A few words about...™ Pinocchio -- in Blu-ray - Page 4

Re: A few words about...™ Pinocchio -- in Blu-ray

Disney is by far the best company out there for correcting mistakes so if this an error then I think we'll see a corrected disc.

Re: A few words about...™ Pinocchio -- in Blu-ray

But it just makes no sense that it's not on the mono track. Maybe they were using this mono track for reference in their surround sound remix, and since it wasn't there, they cut it out. (Wouldn't it be funny if this mono track was actually a "new" mono mix, and they were hoodwinking us all?)

Re: A few words about...™ Pinocchio -- in Blu-ray

This much fuss over one word!? Come on.

Re: A few words about...™ Pinocchio -- in Blu-ray

The fuss is that it should have been very obvious to anyone familiar with the film that this was missing. It's been there for 59 years.

I wonder if people would be upset if the word "frankly" was omitted from Rhett Butler's, "Frankly, my dear, I don't give a damn." It is only one word, after all.

Re: A few words about...™ Pinocchio -- in Blu-ray

The film should be preserved and this was probably a mistake in the restoration process. Disney would probably like to know this so that the film will be seen as intended.

Re: A few words about...™ Pinocchio -- in Blu-ray

I have to agree to some extinct with Brad. Why can't film simply be released like books and music; where we can just access the material?

I'm not forced to listen to sermonizing before I read Huck Finn or listen to Pink Floyd. But if I want to revisit my Looney Tunes cartoons, I have to hear (or manipulate around) some "message" from Whoopi Goldberg each time, even just to watch one or two cartoons.

On the opposite end of things, we get current product being pitched in our face as acceptable. I know Eddie Murphy isn't Disney, but it reminds me of the ads a few years back for "The Nutty Professor" which claimed it was fun for the whole family. The TV spots said "fun and laughs for your whole family".

Fun for the whole family apparently includes a 10 minute scene of the foul-mouthed comedian hurling insults, loads of fart jokes and potty humor, hamster rape, granny stepping on her own breasts, granny talking about sex & much more the whole family can enjoy. But there's no warning. Not even about over-eating. (I don't hate The Nutty Professor by the way)

Re: A few words about...™ Pinocchio -- in Blu-ray

I was able to skip past the smoking intro (and yes I was in awe of the film's BD treatment; I bought and watched the movie the day it came out). I don't like it, but as long as I can skip it and it keeps the movie uncut, there are worse things to get upset over. Maybe now they can put a disclaimer/sermonette on an unaltered Fantasia BD or that Uncle Remus picture.

It's interesting how smoking gets singled out when it is viewed very disapprovingly in the film. And no warnings about:

—Animal abuse
—Drinking
—Stereotypes of Italians, French, Dutch, and Russians
—The endangered status of whales
—Biting into a piece of metal
—The smoke, and therefore pollution, produced by burning firewood
—A child's bare bottom in one of Gepetto's clocks.
—Some might consider "jackass" a bad word
—Anything at Pleasure Island
—Obesity
—The idea that you can actually get stuff by wishing on a star
—Gideon's hand gesture when Honest John reminds him of the time they tried to convince Stromboli that he was a puppet.
—Single parenting

If we want to warn people about antisocial behaviors, we might as well go whole hog.

Re: A few words about...™ Pinocchio -- in Blu-ray

When does this warning show? I haven't seen it yet. Maybe it was the way I started up the movie. When the first Disney blu-ray trailer shows I went to menu and played the movie from the total menu.

Re: A few words about...™ Pinocchio -- in Blu-ray

It plays before the menu comes up. It sounds like you skipped it though.

Re: A few words about...™ Pinocchio -- in Blu-ray

my only issues with the pressing of the disc is that the film starts so fast that my PS3 still has that PLAY arrow on the screen as the RKO title is playing usually all on screen display symbols etc dissapear before you see the film play itself... I may try to see if I can turn off the on screen display for it but it isn't a huge deal I just don't want to see it say it is playing over the RKO title (corner of the screen)

Usually the screen stays black a bit longer I guess is why it is an issue on this BD - this is the first one I've noticed it on.

Re: A few words about...™ Pinocchio -- in Blu-ray

Yeah, I finally did see it by not going to menu from the first trailer. Consequently, those that want to skip it altogether, just go to the menu from the first trailer

Re: A few words about...™ Pinocchio -- in Blu-ray

I look forward to some inside info on the missing "Right!" line by Jimminy in the give-a-little-whistle song. I noticed that the first time too, but I do want make sure that it's really supposed to be there before taking Disney to task. The fact that it's on the soundtrack 78 from 1940 is a good indicator.


It's not careless, inattentive, or arrogant to do one's best to match color fidelity to the most stable and objective elements available: the painted artwork. As a matter of well informed opinion, one can argue that photographic elements should be the overriding point of reference and not the hand-painted artwork. However, that doesn't indicate that there's anything careless, inattentive, or arrogant about presuming the other point of view.

Lowery and Disney have meticulously restored the color to what they believe to be the most true representation of what the original artists wanted us to see. They may or may not have done this perfectly or to everyone's taste, but careless, inattentive, and arrogant aren't words that apply.

Re: A few words about...™ Pinocchio -- in Blu-ray

I thought the new Pinocchio bd/dvd transfer was awesome. I sincerely hope that Disney will do the same for FANTASIA, my favorite of their titles, next year!!

