Can't Whip up enthusiam for Blu Ray

Personally I don't like to stream anything for a movie, ie: Netflix, ITunes, On Demand, etc. I would rather have the disc in hand and play it back through my system anytime I want. Other than the video what does it for me is the audio from DTS MA and Dolby Digital. And with the prices dropping and many movies coming in some sort of dual format with both the regular DVD and the Blu-ray in one set for me it is a no brainer.

I'll buy discs until I have absolutely no other option. I know I'm certainly not the average consumer though. I don't have an interest in most of the technological advances of the last 10 or 15 years (I think the people in Wall E are a frighteningly accurate vision of what the future will be like) but I realize that eventually I'll be forced to buy into downloading/streaming someday.

I felt the same way about Blu-ray even long before it made an appearance: I have tons of DVDs that I'm mostly satisfied with, why would I want to go throught it all again, replacing everything to a format that may or may not offer some improvement in picture quality, audio,. etc. I think for some people the lure of the format is the opportunity to see their favorite B-movies make the leap to hi-def, not so much the mainstream, disposable movies that are only good for viewing once. This is the kind of stuff you'll see at Walmart and Best Buy by the bucketfuls and to me that just isn't very exciting. If you're looking for The Toolbox Murders, a Lucio Fulci flick or an early-70's crime thriller you're not gonna have much luck finding those at Walmart and this is the stuff I crave on Blu-ray. I have 100+ BDs, most of which I love but I still suffer from sticker shock every time I'm browsing at BB so pricing is also a factor when deciding what I purchase.

I have more of a love/hate relationship with Blu-ray.

On the one hand, I see the difference in quality and so
much enjoy watching a really well-mastered transfer on

that format over DVD any day.  The most recent "WOW"
transfer I have seen was Gangs of New York.  I defy
anyone to compare that to anything on DVD.

Watching remastered classics on the format is also
a treat.  Take a look at any of the classic Warner Bros.
Blu-ray releases and watch in amazement as something
that looks as if it were shot in present day.

What I don't like about Blu-ray is the format itself.
Load times on a standalone player are ridiculous unless
you opt to buy a $500 Oppo player or a PS3. It can take
up to 4 minutes for a title to start playing once loaded
in the player. Also, I noticed some players will just not
play a certain studio title.

Finally, pricing is all over the map.  Fortunately, most
studios have gotten new release prices down to $20
through Amazon.  However, to see one or two studios
releasing titles near the $30 pricepoint is the one thing
that deters me from purchase. 
 
 

I was initially very excited about HD media, but in the last few months my buying has dropped off to almost nothing.  I attribute it to several factors:
1) I'm older, and frankly less excited about things in general;
2) Frozen salary + higher expenses = less extra spending money;
3) Wife and daughter aren't that interested in movies anymore, so it's just me;
4) Since last year's glut (Trek, NxNW etc.), there aren't many releases upcoming that I'm interested in, but I'm eagerly awaiting more Hitchcock and would love some classic noir titles.

Doug

Quote: Honestly, if every movie is "dark and dreary" and looks "barely better than DVD", I'm inclined to think that's a display issue.  The number of transfers that are that bad are almost literally a handful--we're talking the Gladiator/original Gangs of New York/Dark City kind of stuff, presumably--while most everything else has a very noticeable upgrade in quality.  Even before I moved from a 50" LCOS to 58" plasma, the differences between the DVD (even upconverted) and Blu-ray were immediately apparent.  And, if anything, transfers have been more consistently done recently than they were previously.  The occasional stinkers when it comes to transfers are much fewer and far between, and unlike DVD, the filmmakers seem willing to move quicker on fixing their mistakes.

I'm not in a big hurry to replace my SD DVDs (unless I already know they will be frequent repeat viewing titles AND the price is right) but anything I don't already have but want to own that is available on BD gets purchased that way.  Although, with a wedding this summer, one year of expensive private school for my son (misses the cutoff for kindergarten at the local public board but needs the academic stimulation sooner rather than later) starting in September as well as a big backlog of unwatched discs (SD DVD, HD DVD and BD) in the "man-cave", I foresee a dramatic drop in buying in 2010.  Not because of any lack of appreciation for BD's inherent quality, though.

I'm with Ron on the love/hate relationship. I love the way the films look and sound on BD, but hate the added load times, inability to skip all the previews on some titles, and inability to resume Java-encoded discs. BD is really not a consumer-friendly format, IMO.

