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Warner Archive Discussion Thread (FEEDBACK) - Page 12

post #331 of 3526
3/24/09 at 5:34pm

re: Warner Archive Discussion Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by GlennH
Warners could easily assuage these fears by adopting a consumer-friendly policy that would garner them lots of goodwill and prevent many from holding off on some titles now:

Owners of any Warner Archive DVD-R release should be given the option to exchange it if there is a subsequent "normal" DVD release later. This should be free of charge (except perhaps postage).

Purchasers will be paying a premium price to get these movies on DVD-R. Warners should profit well from each purchase. That should merit the consumer the privilege of acquiring the DVD version later.

Thank you again!
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post #332 of 3526
3/24/09 at 5:41pm

re: Warner Archive Discussion Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisPearson
I'm finding the reaction of some to the suggestion that these discs might be overpriced rather hard to understand.

We have grown used to Warner releasing boxed sets of classics at SRPs working out as $10 per disc (such as the past two Gangsters collections, which had SRPs of $60 and contained six discs). Online retailers would typically knock off 20% on initial release and as much as 50% in sales further down the line. Most of these DVDs had extensive extras, such as Warner Night at the Movies.

Now Warner is expecting consumers to pay $20 per disc for bare bones releases with no hope of a reduction (as Warner is the only company selling them). They might be reissued to retail at some point, possibly with extras, in which case you can shell out all over again.

I can understand people's excitement at getting some of their favourite films on DVD, and appreciate that these are among Warner's more obscure titles. But to go from paying $10 or less for a loaded DVD to paying twice that or more for bare bones -- in a recession no less -- is a bit rich. Isn't it reasonable for some of us to feel somewhat locked out?

My last post for the night as I don't want to flood the thread but I agree with all of the above... the studio should be offering us better incentive to spend excessive amounts of money on these films when what they are essentially offering is the same thing that many of us who subscribe to TCM and own DVD recorder or services such as Tivo, already have access to.

Why aren't all of the Gable or Grant films packaged as a "collection" at discounted price for instance? Why should anyone spend hundreds of dollars on what would normally cost them a third of the price with any other studio release in this instance?

This just makes no sense and the frustration displayed by many on HTF (who I might add, are not necessarily against the "burn on demand" concept and may otherwise even be proponents of such a program ) is perfectly reasonable in context.
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post #333 of 3526
3/24/09 at 6:00pm
Thread Starter 

re: Warner Archive Discussion Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by DanMel
With the Gary Cooper movie Bright Leaf being taken off the list after it was included with all the other movies on the first day kickoff, I've decided to post the link to the ask WB a question over at my Gary Cooper tcm thread to get Gary Cooper fans to write in and show their support for putting Bright Leaf back on the list of movies. Hopefully this will help get the movie back up on the list of movies to order soon.

The 5 movies that were suddenly added early Sunday afternoon (the 4 early Hepburns and Bright Leaf) have been removed. So we are back with exactly 150 films. I bet you they will be in the next bunch though. I noticed when they first appeared that the covers of these 5 particular films did not match the style/background color of the others.
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post #334 of 3526
3/24/09 at 6:30pm

re: Warner Archive Discussion Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by MarcoBiscotti
Titles that may potentially sustain a retail release down the line should be excluded from this collection which should consist exclusively of features that will never receive retail distribution.

The prospect of purchasing expensive DVD-Rs without supplements may seem enticing to some and I admittedly am interested first and foremost in the films, but with the potential risk of having them reissued later on professionally mastered silver-back discs with full artwork, possible extras and an affordable price... I am personally not willing to spend money that I otherwise would've instantly parted with for a long overdue film like Jacques Tourneur's Wichita at US $20 + s/h.

Double dipping is never my first choice, but how would this be any different than films getting a full-fledged release only to be followed up a few years later with a remastered special edition with added (or different) bonus content. They've never guaranteed that wont happen to any release. Why should these be different?

