HTF BLU-RAY REVIEW: T2 Judgment Day - Skynet Edition - Page 5

Re: HTF BLU-RAY REVIEW: T2 Judgment Day - Skynet Edition

Very true. I just updated to version 019 last night.

Re: HTF BLU-RAY REVIEW: T2 Judgment Day - Skynet Edition

I'm running into a similar problem as Jacob, the DTS-HD audio is outputting in 5.1 instead of 6.1. I'm currently running a Sony BDP-S350 with an Onkyo TX-SR805, and both the player and receiver are displaying as with a 5.1 source. Have the latest firmware, so not sure where the problem lies.

Re: HTF BLU-RAY REVIEW: T2 Judgment Day - Skynet Edition

devine:

do you get 6.1 or 7.1 when you change it to PCM?

Jacob

Re: HTF BLU-RAY REVIEW: T2 Judgment Day - Skynet Edition

That's a pretty definitive statement. And yet I see edge halos on the Skynet encode, just as I see them on other HD versions.

Re: HTF BLU-RAY REVIEW: T2 Judgment Day - Skynet Edition

Ask Van Ling. He has stated no post processing beyond dirt and scratch removal.

Re: HTF BLU-RAY REVIEW: T2 Judgment Day - Skynet Edition

Robert,

How do you know that other releases of T2 have been artificially sharpened? Are you simply assuming they have been because they appears sharper than the Skynet Edition, to which you know (from Van Ling's comments in the HTF "Insiders" area) that no DNR was applied? Or do you have additional information to suggest that the other releases were sharpened?

I ask because in a recent update on The Digital Bits, Bill Hunt proffered that a difference in video codecs and bit-rates could explain that difference in sharpness between the Skynet Edition and the Japanese Geneon version. The Skynet Edition has a lower bit-rate than the Geneon, and a different codec that apparently copes with low bit-rates by "smoothing" the image somewhat. This seems like a more believable explanation of why the Geneon version looks appreciably sharper than the Skynet, even though both come from the same master and no DNR was applied to Skynet.

Re: HTF BLU-RAY REVIEW: T2 Judgment Day - Skynet Edition

Mike i own a Sony BDP300, and T2 plays in it. I also own a 350, the movie also plays in it.

However, on both machines it wants that internet connection.

It takes FOREVER to load. But it does load, and it will play.

I think it took a good minute or two, on both players, before it starts.

Movie looks and sounds great! I hope a firmware update gets it to load faster!

Re: HTF BLU-RAY REVIEW: T2 Judgment Day - Skynet Edition

Carl, first and foremost, I can look at the Studio Canal HD DVD and see the effect of electronic sharpening (EE, if you prefer that term), particularly when directly compared to the Skynet version. Van Ling ststed that no sharpening was added to the Skynet master, so I can use that as the baseline.

Additionally, yes, I do have a contact that is in a position to have some information about Lionsgate/Studio Canal discs. I also recall Van saying this in the T2 thread in the insider's section.

So, yeah, taken all together, I'm confident that my comments are accurate to the extent I could research them (or I wouldn't have posted it).

I did read Bill Hunt's comments, and I know a little bit about what is going on with some folks trying to get more information about how the Skynet master and previous masters were really, truly prepared. Right now, there is some speculation, and Bill's comments are clearly labeled as that. I will be as interested as anyone in any factual information can be learned and made public.

Re: HTF BLU-RAY REVIEW: T2 Judgment Day - Skynet Edition

Since the Geneon Entertainment T2 BD uses a different encode than either the original Lionsgate or Studio Canal encodes, it would appear that no definitive statement can be made with respect to the presence of artificial sharpening on it given your contact is in a position to have some information about Lionsgate/Studio Canal discs only based on what you wrote above, correct?

Re: HTF BLU-RAY REVIEW: T2 Judgment Day - Skynet Edition

Rick:

Thanks sooooo much! Great news. I guess I can deal with a long load time.

I would think the people that design new discs would take us "early adopters" into consideration. There's got to be a lot of players out there which aren't going to react well with this kind of software.

I doubt the BD-10 is ever going to get another firmware update. I think Panasonic has given up the ghost on that model.

