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NFL 2009 Regular Season Discussion Thread - Page 18

post #511 of 546
1/28/10 at 6:55am

Vikings had 200 more yards of offense than NO last week, but shot themselves in the foot.  I just don't see Indy making the same mistakes the Vikings did, but that's why they play the games.

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post #512 of 546
1/28/10 at 8:03am

Scott,

Agreed.  And if Brees plays like he did against the Patriots on that infamous Monday night, it could be a very interesting game.  Heck, it might even look like the Coryell teams of old, eh Johnny? ;)

Steve,

Yes, that's right.  It's one of the reasons (esp. the total yards) why I believe the better team did not win on that day.  But, that happens often in sports.  Some players are able to come up with the big/key play in a given situation, and often this results in a victory for their team.

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post #513 of 546
1/28/10 at 8:23am
I'm hoping the Saints took note in the Colts-Jets game, and prepare 2 very different defensive schemes for each half of the Super Bowl because the Jets were able to D-up the Colts in the first half, but Manning was able to figure it out for the second half.  So, I would focus on a jeckyll-and-hyde approach, literally a tale of 2 halfs if they have any aspirations of beating the Colts on the scoreboard.  They'll have to disguise blitze angles, rotate zone coverages, man-up when they blitz, drop off 9 in coverage if they have any chance to force Manning to run or improvise, something he doesn't like doing.

For the defense, it's usually a question of what weapons do you take away, and you simply have to not show all your cards in the first half.  The Jets just didn't re-adjust enough to Manning's answers in the 2nd half. 

But I think it'll end up being a track meet, and the last team with the ball is going to be in position to win.


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post #514 of 546
1/28/10 at 9:14am
Thread Starter 
The Saints had an opportunistic defense all season, generating a lot of turnovers. So, I think they should get some credit for all those Vikings turnovers, although the Vikings did definitely shoot themselves in the foot numerous times, and they were definitely out-coached. Childress has to be the least impressive coach I've seen in a conference championship in a long time.

I do not think the Saints will benefit from turnovers against the Colts, as Manning is excellent at protecting the ball, but I think New Orleans will also be more successful on offense than they were against the Vikings. Sean Peyton is a very bright coach, so I believe the Saints will come up with a good game plan.

It should be a high scoring, entertaining game. I'm picking the Colts, but I will be rooting for New Orleans.
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post #515 of 546
1/28/10 at 9:21am
There was one point in the first half where the announcer (Dierdorf?) was commenting on the Jets bull rush to get pressure into the backfield.  "That's pure strength".  That's not the kind of thing you can sustain for an entire game, and it did seem like the Jets defense was gassed a bit in the second half, especially with regards to pressure from the DLine.  Their run defense also got dinged in the second half.
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post #516 of 546
1/29/10 at 6:28am
I have not looked this up yet, but I wonder if the Colts and Saints have the most combined victories ever for two teams meeting in the Super Bowl?  Currently, Indianapolis is 16-2, and New Orleans is 15-3, for a total of 31 wins.  That's quite an achievement.  Of course, teams playing during the years where a twelve-game and fourteen-game season existed didn't have the same chance of having a total that high.
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post #517 of 546
1/29/10 at 6:37am
The '91 Bills were 15-3 and the '91 Redskins were 16-2, so they had the same win totals as the Colts and Saints.  The 2007 Giants were 13-6 (the extra win from the wildcard round) and the Pats, of course, were 18-0.

So this makes it three times that the two Superbowl teams combined for 31 wins.