In fact, the chances of these getting ANY official release were slim and none and I doubt those odds will change with this program. So the fear of these titles getting a full-fledged release down the line are, I believe, overstated. And given the prices of regular dvds these days, assuming that the full fledged releases will be more "affordable" is also overstated.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MarcoBiscotti
the studio should be offering us better incentive to spend excessive amounts of money on these films when what they are essentially offering is the same thing that many of us who subscribe to TCM and own DVD recorder or services such as Tivo, already have access to.

Except that is not what this is. We were told in the chat that this process is not at all the same as burning the dvd ourselves at home, and yields a much higher quality. From the chat: "The discs are of the highest quality. They are manufactured via propriatary MOD process which is very different from home-used DVDRs on one's computer....we guarantee the quality of these discs and will stand by them." Not to mention the lack of a cable channel bug in the corner. It's hardly comparable to buying a home burned disc off ebay of a rare film. (And frankly, when people do that, they usually spend more than $20 for it!)

And anyone who thinks $20 is excessive doesn't need to buy it and can make do with the home burned dvd-r from TCM. If they really think it's the same, then why even bother with this program.
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post #335 of 3526
3/24/09 at 7:17pm

re: Warner Archive Discussion Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Hodson
Right now I think of it as overpriced, overhyped and over there...
LOL!
Quote:
Originally Posted by MarcoBiscotti
I'm still uncertain of how they reached this price point... there is less/no risk involved in distributing their films this way as they are not pressing media for retail with the hopes of recouping costs but on a made-to-purchase basis. They are spending little to no money whatsoever on packaging and artwork, nor supplemental features. The media itself is cheaper to reproduce as is the effort involved in all regards. Yet the studio is asking well in excess of ANY single catalog release that should warrant otherwise -- ones produced in mass quantities for retail that come with extras, commentaries, carefully designed artwork/packaging and officially pressed DVD discs. My question is... why???
Remember, Warner Home Video is paying another company to actually manufacture and post the discs. That company would've had to invest in a lot of expensive equipment for those purposes. For them to do that they would need a firm guarantee of a certain amount of revenue irrespective of how many discs are sold. Therefore, Warner Home Video would need to ensure a certain amount of revenue per disc so they can afford to pay this other company, while still 1) funding the cost of preparing the transfers 2) having money to invest in new transfers 3) creating a profit for shareholders to justify the existence of this scheme.

Given that complexity of the financing, it makes sense to me that Warner Home Video would err at a higher price point initially to test demand for this service. If sales slow, they can always cut the price to increase demand, whereas it is a publicity nightmare to increase the price of something produce on a made to order basis!

I wouldn't be surprised if they offer discounts down the track (5 for the price of 4 would be good!), but at this stage they are testing the appeal of this completely new DVD business model.

I am just hoping that they accept international orders BEFORE the 20% off code expires!

You can sort this list by most popular by clicking here. For some reason I'm fascinated by what others are buying. I assume the Most Popular sorting updates once a day.
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post #336 of 3526
3/24/09 at 7:32pm

re: Warner Archive Discussion Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by CinéKarine
The 5 movies that were suddenly added early Sunday afternoon (the 4 early Hepburns and Bright Leaf) have been removed. So we are back with exactly 150 films. I bet you they will be in the next bunch though. I noticed when they first appeared that the covers of these 5 particular films did not match the style/background color of the others.
When was the next batch of films to be released? Was it April 1st? If so that is just 8 days away. I'm hoping it is April 1st. If Bright leaf is not in the next batch of films, I'm going to be really depressed.

As for some that claim we can simply just record these off of TCM. I haven't been watching every single tcm guide since they first started showing movies, but I don't think Bright Leaf has ever been shown on TCM and I know it has never been released on VHS. This is what I think this new program is going to help on. Some movies are never shown on any tv station and some have never been shown since they first aired in theaters. Cary Grant in Crisis and Room for One may be two others in that boat. 20 dollars for these type of super rare movies in WB released prestine quality is well worth the 20 dollars even without extras or being on pressed dvds. For without WB all we will ever have is blurry bootleg messes on our big screen TV's to watch of their movies.

