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Upgrading a NEW Home Theatre Set-up

post #1 of 16
2/27/09 at 4:15pm
Thread Starter 
Hi All

I just registered to become part of what looks to be and very informative and helpful HT forum.

As recently as 6 months ago I got the green-light from the CFO to budget, plan and execute a home theatre setup in what was previously our upstairs family room. My three older teenage sons were excited at the prospect and had all types of suggestions (“Gaming!” “BIG HDTV!” “Blur Ray!” “Lots of speakers!”).

My goal was to have a viable configuration up ‘n running by Superbowl Sunday (Feb1).
In order to do this and remain within budget I utilized a number of existing components and speakers. The room is approximately 16’ w x 15’

Already in the arsenal:

Receiver: Pioneer VSX-516 — no hdmi; and really a lower-end Pioneer 7.1 model
DVD player: Toshiba HD-A2KU – a HD-DVD player I purchased a year ago or so when HDDVD was suggested as the ‘way’ of the future…
Front/Center speakers: JBL-S38s and JBL s-Center; I’ve had these for 6-7 years and really love the sound.
Surrounds: 4 Cambridge SoundWorks Newton Series II S205 Surround Speakers

...plus a Monster Home Theater PowerCenter HTS 1000 and about 150 feet of original Monster Cable speaker cable.

Upgrades/Purchases I made:
Big screen: I purchased a Samsung 63” plasma ( Samsung PN63A760)
Subwoofer: BIC Acoustech HT100 subwoofer
Cable connects: I created/constructed my own connects (component cables) with Belkin hi-quality cables & canare connectors.

Comcast installed an HDTV box: Motorola DCT5100

After long hours of pulling cable thru walls, painting, speaker mounting, testing and clean-up, the new ‘Guy’s Room’ was ready to debut just in time for the Superbowl (see image).



The Samsung looks great and the sound through the system is not too shabby. Since there’s no HDMI thru the receiver, everything was connected via component cables. My son’s XBOX 360 plugs directly into the Samsung & bypasses the receiver

My goal is to upgrade the AV Receiver. My updated budget to do so is around $1000. I’m looking for some experienced opinions and recommendations on reputable makes & models that would greatly enhance the HT experience. I've done some research on the Pioneers (the Elite SC-05), Onkyo (TX-SR706), but am open to suggrestions

Many thanks!

Kevin
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post #2 of 16
2/27/09 at 6:15pm

Re: Upgrading a NEW Home Theatre Set-up

Instead of the Onkyo 706, maybe go with the Onkyo 876. It has all the bells and whistles you could want, and has the HQV Reon video chip, which is supposed to be one of the best ones. Amazon has it right now for $1007.70 ($7.70 over budget) with free shipping. Onkyo makes a fine product. I have the 805, and like it a lot. See it here:
Amazon.com: Onkyo TX-SR876 7.1 Channel Home Theater Receiver (Black): Audio & Video
Good luck with whatever you get.
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post #3 of 16
2/27/09 at 7:31pm

Re: Upgrading a NEW Home Theatre Set-up

Hi Kevin,

Nice looking room. I'll second the Onkyo 876 recommendation. All the bells and whistles at a decent price.
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post #4 of 16
2/27/09 at 7:45pm
Thread Starter 

Re: Upgrading a NEW Home Theatre Set-up

Thanks, guys, for the suggestion. I know Onkyo has a great rep for AV products. I'll check out the 876! What I'm looking for is a quality unit that wont be obsolete in 12-16 months....and a few bells & whistles are okay,too!
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post #5 of 16
2/27/09 at 8:25pm

Re: Upgrading a NEW Home Theatre Set-up

I would dissuade you on having your first upgrade be the receiver, given your equipment list. The sound won't be drastically different. And spending a lot of money for high quality SD upconversion (getting Onkyo 876 vs. 706/606), that may be marginally better than your TV's built-in upconversion, to me makes less sense than spending the money to get HD sources to begin with which will always blow away SD no matter how good the processing.

I would spend the money first on:
-TivoHD. (or at least get Comcast DVR instead of the 5100). Having a dual tuner DVR gets you a lot more HD programming since you can then record from whenever a show airs, and watch at your leisure, instead of being bound to convenient prime time schedules or out of luck if two shows air against one another or you just happen to be out that evening. Plus you can skip a lot of commercials!
- Blu-ray player (with multi-ch analog to connect to your HDMI-less receiver).
-a good universal remote if you don't have one (Logitech Harmony One/670/620).