Re: A few words about...™ Pinocchio -- in Blu-ray

I agree. I would also add (in this layman's opinion) that, specific to the color palette, I do not sense that they tried to pretty up the film. I think that color manipulation is THE issue in video of this decade, whether it is changing colors to a more 'modern' palette or warming up the colors to make the film appeal as eye candy or messing with the white/black of the film. I just do not get the sense that this has happened here.


Robert,

With that viewpoint and assuming some art is in very good condition, do you think that WHV should re-capture the original look of the matte paintings in the Wizard of Oz?

Re: A few words about...™ Pinocchio -- in Blu-ray

Robert:

Care to make any guesses as to what might have happened with Jiminy's missing dialogue from "Give a Little Whistle?" (With the caveat and understanding that it would only be a guess.)

Re: A few words about...™ Pinocchio -- in Blu-ray

But what about the fact that colors were chosen based on how they would photograph and be printed in Technicolor? Therefore matching color to original artwork would not result in the proper coloring. For example, whites were often tinted slightly so as to be off-white (apparently pure white would not print properly in Technicolor - this is what I've read). Might that explain why the whites of Cinderella's stepmother's eyes are green or blue in some scenes on the 2005 DVD release but were white on every previous release? Sure... That is, if the original cels were colored that way. But still, that would be incorrect. The fact that the colors aren't consistent from shot to shot though calls that into question.

1992 release - Jiminy says "Right!" after Pinocchio says his name


2009 release


1992 release - Jiminy says "Look out, Pinoch!" (ms)


2009 release

Re: A few words about...™ Pinocchio -- in Blu-ray

Theoretically, this could actually be fixed via updating the BD-Live disc online over the Internet. The missing audio clips of Jiminy could be downloaded and then mixed into the soundfield at the appropriate timecodes. The same fix could be made for the missing "DisneyView" panel. Of course this wouldn't help people without Profile 2.0 players.

Just as an aside, does anyone else think that it would have been much cleaner and easier to implement the "DisneyView" matting by mastering it with the video encode (i.e. instead of layering it on the screen using Java graphics)? Then, if you don't want to view it you select black bars to cover them up instead...no timecodes, no dropped images, no tricky software image fading, etc. Oh, well...they didn't consult me.

Re: A few words about...™ Pinocchio -- in Blu-ray

Maybe if you want to just have one set of panels (though I'd still argue that it's better to do it as-is on the disc; wouldn't anybody with a Profile 1.0 player get stuck with the panels always on?). But I thought the disc included multiple sets of panels to choose from, which makes your idea not possible.

Re: A few words about...™ Pinocchio -- in Blu-ray

Nice work, Chuck.

In the big picture, it's only a few words...but I think most people will agree: they should be there. Plain and simple.

==========================================

Randy Thornton is one of the Executive Producers at Walt Disney Records.

He has been involved in numerous restorations of the musical elements for the early Disney animated classics. At a different forum (of which he is an active member) I posted questions about the missing dialogue. This is his response:


So, his best guess is that it might be that the restoration team turned to a different audio source for the audio restoration of the film and didn't realize those bits had been excised. If true, if would be an interesting tale, but unfortunate.

Re: A few words about...™ Pinocchio -- in Blu-ray

I'm not sure who you are quoting with "as photographed." If you simply meant that a matte painting is created from a set design photograph, how is that different from a cell that started out as a photograph before rotoscoping?

Further, the Emerald City (cityscape) does not exist other than in the art of the matte painter. It's not matching a vision, it is the realized vision. With the discussion point about color, how is that fundamentally different from referencing the color of a painted cell?

Re: A few words about...™ Pinocchio -- in Blu-ray

The movie certainly looks quite amazing on Blu-Ray.

Re: A few words about...™ Pinocchio -- in Blu-ray

Am I missing something about using the status bar that comes up when you pause the film? So far on my Panasonic BD30, I've been able to cycle through the pictures representing chapters but the chapter title remains the current chapter and when I hit select(in an effort to advance to the chapter represented by the picture), the player locked up and had to be turned off via the front button because it wouldn't turn off by remote. After updating the firmware up to the current 2.8, the player doesn't lock up but the disc stops playing and it has to be restarted.

How is this status bar supposed to work? Can you select chapters from it? Am I doing it wrong or is my player unable to handle the status bar?

Re: A few words about...™ Pinocchio -- in Blu-ray

Hi all. I'm glad to see that in shots where there is effects animation the've left light grain in other elements too, in shots like the fairy and Jiminy.

Re: A few words about...™ Pinocchio -- in Blu-ray

I bought this yesterday and watched it - I was very impressed and thought it looked outstanding, overall. I love the work Disney is doing on these classics.

Re: A few words about...™ Pinocchio -- in Blu-ray

I'm sure that Disney would probably want to know about the omissions. And here's hoping the rest of the film doesn't have any more. They didn't spend all of that money for the most perfect Pinocchio ever, only to have a few lines mistakenly left out. It's one thing when the material no longer exists; it is another when every other release contained the lines. I hope they can offer replacements.

Re: A few words about...™ Pinocchio -- in Blu-ray

What do you guys think of this scene, where Pinocchio's yellow shirt turns white, and then is splotchy white/yellow, and then yellow again?

Note that this did not happen in any of the previous releases. If this isn't a sign that the film has been largely processed and recolored, I don't know what is. Where is the quality control?








The clip is here:

Re: A few words about...™ Pinocchio -- in Blu-ray

Whoa! My goodness, this isn't good.