Just think if WB decides to release someday Meet John Doe which is in public domain. They could release it on dvd-r if they wanted to. Would people rather buy the blurry messes on pressed dvds or buy a prestine "It's a Wonderful Life like" quality version of it burned on dvd directly from WB for 20 dollars? I think they might still own the original negatives to it or at the least they probably have the best print of it since they are the one's that originally distributed it.
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post #337 of 3526
3/24/09 at 7:37pm

re: Warner Archive Discussion Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Simon Howson
LOL!


I am just hoping that they accept international orders BEFORE the 20% off code expires!


When does the 20% off code expire? I will be a first time buyer, so I don't think that it should ever expire. I was told that the first 5 movies you buy with them will give you 20% off with the code.
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post #338 of 3526
3/24/09 at 7:45pm

re: Warner Archive Discussion Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by DanMel
When does the 20% off code expire? I will be a first time buyer, so I don't think that it should ever expire. I was told that the first 5 movies you buy with them will give you 20% off with the code.
I think the 20% off one expires on the 30th.

They now have an Awards program too for people in the U.S. and Canada only:
WB INSIDER REWARDS

Members receive:
1) Discounts and prefered shipping from our new WBShop.com
2) Insider previews of new additions to Warner Archive Collection
3) All the latest news from Warner Archive Collection
4) Rare archive content, streaming downloads, preview clips for your computer and more to come!

You can read the terms and conditions here:
http://www.warnerarchive.com/rewards...onsRewards.htm
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post #339 of 3526
3/25/09 at 12:42am

Warner Archive -- Why unavailable outside U.S.?

I still think it's ridiculous that the Warner Archive as well as the made-to-order DVDs are unavailable to ship to non-U.S. addresses. I wrote Warners about it, and all they said was they'll convey my message to their supervisors. This is absurd. There is such a huge customer base outside of the United States for these films; and to have to go 'round about to obtain them by bothering somebody in the States to use as a shipping address, so they can then ship them on to us Martians living outside the States, is all very wearisome. Why, Warner Bros.? You take our money but won't ship to our addresses. Why eliminate us from your customer base ...
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post #340 of 3526
3/25/09 at 1:01am

Re: Warner Archive -- Why unavailable outside U.S.?

What I also don't understand is that Warners ships all their other films to non-U.S. addresses -- but not the DVDs from its archive and seemingly not the made-to-orders deriving from the same. Don't tell me "customs forms" are such a hindrance. For Warners, with its staff doing its shipping and all it entails, they are doing just that for the other films they allow. Just not for the Archive! It's perverse.
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post #341 of 3526
3/25/09 at 1:05am

re: Warner Archive Discussion Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnMor

In fact, the chances of these getting ANY official release were slim and none and I doubt those odds will change with this program. So the fear of these titles getting a full-fledged release down the line are, I believe, overstated. And given the prices of regular dvds these days, assuming that the full fledged releases will be more "affordable" is also overstated.

I strongly disagree with you there. Warner is smart and one of the extras in putting out this program is seeing which titles are more popular than others (a continuation of their once yearly polls), and then releasing these onto the retail market in full fledged releases and boxsets.

And what do you mean by the prices of regular DVDs these days? If you are talking about catalog titles then I will let you know that I never pay more than $11 or $12 for a catalog title and much less than that per title for box sets. The Paramount Legend titles cost me around $8 each and I snatched up most of those titles, even ones that were blind buys, something I just can't do with the archive titles.

Anyway, I will make my list of 4 titles to buy today and I will then wait patiently each month for the next batch of 20 when I will pick 1 or 2 more at the most. Maybe one day I will be able afford to get all the titles I want, I guess I'm just frustrated that right now I'm not in the financial position to do so.
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post #342 of 3526
3/25/09 at 1:06am

Re: Warner Archive -- Why unavailable outside U.S.?