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post #518 of 546
1/29/10 at 6:40am
^^^

Thanks.  That's surprising to me -- I didn't realize that that total had been reached already, and three times.  So 32 is the number to beat some day (or actually 33, since one of these teams eventually won the Super Bowl each of those years).  Just think, it could easily have been this year, as tons of Colts fans would attest to after that first Jets game. ;)
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post #519 of 546
1/29/10 at 8:12am
This year is only the third time in the Wildcard era that both #1 seeds advanced to the Superbowl.  '91 and '93 are the other years.  The total wins for the Cowboys and Bills in '93 was 29.  So I was about to post that 31 only happened once when I decided to look up the total wins in the Pats-Giants Superbowl, and lo and behold that due to the perfect regular season record and the extra wildcard round win, that was also 31 wins.  So I didn't bother checking the rest of the years.  It is possible though unlikely that some other combo topped 31.
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post #520 of 546
1/30/10 at 1:29pm
So, is anyone going to watch the Pro Bowl tomorrow?  If TPTB are going to have the Pro Bowl the week before the Super Bowl from now on, I think all players that are from the final two teams playing in the Super Bowl ought to be excluded from it (perhaps they already are).  There is enough talent in the league (IMO) that members from the final two teams need not participate.
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post #521 of 546
1/30/10 at 6:40pm


Quote:
Originally Posted by Ockeghem View Post

So, is anyone going to watch the Pro Bowl tomorrow?  If TPTB are going to have the Pro Bowl the week before the Super Bowl from now on, I think all players that are from the final two teams playing in the Super Bowl ought to be excluded from it (perhaps they already are).  There is enough talent in the league (IMO) that members from the final two teams need not participate.
That has already been done.  Many of the players from the conference championships will skip the game too.  Of course the Charger pro bowlers should all make it...they never even played a game in the playoffs.

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post #522 of 546
1/31/10 at 1:51pm
Thread Starter 


Quote:
Originally Posted by Ockeghem View Post

So, is anyone going to watch the Pro Bowl tomorrow?  If TPTB are going to have the Pro Bowl the week before the Super Bowl from now on, I think all players that are from the final two teams playing in the Super Bowl ought to be excluded from it (perhaps they already are).  There is enough talent in the league (IMO) that members from the final two teams need not participate.

I stopped watching this horrible all-star game years ago, so I have no plans to watch a single second of the game. I'll be watching a movie instead.

BTW, none of the players from either Super Bowl team will be playing, nor about a dozen other "Pro Bowl" players. The players are not interested in playing, and the fans are not interested in watching (I'm guessing).

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post #523 of 546
1/31/10 at 3:20pm
Scott,

And you call yourself a true NFL football fan?  J/K. ;)
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post #524 of 546
1/31/10 at 6:17pm
Thread Starter 


Quote:
Originally Posted by Ockeghem View Post

Scott,

And you call yourself a true NFL football fan?  J/K. ;)

Well, I do follow the Lions, and they are really not an NFL team, so you may be on to something.
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post #525 of 546
2/2/10 at 2:53pm
One day this week I read or saw a stat that said Indy has 15 players and NO has 5 players with SB experience.  Don't quote me on the exact numbers, but I got the ratio pretty close.  That is a pretty big advantage.  Last year's winner,Pitt, would have had a similar advantage and they really dominated...no wait that's not right.  But the Cards played like rookies didn't they.  No, no, that's not right either.

And the previous year's winners were experienced veterans of the SB, the Giants...wait that's wrong too.  They got there is 2001 and lost big time.  Don't think there were too many players left from that team.

Well the year before that, surely the Colts had SB experienced?  Wait, they hadn't been in it since '71.  Ok, I give up.  I don't know how important previous SB experience is.
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post #526 of 546
2/2/10 at 6:18pm
Thread Starter 
I think you're on to something, Johnny... no, wait, you're not.
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post #527 of 546
2/6/10 at 10:42am
This is one of the most difficult Super Bowls for me as far as choosing which team I hope wins.  I'm normally an AFC guy, but I remember the Saints back in the very early 1970s.  Although I'm not a Saints fan per se, I do remember many of those lean years, having followed the Boston Patriots when they were 3-11, 4-10, etc.  So I really wouldn't mind seeing New Orleans win.  I wonder who Archie Manning will be pulling for in this game? :)

Thinking back slightly more than forty years ago, I recall the Colts being in a similar position come Super Bowl III time.  So I jaunted down to pick up a paper this morning, and what did I read?