Personally, while I have upgraded quite a few titles from SD-DVD to BD over the past 18 months, I have been much more selective in which titles I purchase than I did in my SD-DVD buying days. Also, I am doing something I never did with SD-DVD -- renting, instead of blind buying a film I have not yet seen. I still blind buy occasionally if I really think I will like the film based on past works (such as Pixar films, etc.), but if there is any doubt, the title gets rented instead. Most of my BD purchases have been of personal favorite films.

I own currently 121 Blu-Rays, on 4/5 of these the PQ and SQ is fantastic, occasionally I get a flat transfer like Stallone's "First Blood" which was no better than the DVD

and 450+ DVDs

the DVD's are cheap to buy, I often pick them up second hand GBP£2, or new GBP£3-6

the Blu-Ray pricing has really dropped, buying on-line from merchants like Play they are GBP£5-15, and second hand GBP£5-10


I have a LG BD-370 Blu-Ray player, load times are no different to my previous LG DVD player, although I sometimes find the navigation of special features a bit harder to work out, compared to DVD

the DVD upscaling my Blu-Ray offers means that most of my DVD titles look VERY good on my LG 1080P flat screen television


I will continue to buy both formats - I have picked my favourite films on blu-rays and films I enjoy but do not consider "classics" on DVD

as an example, today I picked up 2001 Space Odyssey on Blu, and on DVD ; 2010, Boiler Room and Spielberg's 1941 Special Edition

there are films I *love* but cannot get on Blu - Katheryn Bigelow's "Strange Days" and Cronenberg's "Existenz"


I also watch alot of Div-X DLs on my system - the LG Blu is Dix-X compatible which was a prime consideration when choosing a player

here in the UK, we often get the best US tv shows a year or two after the US - I am currently watching Dollhouse Season 2 and Sons of Anarchy Season 2, both on Div-X DL

but in case anyone is concerned, I have purchased Dollhouse S1 and SOA S1 on DVD, and already pre-ordered both second seasons of both shows....

....I am totally happy to pay good money for release, but if I cannot get them due to licensing / regional snafnu's I will DL and buy as soon as available (perhaps something the movie and TV companies have not figured out about consumers who DL)

The thing I'm enjoying about Blu-rays, besides the superior image on my favorite films, is that my SD collection had already peaked out on everything I wanted that was available, but I still enjoy collecting, so it's keeps me in collecting mode, but on a much slower (and affordable) pace. As soon as I hear one of my library going Blu, I trade in the SD version (and usually a few others), so that I can anticipate picking it up the BD at some future release date. The hobby lives!

Guess I'm in the solid "love it" camp with BD, with a couple of natural differences between this transition, and transitions of the past.

DVD was the first format with a vast catalogue and prices that were affordable for most people. Those are the reasons I wound up with a large library. With VHS and LD, the prices were much higher (astronomical in today's dollars) and catalogues more limited, so choices were made more carefully. Unlike the latter half of the DVD boom, there weren't marketing forces in place to convince people that they naturally should own every movie that's released. 

I'm back to that more selective mode, not because prices are too high because they're not (see above remark), but because of the way titles are marketed to us. I simply grew very, very tired of feeling like a fool, after seeing so many titles with their street price cut nearly in half, a few weeks to a few months after release. I have more time than money, and will wait for the price to drop. After seeing it happen too many times, my position is absolutely firm. I'm a collector, this is a hobby, and that's the way it is.

The only reason I accrued a large DVD library was because prices were right at the time, for the title in question. I don't feel victimized by format changes, as long as the replacement format offers higher quality each time, which it has. I bought the DVD in question because it seemed like a good deal...I enjoyed the disc...when it's time for a replacement I feel is warranted, I sell the old one to a friend for a handful of bucks to help defray the cost of the upgrade. 

I haven't found much to complain about. From where we stand, we're closer than ever to having a presentation that's as close, and many cases better, than a theatrical presentation. I really don't get people who are not jazzed by 1080p...with, of course, a very few exceptions. Some people aren't hard-wired to see much difference...for others, it simply doesn't matter. That's fine, that's why it's a hobby. And from a hobby standpoint, I see very few reasons to grouse about the state of things. 

Maybe that's not what people want to hear.

My DVD/BD collection is really my only significant hobby, so I'm thoroughly on board.

 So far as the $8 to $10 bin at Wal-mart and elsewhere: the only thing that chaps me, is the fact that I paid $18 to $23 each for many of those titles when they were released. Hence, the self-imposed wait time on almost every release.

It's a fantastic time for people starting a BD library. I'm envious.  

