A few words about...™ The French Connection -- in Blu-ray - Page 3

Re: A few words about...™ The French Connection -- in Blu-ray

Well, you can call it over emotionalizing because it is not your work that has been compromised. Would you be so understanding of someone's manipulations if it was your work that was modified with out so much as the courtesy of a consultation, especially if that work was creative?

I don't blame the guy for expressing his displeasure emotionally. It's his work that has suddenly been deemed to be "lacking" by Friedkin: work that was considered cutting edge when it first came out: work that was unique and fresh enough to garner a nomination for Best Cinematography. Now, all of a sudden, after all these years the visual narrative he helped create is suddenly deemed to be "incorrect" and in need of revision.

Personally, I think that he was actually restrained in the comments he made. Also, one of the definitions of emasculate is "to reduce in vigor, to weaken". Synonyms are: to undermine, to soften, to devitalize. The fact that he chose to use a masculine form as a descriptor does not mean that he is saying the film is male.

Edit: Similes should have been synonyms.

Re: A few words about...™ The French Connection -- in Blu-ray

That can be debated (but maybe not here). It should be a collaboration between the director and the person behind the camera whose work closely mirrors his own.

Criterion makes a point of working with the cinematographers in making the transfer. Look at what happened with CHUNGKING EXPRESS. After it was set to go to manufacturing, Chris Doyle had some changes with it and they redid it.

Re: A few words about...™ The French Connection -- in Blu-ray

Very true. But Criterion also has a series of "Director Approved" releases as well. And I'm not trying to marginalize or minimize the DP's contribution to a film, but most DP's these day's freely admit they are there to realize the director's vision and intent, not necessarily their own. Even on the actual films, it states "A Film By (The Director)" not "A Film By (The Cinematographer)." But I think it's a bit revisionist to say that, as has been implied here, the aesthetic of a film is 'owned' by the cinematographer as opposed to the director, or even to the same degree as the director.

Re: A few words about...™ The French Connection -- in Blu-ray

I find Friedkin to come across as a tit at the best of times. What he's done to The French Connection and might possibly do to The Exorcist, simply validates how much of a tit he actually is.

Re: A few words about...™ The French Connection -- in Blu-ray

True, but I think that the "Director Approved" has more to do with the cut of the film, the edit, rather than the look.

As for the "A Film By" credit, as a longtime subscriber to the auteur theory, I've pretty much let it lapse in recent years. The more you look at the making of a film, with the input of a producer (who hires the director and puts it all together), the actors (who are hired sometimes by the producer or studio), the writer (who often develops the script before anyone sees it), I think that credit should be done away with. That is unless the director wrote, directs, and produces the film.

Re: A few words about...™ The French Connection -- in Blu-ray

Could be, but most of the ones I own from that series are theatrical cuts.


Well it's not to imply that a director does it all himself, but that it is his intent and vision for the film. Otherwise you can have everyone doing their own thing: a writer who wrote a scathing social indictment, actors playing it like a satirical comedy, a PD who sees it as German expressionistic homage, a cinematographer who wants to do a pastoral, golden-hued Hallmark card. And all hoping that the parts make something interesting. It's definitely a collaborative art, but you need one vision and intent to ensure that you have one film, not bits of many divergent ones. Someone has to lead the many voices to one cohesive result.

Even in the Oscar speeches the director is the acknowledged leader of the films. As Sean Penn said, he put himself "in the hands of Gus Van Sant," not "Isn't it fortunate that Gus' work and my work ended up being compatible."

I'm a firm believer that it all starts with the writer, but in the film industry the writer is not the final word, like they are on stage. Many writers will tell you that what they wrote is not what ended up on screen. That's a reality of the film industry. Stage is a writer's and actor's medium, while film is a director's.

Re: A few words about...™ The French Connection -- in Blu-ray

RH :"Personally, I like what Mr. Friedkin has done with the film",

I can't agree with this after watching the Club Scene with a supremes
type group,and the scene before it in the police station,the dvd looks
better to me,the club scene just pops out as looking very strange

Draining the color is fine if the picture isn't as grainy
as this scene is,Neither looks great but removing color isn't an improvement
And thats the problem with the whole job,it dosn't improve the bad
looking scenes and looks sharper because of the format,not because
of what they did

Since the dvd dosn't look all that great it was really hard comparing the two
The movie is still great in any version,

Re: A few words about...™ The French Connection -- in Blu-ray

I just finished watching THE FRENCH CONNECTION. As much as I enjoyed the original film, the grain in the film was totally disappointing.

Yes, the color was somewhat de-saturated, but the extreme grain was what upset me. I don't remember that much grain in the original prints. They had a soft look, but not that much grain.

It looks as though Friedkin had fun with his toys! This is not a keeper for me!

Re: A few words about...™ The French Connection -- in Blu-ray

No offense but I don't know if I'd trust anyone's memories of a print that they saw more than 35 years ago.

Re: A few words about...™ The French Connection -- in Blu-ray

The BluRay version of this film has been reviewed by Clydefro at DVD Times and is well worth reading.

In his "final thoughts" section of the review, Clydefro Jones has this to say:

"The French Connection is perhaps the best film of its kind, but, while keeping things in perspective, it's nonetheless a huge black mark to see what director William Friedkin has done to it now, nearly forty years after the fact. I can only hope that Fox comes to its senses and puts out the real version on Blu-ray because the special features included here are mostly terrific, if repetitive".

I submit that this would not be an issue if this BluRay release contained a third disc which included the original version which we know and love, and to further quote Clydefro Jones "whether this (omission) was done intentionally or just out of neglect, is largely unforgivable".

Cinematographer was "appalled"

If our posts are not enough, Owen Roizman, the cinematographer of THE FRENCH CONNECTION was "appalled" by this transfer.