Marc, this has been discussed ad nauseum in the 'Archive' thread and in the 'Chat' Warners said this:

1). There will be a availability of product WORLDWIDE shortly through the Warner Archive Collection. SHORTLY. We just don't have a date yet...it could be only a few days away....bear with us...This would be only applicable to the films where we hold worldwide rights, which is MOST of them.
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post #343 of 3526
3/25/09 at 1:16am

re: Warner Archive Discussion Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay E
Anyway, I will make my list of 4 titles to buy today
Can't the 25% off coupon be used for an order of up to 5? If so, you may as well get an extra one while you get it at a discount.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay E
and I will then wait patiently each month for the next batch of 20 when I will pick 1 or 2 more at the most. Maybe one day I will be able afford to get all the titles I want, I guess I'm just frustrated that right now I'm not in the financial position to do so.
Yeah I will buy 10 or so in my first order (because there are a lot of titles I've wanted for ages), then a few a month after that.
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post #344 of 3526
3/25/09 at 1:17am

Re: Warner Archive -- Why unavailable outside U.S.?

I still think Warners ought to know that it should be done sooner rather than later. I don't buy the "customs forms" argument. Discussed ad nauseum doesn't mean Warners is doing the right thing. They're trying, maybe, but it's a ridiculous situation. We're not Plutonians in outer space, are we?
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post #345 of 3526
3/25/09 at 2:19am

re: Warner Archive Discussion Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by MarcoBiscotti
My last post for the night as I don't want to flood the thread but I agree with all of the above... the studio should be offering us better incentive to spend excessive amounts of money on these films when what they are essentially offering is the same thing that many of us who subscribe to TCM and own DVD recorder or services such as Tivo, already have access to.

Why aren't all of the Gable or Grant films packaged as a "collection" at discounted price for instance? Why should anyone spend hundreds of dollars on what would normally cost them a third of the price with any other studio release in this instance?

This just makes no sense and the frustration displayed by many on HTF (who I might add, are not necessarily against the "burn on demand" concept and may otherwise even be proponents of such a program ) is perfectly reasonable in context.
Marco,
This program is in it's infancy which means Warner will probably tweak it over time to make it more consumer friendly while at the same time increasing their sales.







Crawdaddy
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post #346 of 3526
3/25/09 at 2:20am

Re: Warner Archive -- Why unavailable outside U.S.?

It is, ostensibly, for reasons of rights.

But it is also to do with market protection. The studios wish to control exactly what the customer can buy, and when, and most importantly, at what price.

It is well known that DVD's in Europe, and even more so in Japan, are more expensive. For no other reason, than because they can be. Bluntly, the studios don't want us importing cheap US discs. They want us to buy expensive local ones.

Also, historically, new films would appear in theatres at different times in different parts of the world. The studios didn't want (say) Europeans importing US discs of films that haven't reached cinemas in Europe: it reduces audiences. However, most films now get a simultaneous world release, so that's less important.

The vital word here is "control". That is precisely why we had Region Coding. It proved far more fragile than the studios believed. Remember the attempt to bring it back with RCE? That also failed. I think they now accept to some degree the concept of the world-wide market. "Regional Only" releases are ridiculously dated.

Thankfuly, Warner at least realise this, and will be offering a worldwide service - excluding films for which they do not have overseas rights. It will be interesting to see how they cope with that problem.
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post #347 of 3526
3/25/09 at 2:20am

re: Warner Archive Discussion Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Simon Howson
Can't the 25% off coupon be used for an order of up to 5? If so, you may as well get an extra one while you get it at a discount.

Yes, thanks, but $65 (with tax) is really the most I can spend on these titles. I am trying to allocate my $ as economicaly as I can right now in regards to DVD. Even if the coupon allowed up to 10 titles, I would still be stuck in the same financial strait-jacket.

Hopefully next month, there will be another similar coupon.

At least I narrowed down my buy list to 4:

Dusty and Sweets McGee
Beast of the City
Rain People, The
All Fall Down
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post #348 of 3526
3/25/09 at 2:20am

re: Warner Archive Discussion Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by DanMel
When does the 20% off code expire? I will be a first time buyer, so I don't think that it should ever expire. I was told that the first 5 movies you buy with them will give you 20% off with the code.
It expires on the 31st and it's for 25% off.