Maybe it depended on where one was living at then time, but I recall plenty of VHS titles under thirty bucks, not just stuff that was no longer "priced for rental". (And there were VHS bargain bins long before DVD as well.) I usually paid about thirty or forty bucks for a Laserdisc that wasn't a Criterion, or one of Fox's Widescreen Editions. (Boy, did they ever stick it to us OAR fans!) And both formats still have plenty of titles that have never seen the light of day on a shiny little disc either. I still chuckle at the griping about prices today when I recall what I paid for a LD with no extra features or widescreen!

Withe the exception of Star Wars and LOTR Extended editions, I will not be updating anything in my current library. ^00 discs is toomany to even think about replacing. My wifestill gets mad when she sees unopened DVDs. The explanation that it's how I keep track of what I haven't watched only makes her see red.

That being said, Anything I do buy is now on Blu. I have a PS3, so I do not experience these load issues that everyone else is having. I am buying way less than I used to on DVD. One is the price factor. Another is now that my kids are in middle school and enetering college, I find myself running around to events and just don't have time to watch movies much anymore.


I am using netflix as well to stream movies, but only because they are free...I wouldn't pay for that service, but it's nice for watching B movies or older TV shows

I am/have a little bit of what everybody mentioned above.

I'm a bit more selective than I used to be w/ DVD, but not nearly as selective as I anticipated, so I already accumulated a BD collection in the upper-300's w/in just 2 years and change -- of course, quite a few of those titles are really only in my collection because of the kids.  And no, I don't normally just run out and buy titles during release week either, so I probably avg something like ~$15 or so per title (other than the few TV series I own) after factoring whatever coupons, discounts, etc. (though I still have never made use of a $10 upgrade rebate yet due precisely to the collector's personae in me ).

Yeah, this is definitely a hobby and can get expensive very quickly depending on how one approaches it.  However, the pragmatic personae in me also fights back and tries to keep things as reasonable as possible while the rationalizer in me tries to negotiate the whole conflict by downplaying the costs (vs other potential hobby costs) and upplaying the hobby sharing aspect -- at least it's a hobby that can be shared w/ my loved ones, some friends, etc.  

And yeah, I'm back to renting some (in spurts) like I did during the early days of DVD -- before it became too easy to own every DVD at a serious bargain price.

And yeah, the format can be annoying just like everyone else said.  And I've used a PS3 for most of the time so far, and even *THAT* really ain't as fast and easy for BD as a decent DVD player can be for DVD just for basic movie playback, etc. though not all DVD players are fast -- actually, most of the more recent DVD players I've tried can be pretty sluggish and/or user-unfriendly  too.  I guess that's "progress" for yah...

_Man_

I have a love/hate relationship too. I love the picture quality and hate the fact that most of my favorite movies are not even scheduled for a Blu-ray release!

Well, I had stopped buying DVD movies a long time ago. With the purchase of an HDTV and a blu-ray player (it took a lot of hem-hawing and some back and forth tug of war) to get me to purchase an HD player. I have to agree with the HTF Owners that I'm still somewhat hesitant. The problem is that premium retailers (such as FYE) sell Blu-rays at full retail ($35-40) while discount/big box retailers like Target, Best Buy, Walmart sell older movies/releases for $20 while keeping the $30 price point on recent movie releases that have made their run through the theaters.

It's sad that movie studios and the retail industry cannot come up with an across the board price point and insist on gouging consumers for new releases. I just won't spend $20-30 for a Blu-ray release. The few Blu-rays that I have purchased, which I have purchased about ten Blu-rays since I bought my Blu-ray player about a week ago, I've paid between $10-15 for these titles. Even then, there are only certain movies that I'd probably purchase. Blu-ray prices are still hinkey and I think this is some collaboration between movie studios and the entertainment industry.

Here in the UK I have easy access to an off-shore retailer called 'Play' who I buy all my brand new Blu-Rays from - they cost me 1/2 the price of taking a walk to high-street retailers in London, buying on-line I will wait a few days for shipping but its otherwise great.

I often make great savings if I pre-order titles in advance, LOTR and Saving Private Ryan on Blu are both incoming examples


the retail market in the UK is changing very quickly, major retail chains like "Borders" and "Zavvi" (formerly Virgin Megastore) both went backrupt during the past year or so, leaving only HMV and Blockbuster (rental stores who also retail disc)

Blockbuster is currently struggling with a bloated store portfolio, staff overheads and massive competition from on-line retailers, and word is it may not last another year in its current guise

I get a surprising amount of my Blu-Ray second-hand from dedicated trading stores here in London

I've been surprised how much the prices have dropped in the past year for second-hand Blu, with a wide selection available, normally at prices only a little higher than second-hand DVD

the second hand option is a great opportunity to get hold of classic films (for example - Ghostbusters for GBP£4!!)  that have not otherwise caught my attention, compared to more recent releases that are being heavily promoted

Why does a Blu-ray have to "load" when you pop one into a player? With DVD you just put the disc in the tray, hit close and the disc started playing right away, or at least a menu screen appeared - none of this "please wait five minutes while the disc loads" crap.  Is it something inherent to new BD technology?

