murder Case 1930
NOCHE DE DUENDES (The Laurel-Hardy Murder Case & Berth Marks, Spanish) 1930
ANOTHER FINE MESS 1930

DISC 3:
BE BIG! 1931
CHICKENS COME HOME 1931
Politiquerias (Chickens Home, Spanish) 1931
LAUGHING GRAVY 1931
LES CAROTTIERS (Be Big! & Laughing Gravy, French) 1931

DISC 4:
LOS CALAVERAS (Be Big! & Laughing Gravy, Spanish) 1931
OUR WIFE 1931
PARDON US (extended version) 1931
COME CLEAN 1931
ONE GOOD TURN 1931
BEAU HUNKS 1931

DISC 5:
HELPMATES 1932
ANY OLD PORT 1932
THEMUSIC BOX 1932
THE CHIMP 1932
COUNTY HOSPITAL 1932
SCRAM! 1932
PACK UP YOUR TROUBLES 1932
THEIR FIRST MISTAKE 1932

DISC 6:
TWICE TWO 1933
ME AND MY PAL 1933
THE MIDNIGHT PATROL 1933
BUSY BODIES 1933
DIRTY WORK 1933
SONS OF THE DESERT 1933
OLIVER THE EIGHTH 1934
GOING BYE-BYE! 1934

DISC 7:
THEM THAR HILLS 1934
THE LIVE GHOST 1934
TIT FOR TAT 1935
THE FIXER UPPERS 1935
THICKER THAN WATER 1935
THE BOHEMIAN GIRL 1936

DISC 8:
OUR RELATIONS 1936
WAY OUT WEST 1937
SWISS MISS 1938

DISC 9:
BLOCK-HEADS 1938
A CHUMP AT OXFORD - Shorter 1940
A CHUMP AT OXFORD - Longer 1940
SAPS AT SEA 1940

DISC 10:
SPECIAL FEATURES
A Tribute to Laurel & Hardy
On Location with Boys: Virtual Tour of set location and interactive map
Laurel & Hardy Guest Appearances
Laurel & Hardy Trailers

Read more: http://www.nypost.com/p/blogs/movies/dvd_extra_more_southwest_noir_kMtGgEiqkYCxU5baQb9UPL#ixzz1TEv5ye00
Edited by rdf8585 - 7/26/11 at 3:50pm

Thanks! Glad the speculation over the talkies in the "Lost Films" collections being included can be put to rest. I don't know offhand if there are any new foreign shorts in this new collection. Does not look like it. Still great to get a final list, though.

I'm thinking there is more behind the "Guest Appearances" special feature. Could this include more cameo shorts, or just clips of their appearances?

I'm missing TOWED IN A HOLE from the list above... Should be between THEIR FIRST MISTAKE 1932 and TWICE TWO 1933...