Mike

Re: HTF BLU-RAY REVIEW: T2 Judgment Day - Skynet Edition

Bill is wrong on the bitrate. The Skynet and Geneon version have almost the same bitrate.

Geneon Japan "SE" Cut: 21.94Mbps AVC
Lionsgate USA Skynet "SE" Cut: 19.28Mbps VC-1

Of course, they do use different codecs but I'd be surprised if it made that kind of difference at this bitrate.

Re: HTF BLU-RAY REVIEW: T2 Judgment Day - Skynet Edition

I have the Panasonic BD-10A and when I read this thread I ran downstairs and threw in the disc.

Long story short, it plays! It takes a looong time to load in, but it plays.

I believe the 10A is Profile 1.2, maybe 1.1, but it does play in it.

Re: HTF BLU-RAY REVIEW: T2 Judgment Day - Skynet Edition

Yes, as far as the parameters of your question go. Geneon's encode is specific to that disc, but the source master is still the same as the Lionsgate and Studio Canal discs. If the question is, did Geneon apply any sharpening to their master prior to encoding, the answer is, I don't know. Further, that is the one version of the movie I don't have, so I wouldn't even offer a guess. If I were guessing based on posted screenshots (which I don't do), I'd say there was some image processing applied to the Geneon master. That's my opinion based on screenshots alone and what my experience tells me.

Re: HTF BLU-RAY REVIEW: T2 Judgment Day - Skynet Edition

The more I read about this release, the happier I am about it. I think I will break down much sooner than I expected I would.

Re: HTF BLU-RAY REVIEW: T2 Judgment Day - Skynet Edition

I watched it this morning and it looked very good if not excellent.





Crawdaddy

Re: HTF BLU-RAY REVIEW: T2 Judgment Day - Skynet Edition

Thanks, Robert. Pretty soon here I will have every BD release except the Skynet edition. If that drops to $14.99 or less, I will have it too. Gotta pinch the pennies after purchasing the Geneon disc. At that point, I think I will have a big A-B comparison-o-rama. I don't expect it to prove anything other than which one I prefer however.

Re: HTF BLU-RAY REVIEW: T2 Judgment Day - Skynet Edition

Actually, Bill said it was solely due to the bitrate, since both codecs apply smoothing. To quote Bill's source (MattG):

Re: HTF BLU-RAY REVIEW: T2 Judgment Day - Skynet Edition

Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)

Had a chance to compare the Geneon & Skynet versions. Listed below are are what I feel are some pros & cons to each version. Viewed on a Oppo BDP-83 @ 720p to Yamaha 663 connected to a Optoma HD7100 106" 16x9.

Geneon pros:

steelbook packaging*
2 disc set(theatrical & SE version each get their own disc)
extras are stand-alone featurettes

Geneon cons:

About 5x the price of the Skynet edition.
Trailers are SD 4x3 letterbox/fullframe
TrueHD EX track when bitstreamed shows as 6.1 on receiver but is only 5.1(switching to PCM & applying EX decoding fixed this)

Skynet pros:

When in motion PQ looks equal to Geneon
Only $14.99
Trailers are in HD

Skynet cons:

Disc is slow to load
Extras are PiP
DTS-MA 6.1 track when bitstreamed shows as 6.1 on receiver but is only 5.1(switching to PCM in the player fixed this)

Since Best Buy online has this on sale for $14.99 my thought is save your money and get this version. I feel the PQ on this version is fine and will hold me over until a new transfer can be done. I will be able to return the Geneon since Amazon Japan sent this in a corrugated sleeve mailer(shipping to USA should have been in a box). It arrived to me slighty crushed on the back/spine and the case doesn't seal properly on the bottom.

Re: HTF BLU-RAY REVIEW: T2 Judgment Day - Skynet Edition

Has anyone compared the Skynet and Geneon at 1080p? I'm still curious what is causing the slight difference in PQ between these two on the screenshots.

Re: HTF BLU-RAY REVIEW: T2 Judgment Day - Skynet Edition

It's Profile 1.0.

There are three profiles for BD players:

1. Profile 1.0. Basically, it plays the movie and regular bonus content.

2. Profile 1.1. It will play Picture-in-Picture and some other fancier Java applications ("BonusView").

3. Profile 2.0. Everything that 1.1 does, plus BD-Live.

(There are actually more profiles, but they deal with music discs and such.)