Crawdaddy
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post #349 of 3526
3/25/09 at 2:23am

re: Warner Archive Discussion Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Simon Howson
I think the 20% off one expires on the 30th.

They now have an Awards program too for people in the U.S. and Canada only:
WB INSIDER REWARDS

Members receive:
1) Discounts and prefered shipping from our new WBShop.com
2) Insider previews of new additions to Warner Archive Collection
3) All the latest news from Warner Archive Collection
4) Rare archive content, streaming downloads, preview clips for your computer and more to come!

You can read the terms and conditions here:
Warner Bros. Loyalty Biz Reqs
So is the site active for Canadians now? If so then that's progress which will leave our international members next to be taken care of.





Crawdaddy
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post #350 of 3526
3/25/09 at 2:26am

Re: Warner Archive -- Why unavailable outside U.S.?

Quote:
Originally Posted by marcSV
I still think Warners ought to know that it should be done sooner rather than later. I don't buy the "customs forms" argument. Discussed ad nauseum doesn't mean Warners is doing the right thing. They're trying, maybe, but it's a ridiculous situation. We're not Plutonians in outer space, are we?
Are you just trying to be disagreeable here as you have started two other threads about this same subject matter when it should have been posted in this thread? We have been talking about this issue every since Warner Archive came up and Warner has heard our complaints. Warner has stated that they will make this available to international customers as soon as possible.






Crawdaddy
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post #351 of 3526
3/25/09 at 2:55am

re: Warner Archive Discussion Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by DanMel
When was the next batch of films to be released? Was it April 1st? If so that is just 8 days away. I'm hoping it is April 1st. If Bright leaf is not in the next batch of films, I'm going to be really depressed.
Read the chat transcript. In a response to a question about "Westerns from the 50s, 60s, and 70s" Warner said:
Quote:
New titles will be announced 4/1 and 4/15.
That's 1st and 15th of April for us folks that prefer our dates in chronological order.
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post #352 of 3526
3/25/09 at 4:09am

Re: Warner Archive -- Why unavailable outside U.S.?

Am trying to catch up with everything in this thread. I guess I posted something everybody's resolved already!
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post #353 of 3526
3/25/09 at 4:12am

Re: Warner Archive -- Why unavailable outside U.S.?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Crawford
Are you just trying to be disagreeable here as you have started two other threads about this same subject matter when it should have been posted in this thread? We have been talking about this issue every since Warner Archive came up and Warner has heard our complaints. Warner has stated that they will make this available to international customers as soon as possible.
Sorry! I wasn't up to date on that issue. I realize what you're saying now. Wasn't trying to be disagreeable, just annoyed at Warner's Web site with its restrictions
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post #354 of 3526
3/25/09 at 4:15am

Re: Warner Archive -- Why unavailable outside U.S.?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Crawford
Are you just trying to be disagreeable here as you have started two other threads about this same subject matter when it should have been posted in this thread? We have been talking about this issue every since Warner Archive came up and Warner has heard our complaints. Warner has stated that they will make this available to international customers as soon as possible.
I just caught up with things, Robert. The thread was a lot to read.
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post #355 of 3526
3/25/09 at 4:39am

re: Warner Archive Discussion Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Junior_V
I just saw the other thread about Warnes releasing classics. I was very excited to see some that ive been dying to see for along time is comming. I was so happy. That was until I saw that they wont be shipped outside US. BIG FAT SLAP IN THE FACE!
This is so rude! Im so mad! Ive been a faithful buyer of Warner Classics for 4 years now. I have given alot of my money to them, and this is how they treat me? I won't be buying anymore from them! No "Forbidden Hollywood Collection vol.3" for my money! No "Warner Gangster Collection vol 4" for my money! No "Greer Garson movies" for my money! I just download them for free!