"We're gonna win the game. I guarantee it."

-- Drew Namath, QB of the New York Saints


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post #528 of 546
2/6/10 at 5:56pm
I'm going with the homer pick, since I lived in south Alabama up through my high school years, the Saints were pretty much our area's NFL football team, so that's who I'll root for in tomorrow's SB.
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post #529 of 546
2/7/10 at 10:59am
I'm picking the Saints to win in a score fest, 35-31.  Hey, having a former Charger QB win the big one is the closest the Bolts will get.  I just hope the taint of being an ex-charger has faded enough for Brees to perform well in the big game.
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post #530 of 546
2/7/10 at 6:52pm
That has to be one of the most unusual victories in a SB.  The Saints equaled the largest comback (10 points), had the first kicker to make 3 fields goals for 40+ yards, and had the only onside kick before the 4th quarter in SB history.  Brees got through the 1st quarter jitters and just shot the lights out.  After 10 points in the 1st quarter, when it looked like the Colts could move the ball at will, they only scored 7 more points.

Oh and a 2 point conversion for the Saints after a successful challenge.
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post #531 of 546
2/8/10 at 5:06am
Thread Starter 
That was an exciting game. Sean Peyton coached circles around Caldwell -- every decision he made seemed to turn into gold. Even the failed 4th down conversion near the goal line at the end of the first half worked out for the Saints.

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post #532 of 546
2/8/10 at 6:25am
November 8, 1970 is no longer my only cherished memory of the New Orleans Saints organization.  Congratulations to the New Orleans Saints for an impressive Super Bowl victory!

I was completely shocked by the onside kick to open up the second half.  Wow.  Fail, and Manning and co. have the ball in excellent field position.  But they didn't fail -- what a call.  Goodness, what a call.  The New Orleans Saints team members and coaches had to be the only people on the planet that expected that kick to occur.  Twenty, thirty, or forty years from now, people will be talking about that onside kick.

And for me, that game was easily the closest 31-17 NFL football game in history.  I suppose it's because of when the Saints scored their final seven points, and when the interception by Porter occurred.  It was one of the few times I've ever seen Manning defeated when he had the ball in his hands.

Brees?  What can you say.  He bested Brady earlier in the season, and he bested Manning when it mattered most.  It was an extremely impressive performance.  When Brady had 32 completions in one of his four Super Bowls, he also had 48 attempts.  Brees only needed 39 yesterday.

********************************

BTW, with the score 17-16, Indianapolis, and with the way Hartley was kicking, I wonder if I was the only person thinking that he might just kick a 64-yard field goal with seconds to go in the fourth quarter, being carried off the field after having defeated the Colts, 19-17.

http://detnews.com/article/20100202/OPINION03/2020334/Tom-Dempsey-s-63-yard-field-goal-to-beat-Lions-was-Saints--finest-hour-until-now
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post #533 of 546
2/8/10 at 8:24am
Thread Starter 
I think that onside kick caught every one off guard. The Saints field goal just before half time and that play completely changed the momentum of the game. The officials completely lost control during the scrum, though, as it looked like the entire Saints bench was on the field, yet there was no flag thrown. What chaos!

I was convinced that Manning was going to drive the Colts to a TD and tie the game, but Reggie Wayne hung his QB out to dry on the interception. Wayne telegraphed the play to the defense and then failed to come back for the pass. It's hard to blame Manning for that play. Credit should go to Greg Williams, though, for making a brilliant defensive call on that play.
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post #534 of 546
2/8/10 at 8:51am
It only takes one game to fall from grace.  It's been pointed out several time now that Manning is 8-8 (or was it 9-9) in the playoffs.  It only takes one game to restore yourself to grace.  I recall that before Manning won his first SB, he had a large monkey on his back.
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post #535 of 546
2/8/10 at 10:36am
Thread Starter 


Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Angell View Post

It only takes one game to fall from grace.  It's been pointed out several time now that Manning is 8-8 (or was it 9-9) in the playoffs.  It only takes one game to restore yourself to grace.  I recall that before Manning won his first SB, he had a large monkey on his back.