Get receiver upgrade later, maybe. I guarantee you'll get more enjoyment with the above for the amount of money spent than putting it toward a receiver upgrade.
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post #6 of 16
2/28/09 at 7:29am

Re: Upgrading a NEW Home Theatre Set-up

The difference in sound between the 876 and a lower-end Pioneer 7.1 model, should be noticeably different. Difference between a 606 and the Pioneer may not be much, but the 876 should be a different story.

I agree that he needs a blu ray player, but at least he has an HD DVD player until he can go BD. Tivo wouldn't even be a consideration for me. I have no desire to record anything off tv. If I miss it because of watching something else, I'll catch it when they rerun it. And they will rerun it. Especially movies. He may feel the same. He never mentioned wanting one in his setup.

More people may agree that a receiver is less important, but I think it's the most important part of a system. It's the heart, and everything else builds off of it.............. just my $.02 though. I'm usually alone in my way of thinking.
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post #7 of 16
2/28/09 at 10:33am

Re: Upgrading a NEW Home Theatre Set-up

Well I am of the total opposite opinion, receiver (other than equalization/DSP effects e.g. Audyssey) makes the least difference in sound. Speaker selection, placement, room dimensions/shape/treatments have overwhelmingly more effect. A receiver, absent equalization, is just supposed to decode the DD/DTS according to the specified algorithms and then linearly amplify the signal. There aren't supposed to be noticeable differences.

Quote:
I agree that he needs a blu ray player, but at least he has an HD DVD player until he can go BD.
Yeah but no new HD-DVD titles release in almost a year, can't get them from Netflix anymore ...

Quote:
Tivo wouldn't even be a consideration for me. I have no desire to record anything off tv. If I miss it because of watching something else, I'll catch it when they rerun it. And they will rerun it. Especially movies. He may feel the same. He never mentioned wanting one in his setup.

It partially depends how much sports & serialized TV one watches. These often don't rerun at all, or only after some years on syndication. And even for stuff that does rerun, there's no guarantee that it will run at a time convenient for you. With a DVR everything's on at the time you want it to be on. Plus I cannot emphasize enough no commercials! It is just so much more efficient to zip through an hour show in 40-42 minutes.
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post #8 of 16
2/28/09 at 11:03am
Thread Starter 

Re: Upgrading a NEW Home Theatre Set-up

I've always been of the mind that the receiver is the 'hub' of the whole HT system (either the strongest of weakest link) and I realized that when I started this project that my 516 wasn't probably going to cut it in the long run.
Right now, DVRs really don't hold much appeal to me as I'm not a big TV watcher— with the exception of special events, sports, etc. But I know plenty of folks who have DVRS who swear by them! Someday I'll take the plunge. Bypassing commercials is a real plus!

Ed & Stephen, my apologies as I probably should've stated initially HOW I expected this system to be used, in descending order:

1. Movies (either broadcast, on-demand, or via DVD)
2. Gaming (xbox 360)
3. TV (HD channels & sports)
4. Music

I know HDDVD is a dead-end and plan on upgrading to a blue-ray. I just figured a NEW hdmi receiver would be a good start since I'd prefer an HDMI hook-up to a new blue-ray player. I'd really like to simplify the current component hook-ups (cable box, DVD player, xbox, receiver, plasma) to hdmi & eliminate the dozen or so interconnects currently in use.
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post #9 of 16
2/28/09 at 11:48am

Re: Upgrading a NEW Home Theatre Set-up

Well, whatever you prefer of course as it's your decision ... I don't think I'd spend more than a Onkyo 706 which would easily allow Blu-ray upgrade at the same time.

Just my feeling is that you already have your wiring setup and everything looks nice & hidden, so you spend all this money & from my perspective you likely won't feel much difference.

Just because the receiver is the hub and in the center doesn't mean that it's the most important. In a HT system the differences perceived between different components are greatest at the edges, the display/speakers. There and having good source material makes by far the most difference in user experience. People like to make the "weak link in a chain" argument but that doesn't really apply, because in a chain each link is identical, equally important, while in a HT system each component is serving a quite different purpose & most definitely do not have an equal effect on the end result the user sees/hears.
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post #10 of 16
2/28/09 at 2:08pm

Re: Upgrading a NEW Home Theatre Set-up

I have to agree with Stephen (sorry Ed). IMO, speakers are the item to spend the most on. They will last the longest. A good speaker today will still be a good speaker in 10 years or longer. My speakers cost 6 times more than my AVR.