Beast of the City
Betrayed
Chained
Dance, Fools, Dance
Emma
Forsaking All Others
Goodbye, My Fancy
Homecoming
Honkey Tonk
Ice Follies of 1939
Idiot's Delight
The Kiss
Laughing Sinners
Love
Love On The Run
Mannequin
Mrs Parkington
Payment On Demand
Possessed
Private Lives
The Shining Hour
The Single Standard
Somewhere I'll Find You
Spring Fever
Strange Interlude
This Woman Is Dangerous
Three Comrades
We Were Dancing
When Ladies Meet
Wild Orchids

30x 19,95 = 598,50

They are losing 600 dollars on just 1 person. I sure hope they are reading this and that someone will take it up on the chat tomorrow! Goodbye Warnes!


Totally agree!!!
Please let me know where you got them from
Best regards
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post #356 of 3526
3/25/09 at 4:57am

re: Warner Archive Discussion Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by birdyblabla
Totally agree!!!
Please let me know where you got them from
Best regards
For the thousandth time. Films that Warner own international rights to will be available to buyers who are outside the U.S. Here it is straight from Warner Home Video:
Quote:
[warnerbros] 1). There will be a availability of product WORLDWIDE shortly through the Warner Archive Collection. SHORTLY. We just don't have a date yet...it could be only a few days away.... bear with us...This would be only applicable to the films where we hold worldwide rights, which is MOST of them.
For titles that can't be sold internationally, I suggest you try Amazon Marketplace or eBay.
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post #357 of 3526
3/25/09 at 5:03am

re: Warner Archive Discussion Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Simon Howson
For the thousandth time. Film's that Warner own international rights to will be available to buyers who are outside the U.S.

As I already found about half a dozen titles I would purchase in flash, I can't but hope this will become true SOON! If it isn't already...
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post #358 of 3526
3/25/09 at 5:06am

re: Warner Archive Discussion Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aki K
As I already found about half a dozen titles I would purchase in flash, I can't but hope this will become true SOON! If it isn't already...
I must admit I am worried that Warner doesn't own the Australian rights to RKO and Allied Artists films, so it looks like I'll have to find other means to get those. But WB and MGM titles should be fine.

So it is not perfect, but at least they will be available on proper DVDs.


I don't know if these tidbits has been mentioned:
Quote:
If you’re really into your pre-Blu Hollywood classics, then it’s also worth noting that Warner Bros has also plans to launch a series of golden era podcasts.

The Golden History of Hollywood podcasts – to be made available free later this month through iTunes – will be a mixture of archival recordings, including behind the scenes interviews with stars of yesteryear and radio editions of films.
Warner launches press-to-order DVD movie service ? Register Hardware

Quote:
“With shrinking shelf space and a shrinking retail base, we were looking for a way to get the movies to the people who wanted them,” Feltenstein noted.

Feltenstein did add that until this point, only titles with expected sales of over 20,000 went to print, but the new MOD removes these restrictions.
http://www.afterdawn.com/news/archive/17352.cfm

I never knew that 20,000 was considered the benchmark for minimum sales of a title.
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post #359 of 3526
3/25/09 at 5:34am

re: Warner Archive Discussion Thread

I find it kind of sad that so many people don't read the forum before complaining about international orders not being taken. I for one complained about this before the chat. Knowing the Warner's will soon be taking orders makes me happy, , but even if I was able to order, I probably wouldn't until I read some reviews from those who have these discs in their hands.

Maybe there is a simple reason other then rights issues. Considering how overwhelmed Warner's was just from orders in the US. Warner's probably could not have handled all the orders at once so the decided to roll out archive collection slowly. Maybe countries will be added once orders die down. Adding Canada next would boost up sales again. This would be followed by other counties. The reality is that sales will die down. Even with 20 titles added per month, sales could possibly match the sales numbers from the first couple of weeks.

There is also an issue with region coding and PAL issues. If these are region 1 DVD's , then only those with region free or region 1 players could play them. I don't know if Warner's will offer these films in PAL or not, so maybe these titles won't be of much use for non collectors.
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post #360 of 3526
3/25/09 at 5:35am

re: Warner Archive Discussion Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Crawford
So is the site active for Canadians now? If so then that's progress which will leave our international members next to be taken care of.
Crawdaddy
No it is not active for Canadians yet. When I tried to join it replied that I do not meet the location requirements.
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