After Blu-ray won the format war I was somewhat more interested in collecting Blu-ray discs. Replacing a 60" Sony LCD with a front projector and 133" screen is what really renewed my interest.
 

Watching a movie on Blu-ray disc with a front projector setup is so close to the original movie experience that my wife and I want to have a hi-def collection of all our favorite movies. We're not at all interested in a more compressed, streamed version of the movies.

We'll probably be having this conversation again in about ten years or so when the 4K systems become available.

 The studios forced me to go to Blu-ray this past holiday season.  What I mean by that is I could no longer abide the way recent popular mainstream movies on DVD looked upscaled to my 720p projector.  ("The Dark Knight", "Iron Man", and "Harry Potter and the Half-Blood Prince" DVDs all contain *extremely mediocre" MPEG-2 encodes, but look *fantastic* on Blu-ray.)

But now that I'm here, I have to say that I'm really enjoying the format!  Our family viewed the just-released "The Music Man" Blu-ray last night and were absolutely blown away by the A/V quality.  It almost felt like we were *in* River City!  Also, over the past year or so I had purchased a handful of BDs which also contained a DVD  (mostly Disney/Pixar titles) and so we've really enjoyed finally being able to see those titles in HD.   Finally, I've found that a lot of the titles I crave on BD are already heavily discounted at places like Wal-Mart and Costco.  The bottom line is that it would appear that if you love movies then Blu-ray is the place to be now.  And it's affordable.

I can't see 4K being necessary (or particularly beneficial) for a home theatre set up. 35mm release prints typically fall into the 720p-1080p resolution range. And almost all digital intermediates these days are only done at 2K, and they look pretty damn good projected onto a fifty foot screen, let alone one ten feet or smaller.

I'd rather see real improvements to things like dynamic range, colour depth and compression before increasing resolution. 1080p is plenty for home cinema.

Oh, I also agree that I can't see streaming/downloads doing it for me for the forseeable future.  Download speeds are just way too slow (at least here in the NYC area w/ its stone-aged infrastructure) for quality streaming, IMHO.  I'd rather not bother at all and find something else to do (and there are plenty actually) than pay to stream/download heavily compressed SD content or similar.

It's one thing to do free streaming or similar for recent TV shows from the various broadcast TV network sites, YouTube, etc. or maybe download a free TV show (or some included digital copy) to an iPod or similar, but I'm not about to *pay* for something low quality that I don't really need.  If I'm gonna pay, I'd much rather pay for something high quality or not bother at all.  My time (and the whole viewing experience) is worth something too afterall, and I don't need to waste that on crappy quality streaming, etc.  Heck, I don't even feel cable/sat service to be worthwhile for my family as it is...

_Man_

It's the BD-Java applications (mostly the menus) loading. Generally, the better the player the shorter the load time. For example, the PS3 is lightning fast, but the Panasonic BD-10 (their first player) is pretty damn slow.

Some discs are programmed with HDMV and therefore do not have BD-Java menus to load.

Imagine how slow it'll be when a million or more people are trying to download the latest summer blockbuster at the same time.

"Lightning fast" is kinda relative though.   The PS3 may be lightning fast compared to many other BD standalones, but it's still not really all that fast when it needs to deal w/ a heavily BD-J title -- in fact, it can still be quite excruciatingly slow at times.

One thing.  For anyone who doesn't care about BD-Live, you may just want to set up your player to not allow internet access.  That could easily make load times much faster than otherwise for many BD-Live titles.  I've done just that w/ my new-ish Panny BD60, and the loading speed is generally not really noticeably worse than my PS3 for the most part (unless I'm sitting there waiting w/ a stopwatch or something ).  Disabling internet access might even help address certain other disc loading problems that can be attributed to BD-Live issues too.

_Man_

I always said I'd never become an "HD snob" meaning I wouldn't be one of those people who found DVD inferior just because there was a better format out there, but I'll be damned if I haven't become exactly that. Anytime I try to watch one of my old DVDs now I just get depressed at how bad they look compared to movies on Blu-Ray. I've become completely spoiled by the PQ(and lossless sound) of Blu and as a result I've sold off almost all of my DVD collection. I have maybe 50 standard def titles left and when those films become available on Blu-Ray they'll be gone as well.