Re: HTF BLU-RAY REVIEW: T2 Judgment Day - Skynet Edition

I went to play the t2 on my panasonic 60. there was a new download for the bdlive. now that is working. you can even download the feature docs or stream that were from the two dvds. like the original making of, the doc about the se, and also the 3D t2 featurette.
I thought some fans might be interested.
Jacob

Re: HTF BLU-RAY REVIEW: T2 Judgment Day - Skynet Edition

The Geneon costs $75? That's too rich for my blood. It sure didn't take long for there to be sale on this disc, $15 is a great price.

Re: HTF BLU-RAY REVIEW: T2 Judgment Day - Skynet Edition

I'd say that some slight sharpening has been added to the Studio Canal/Optimum encode for sure, but, like I said, I still see edge halos on the Skynet encode. These halos also show up in the comparison grabs that can be seen, uh, elsewhere. If the Skynet encode had no edge sharpening of any kind applied to it, then surely some EE was already on the pre-approved master? This flick needs a new transfer pronto.

Re: HTF BLU-RAY REVIEW: T2 Judgment Day - Skynet Edition

Agreed - I could never justify that price - especially when we'll likely see a new transfer at some point. The $15 price seems very reasonable for the Skynet.

Re: HTF BLU-RAY REVIEW: T2 Judgment Day - Skynet Edition

Navesink.Net: Terminator EndoSkull unboxing!

Full unboxing of the EndoSkull set! Haven't had a chance to actually put in any of the disks yet tho, nor did I put batteries in and light this guy up.

Re: HTF BLU-RAY REVIEW: T2 Judgment Day - Skynet Edition

Well, today in the mail I received Sony's latest Firmware Upgrade Disc. I was able to load it in and I fairly quickly "updated" my Sony 350 player, and T2: SKYNET EDITION now plays fine. That's the good news.

The bad news is that I see what others are talking about, in so far as this not exactly being an "excellent" quality BD. I think a better one will arrive somewhere down the pike one day.

I have a question some of you may be able to answer. On some of the closeups I sampled (a good one being where Dr. Silberman recommends that Sarah be kept in the institution for another 6 months) I can see his face kind of "floating"... it's an effect where parts of the face seem to "swim" or move ever so slightly about, and it's really irritating. I first had this problem with the Blu-ray of FIRST BLOOD. Anyone else know that I'm talking about?

Re: HTF BLU-RAY REVIEW: T2 Judgment Day - Skynet Edition

I know exactly what you mean, but I've only ever seen it in early MPEG-2 DVD encodes and digital cable. How are you hooked up, Joe, and what are your equipmet settings? The reason I ask is that sometimes, all it takes is one wrong setting to screw things up, but you probably already knew that.

Re: HTF BLU-RAY REVIEW: T2 Judgment Day - Skynet Edition

I haven't watched the Skynet version yet, but this is often a characteristic of DNR....and First Blood was heavily DNR'd.

Re: HTF BLU-RAY REVIEW: T2 Judgment Day - Skynet Edition

Even after the latest firmware this thing still takes a good 2 minutes to load, on my Sony 350. I also have to make sure to hit cancel, and not retry, for that internet connection i dont have, or it never will load!

Re: HTF BLU-RAY REVIEW: T2 Judgment Day - Skynet Edition

I watched the complete special edition version of the film.

This transfer is a head scratcher. I haven't seen such smearing of facial details since watching my FACE/OFF HD DVD. I am confident that this could have looked much better had Cameron approved a new transfer. Shame we customers miss out cause this is certainly a lesser presentation. The best way to describe this is inconsistent. Most of the film looked to soft/filtered to me, there were few moments where I felt that the film could look like I expected.

As for the audio, it brings the bombast, but I have to admit I was suprised how front centered it is. Now i'll admit my Onkyo won't decode the 6.1 so I listened in 5.1. Solid presentation but did anyone else feel that panning between front and surround was a bit jumpy as opposed to smooth panning? While this is certainly an upgrade over the DVD, you won't find much fine details in the listening.