Universal Vault Series - Amazon.com exclusive DVD-Rs - Page 9

Originally Posted by ahollis 




I will agree with you that the process is the same, but are they not using equipment that is better than one would buy off of the self at Best Buy?  All I can say is that the WA DVD-r's seem to be of better quality than what I have burned from my Sony DVD recorder. 

Originally Posted by Van594 




So basically you don't really know either way it's just another firum type opinion based on what you think. Once again same tech does not mean same quality machines. A Yugo processes gas the same way as a Porsche but once again not the same.

 I could have sworn WB addressed this once and in fact said it was of a higher quality then at home burners.  Frankly, I don't really care I buy them because I love the movie or I don't get it. Whatever process odds are the discs will out live me anyway.

Originally Posted by Douglas Monce 




Actually I do know. As I stated above, the laser in the DVD recorder has to be set to a very tight spec in order to burn a disc that is with in tolerances to be able to play in a DVD player. The only major difference MIGHT be that an industrial duplication system might have burners that are built with higher quality components so that they last longer under contentious use.

Up shot is, its NOT like the difference between a Yugo and a Porsche, because if the home DVD writer were built like a Yugo, the discs wouldn't play at all. There is one difference between a home burned disc and these studio burned discs. The studio discs use a modified version of the copy protection system Content Scramble System - Managed Recording, which is why these discs won't play in some older computers. The drive must be compatible with the CSS-MR. They should play in all stand alone players however.

Frankly the quality of the media is really the key here. Use cheap media, you get discs that fail over time.

Doug

 

Originally Posted by ahollis 




Well I have a Yugo and WA has a Porsche. 

Originally Posted by Van594 

Frankly, I don't really care I buy them because I love the movie or I don't get it. Whatever process odds are the discs will out live me anyway.

Originally Posted by Van594 

Whatever people...I give up. You really don't know , and every time I address that you keep talking around it with your tech thoughts and not facts based on being there(something we all do really with most opinions). Unless you work for WB and are in that department I don't want to bother with even discussing it. I'm not saying anyone is right or wrong just that no one here can say for sure unless you are with WB. Frankly, it's pointless to discuss it with people who don't like the MOD system as it will always be a back and forth.

That test disc thing really doesn't help in this instance.

"Hollywood" doesn’t burn media. "Real" discs are pressed metal, mechanically made media. The presses are precise. Burning is a sloppy method to recreate the process, using dyes that can have pits and grooves "burned" into the chemical, making the illusion of how a "real" disc would look and work. If you compare a pressed media and a burned media under a microscope, you can see that the pressed media is fairly precise, while the burns are fairly erratic, and it's almost a miracle that burning works at all.

Originally Posted by Douglas Monce 




I'm not talking around it, I'm telling you how it works. I was involved in a disc on demand business in a much smaller way for awhile. We used multi-disc duplication systems to produced hundreds of discs a week. It is exactly the same technology as a single computer disc writer. It has to be or it won't work in a regular DVD player. The discs have to meet spec or they won't play.

Who said I didn't like the MOD system? I actually quite like the idea.

Doug

 

Originally Posted by Traveling Matt 

An optical disc is either pressed or burned; there is no in-between. The only difference between MOD programs and 1:1 home burners is in regards to mass production. However, a pressed disc and a burned disc are far from the same thing.

From DigitalFAQ...

 

These links might be of interest:

http://www.digitalfaq.com/guides/media/index.htm

http://www.digitalfaq.com/guides/media/longevity.htm

Originally Posted by Mark Zimmer 





Why is it then that some Archive discs (most recently, At Sword's Point) won't play in a computer DVD drive?  I should think if they're using the same kind of burners, they'd play in a computer drive.  But at least some of them just don't.  The play on regular players just fine.

Originally Posted by ahollis 




These links are saying the exact same thing that I have been saying.  There is difference in the equipment and media that is use to burn disks and it shows.  Thanks for sharing.

Originally Posted by Douglas Monce 




No these links are talking about the difference between burned media and pressed. The discs used by the Warner Archive and the Universal Vault are all burned media.

Doug

 

Originally Posted by Traveling Matt 

Disc quality and reliability is always a grab bag with burning. There are simply too many variables involved, to the point where it's almost absurd to compare them to pressed discs.

This thread has some great literature and references explaining more:

http://www.digitalfaq.com/forum/showthread.php/retail-dvds-created-1710.html

Originally Posted by Nebiroth 




It's the CSS copy protection causing the problem. Some DVD drives react badly to it. All DVD players have to work with it, or they'd be useless since all commercial DVD's have CSS

 

Originally Posted by ahollis 




Nope - Read the section on CONCEPTS OF BURNING AND BLANK DVD MEDIA QUALITY and within that section they talk about BURNER HARDWARE AND DRIVE FIRMWARE.  While they do talk about the differences between burned and pressed in other areas, they also discuss the differences between the hardware and media that is used for burning and the various quality you get from it.  They even say that Pioneer, the unit you suggest, is one of the best but they are also critical of others.  They say that my Sony recorder uses one of the best burners (Samsung) for home use, but I still say the quality is less than what I have seen from the Universal and Warner MOD.

 

 

Originally Posted by Douglas Monce 



Yes I read those sections, but they aren't talking about some difference between a home dvd writer and something that would be used in an industrial situation. They are simply saying that are quality burners, and crap burners. There is quality media, and crap media. I happen to have bought quality writers and buy quality media because I use them partly to make my living. But the actual technology used to burn my discs is EXACTLY the same as that Warner and Universal are using. If I grabbed a blank from the Warner Archive, it would burn just fine in my DVD writer. In fact most of the mass duplications machines that I have seen used the same model Pioneer burner that I own.

Doug

 

Originally Posted by ahollis 




So that is my point, there are crap burners and there are good burners also I have never meant to imply that there was different technology. That was just assumed by others.  If you have the exact same burner that Warner Archive has, then that is great, you must be getting good DVD-r's.  I have only said that the Warner MOD's looked better than what I did at home so there must be a differance between the hardware I have and what Warner was using.  Case Closed.  Goodnight.

Originally Posted by Douglas Monce 

I'm sorry Allen we have been talking at cross purposes. I thought you were trying to say that they were using some different kind of technology.

Doug

 

Originally Posted by ahollis 




Two sturbon people that know they are right and are not talking about the same thing.  LOL - My apologies also.  I enjoy your posts and in some strange way enjoyed our back and forth.