However, since you already have your speakers, I like the 876 over the 806 and lower Onkyo's since the 876 includes a better version of Audyssey (MultEQ XT). Last year Onkyo included this in the 705 and up. This year they kinda dropped the ball (IMO). Of course if you don't already have Blu-Ray, AND you don't plan to get it for a long time, the 706 is fine.
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post #11 of 16
2/28/09 at 6:26pm

Re: Upgrading a NEW Home Theatre Set-up

I totally agree that speakers make the biggest difference in the sound. But he said he loves the speakers he has, so the next biggest difference (to me) is the receiver. The receiver can be great without BD, Xbox, Tivo, and HD cable box. But without a receiver, it's just............well, tv. (I know there's already a receiver. Just making the point of the receiver being the heart of the system)
It's all good though..............
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post #12 of 16
2/28/09 at 9:33pm
Thread Starter 

Re: Upgrading a NEW Home Theatre Set-up

Yeah, I'm pretty satisfied with the front speakers; the surrounds are passable (Cambridge close-out deal) and when the budget allows, I'll probably upgrade those.

Sounds like the 876 is definitely worth consideration.
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post #13 of 16
3/3/09 at 11:42am

Re: Upgrading a NEW Home Theatre Set-up

WooHoo! Love the S38!

I've whalloped this deceased equine before, but here I go again: I just wasn't happy with my S-center. It sounded nasally, and definitely was not timber-matched to the S38s. In the end, I trolled a certain online auction site and replaced my center and surrounds with S38 cabinets. I have NO weird EQ on any channel, and a sound can pan around the entire room without a big change in timber. This is important in movies, but really shines during games. As I spin my character, the sounds around me naturally move without change in quality.


The big reason for upgrading the receiver would be to get HDMI - honestly the electronics these days are so good that a $45 amp sounds about the same as a $4500 amp -- providing you keep the gain low enough...ha!
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post #14 of 16
3/3/09 at 3:13pm
Thread Starter 

Re: Upgrading a NEW Home Theatre Set-up

Quote:
Originally Posted by chuckg
WooHoo! Love the S38!

I've whalloped this deceased equine before, but here I go again: I just wasn't happy with my S-center. It sounded nasally, and definitely was not timber-matched to the S38s. In the end, I trolled a certain online auction site and replaced my center and surrounds with S38 cabinets. I have NO weird EQ on any channel, and a sound can pan around the entire room without a big change in timber. This is important in movies, but really shines during games. As I spin my character, the sounds around me naturally move without change in quality.
I picked up my S38s about 5-6 years ago and they were sitting dormant in my office until I broke them out for the HT set-up. I was pleasantly surprised by the smoothness and clarity of these speakers. The S-center was a recent addition and I haven't anything to compare it to other than it was my understanding it was 'matched' to go with the s38s...at least according to the JBL specs.
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post #15 of 16
3/5/09 at 3:52pm

Re: Upgrading a NEW Home Theatre Set-up

That set-up looks AWESOME!
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post #16 of 16
3/6/09 at 2:04pm
Thread Starter 

Re: Upgrading a NEW Home Theatre Set-up

Quote:
Originally Posted by jasonstilwell
That set-up looks AWESOME!
Thanks, Jason.
The room had a pretty radical transformation from where it was 6 months ago (a multipurpose family room with WAY too much furniture crowding an old 30" sony).

The room is pretty good size (17'L x 18'W with a peaked ceiling that tops out around 9.5' at the beam and 6.25 & 7.25' at side walls). So my first concern was to streamline (i.e. get rid of!) some of the excess clutter and furniture and leave only the essentials (sectional sofa, a few bookcases, my desk....). The NEW guy's decor was to have all components, speakers & furniture be black to contrast with the new 'manly 'green wall color, plus we hung up about a dozen movie posters of certain films my sons favor (Braveheart, Gladiator, Saving Private Ryan, Ben Hur, etc..).

The entertainment unit holding the components also houses the Xbox 360 with all the controllers, games, movies DVDs and music cds. It'll hold about 200. Pretty good value for the low price I got it for...



Wishlist:
• Universal Remote (Harmony One)
• HDMI Receiver
• Blue Ray player
• better surrounds
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