It is difficult to consider Manning "the greatest QB of all time", as some were anointing him before the Super Bowl, when you consider his post season record. One Super Bowl ring is not enough, IMO, for him to earn that crown when Montana has four rings -- not to mention all the other QB's who have won multiple titles. Manning still has time to add titles to his resume, but right now Montana still wears the crown, IMO.



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post #536 of 546
2/8/10 at 11:04am
I agree, he seems like an above average QB who has trouble in the big games when it really counts.  I'm not sure why everyone is anointing him "The Greatest" already, especially after yesterday's performance (which mirrors a lot of his prior playoff displays).

Congrats to the Saints! Very well deserved! And all this writing about "upset" irritates me, as well. The Saints were the No. 1 seed in the NFC. It's not like the NFC wildcard team upended an elite team. If anything, given Manning's meltdowns in playoff situations, the Saints should have been a slight favorite, IMO.

I'm also so happy for Brees, that he was able to demonstrate convincingly that the Chargers and Dolphins both made huge mistakes in letting him slip away.

Fave Commercials: Snickers/Betty White, and the Doritos/Dog Collar

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post #537 of 546
2/10/10 at 3:36pm
On a lark I did a google on 2011 SB favorites and found the favored team to win it all next year is...the Colts.  They are 7-1 to win it all.  I thought there was a history of SB losers doing poorly the next year?  The next favored team at 8-1 is the Chargers...boo...hiss!  They'll suck again in the playoffs like they always do.  The third favored team at 9-1 are the Saints, followed by the Pats at 10-1.
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post #538 of 546
2/10/10 at 4:40pm
Johnny,

I could easily see the Colts going all the way next year, and assuming New England, Pittsburgh, and San Diego are out of it, I'd probably root for them.

I think those odds for the Pats are quite generous.  They, like the Celtics, are not a threat to win the title given the team they have now and how they have been playing the past two years.

While you were Googling, I've been looking in on my all-time favorite quarterback's stats.  I also learned some fun facts while reading the following.  Have a peek at this interesting Wiki on Johnny Unitas:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Johnny_Unitas

I found this to be surprising:

"Married with a child and out of pro football, Unitas worked construction in Pittsburgh to support his family. On the weekends, he played quarterback, safety and punter on a local semipro team called the Bloomfield Rams for $6 a game."

I loved Johnny Unitas' game.  I only got to see him during the last five or six years of his career, but they were enough for me to know that something magical was occurring.  He was a very gifted quarterback, and set some impressive records.

 

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post #539 of 546
2/10/10 at 8:17pm


Quote:
Originally Posted by Ockeghem View Post

Johnny,

I could easily see the Colts going all the way next year, and assuming New England, Pittsburgh, and San Diego are out of it, I'd probably root for them.

"Married with a child and out of pro football, Unitas worked construction in Pittsburgh to support his family. On the weekends, he played quarterback, safety and punter on a local semipro team called the Bloomfield Rams for $6 a game." 

The concern I have with the Colts is the history of SB losers the following year.  Of course with a QB of Manning's caliber, they could overcome the history.  I am starting to wonder about Manning in the playoffs.  He's either 8-8 or 9-9, I forget which and that's not good enough for someone with the regular season success he's had.

Of course as a fan of the Chargers, I consider my self and expert on regular season and playoff season success discrepancies.

The item about Unitas playing semipro I was aware of.  I'm pretty sure this was publicized pretty heavily during his peak years.  Perhaps there's no better example of a diamond in the rough than Unitas.

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post #540 of 546
2/12/10 at 9:46am
There was an article in the Little Rock paper (it was a reprint of a Dallas article) about how the Cowboys are well positioned to be the first team to have  a home field advantage in the SB.  Oh yucchhh!
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