He should know!

Re: A few words about...™ The French Connection -- in Blu-ray

Aside from agreeing that the original could have been provided, there is no consesus that the new transfer is bad. It is simply a matter of opinion. There are reviewers out there who actually like the new transfer.


http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...php?p=15919391

The French Connection on Blu-ray Disc: Review by Greg Robinson on BigPictureBigSound

The French Connection Blu-ray - Gene Hackman Roy Scheider

http://www.dvdtalk.com/dvdsavant/s2838conn.html

http://www.dvdverdict.com/reviews/fr...nnectionbd.php

http://grouchoreviews.com/reviews/3348

Blu-ray Review: The French Connection

The French Connection

The French Connection [Blu-ray] - Premiere.com - Premiere.com

Re: A few words about...™ The French Connection -- in Blu-ray

I'll take the word of the actual person who shot the film over the opinions of a bunch of people who wouldn't know one end of a lense from the other. If the cinematographer of TFC says this modified film is a travesty and atrocious looking then I'll trust his eye, since he was the one who shot it in the first place.

Re: A few words about...™ The French Connection -- in Blu-ray

I don't care if the new transfer was blessed by the pope, they are selling this for 30 bucks around here. I spent 20 on the regular dvd not that long ago, and they can't be bothered to include the original version? I'm often a sucker for double dipping but this doesn't cut it. Amadeus too.

Re: A few words about...™ The French Connection -- in Blu-ray

Tried to watch it again today... Oh dear.

No, I can't take the radioactive santa suit seriously at all.

Tinkering vs. Restoring

As a reaction to the DVD Times review, one poster hit the nail on the head:

"This release is a sad example of the difference between tinkering and restoring and, in its tinkered form, hugely damages the enjoyment one gets from a classic film. It is unfortunate that tinkering seems to be all too common at the moment."

Well said!

I've just read too many reviews that said that the video was "interesting" as opposed to what it did to the enjoyment of the film.

Re: A few words about...™ The French Connection -- in Blu-ray

Agreed, dvdirv. The Santa suit burned holes in my retinas, the grain in most of the dark scenes looked like a blizzard of black snow and was distracrting in the extremis, and the color issues described in this thread just don't do it for me. I'll dig out my SDDVD spl. ed. and compare it with the BD but I suspect that I'll be dumping the BD version. Too bad, it's a great movie.

Brad V.

Re: A few words about...™ The French Connection -- in Blu-ray

You know what bugged my even more than the terrible PQ on the BD? It was that idiot... and I don't use the word idiot lightly... that idiot Friedkin in the color timing featurette, trying to justify and convince us how good this act of cinematic rape was. Showing us footage of the film in HD before they messed it up, teasing us with what The French Connection should have looked like in HD. Mr. Friedkin, hear my words.... You sir, are a prize winning idiot!

Re: A few words about...™ The French Connection -- in Blu-ray

Having just watched it through for the second time this week, I find the new blu-ray version to be quite beautiful and on the whole much better than the previous dvd version. It feels much more film-like.

The fleshtones are 100% spot on, which they never were before, suffering under the slight amber cast that was always present on home video versions. The untanned New Yorkers in Midwinter now actually look normal.

The black levels are much richer than ever before, and it was nice to see the grain. The EXCESSIVE grain in some of the shots used in he "Poughkeepsie Shuffle" doc (particularly the scene inside the Chez) reveals how bad the film could have looked and thankfully does not.

The detail level is terrific as well. Noticeable in the scene where the French undercover detective sits at an outdoor table at La Samaritaine, you can now clearly see that the tabletop has a marbled pattern on it. On the dvd and videos it always looked more like a solid red plastic table you'd sit at to eat a corndog in Tomorrowland.

I agree that the bleeding on the Santa suit is distracting. If it were up to me, I certainly would not have defocussed the color in those particular shots as much as they did.

But as it's not my film it wasn't up to me. And it certainly didn't stop my enjoyment of the film. I also agree with those who say the changes are not as radical as others would have people believe.

Re: A few words about...™ The French Connection -- in Blu-ray

I have to agree with John on this one. The DP is more often than not hired by the director, or at least chosen by the director. It is not unheard of for a DP, or a composer or any number of other creative people involved in a film to be replaced in the middle of shooting, because they aren't giving the director what he or she wants.

Yes film is a collaborative art, but ultimately a film set is a benevolent dictatorship. Once the director is hired, he is in charge and he makes all the choices.

Doug

Re: A few words about...™ The French Connection -- in Blu-ray

Friedkin and Boizman worked together after this on The Exorcist, so they must've been on the same page.

Re: A few words about...™ The French Connection -- in Blu-ray

I've bought the BD, and watched the movie for the first time; it is indeed terrific.

But I am a little confused by all the hoopla about the color. When Friedkin shows the negative pre-color timing, it looks washed out and grainy, exactly the effect he seems to be going for. Why all the energy with extra layers and color saturation? The original seems fine.

Re: A few words about...™ The French Connection -- in Blu-ray

whats with all that loading crap on this,everything about this BR was slow
on my player,the menus weren't all that great,the extras were excellent

One should also remember that that last dvd ,looked diiferent then the
laser ,which of those two looked like the original?

I really think the original negative is were all the problems are,Billy might
have changed the look of the color,But the up's and downs of the Picture
Q. are because of the Original neg,Why at the end there are shots that
look great ,then right after one great looking shot theres some over grainy
shots that looks like they didn't have enough light

Re: A few words about...™ The French Connection -- in Blu-ray

Again, I don't really understand.

Before anything is done to the film, colorwise, there is a print made from the negative, and that print is in color. The color is a flat, low-contrast color, but color nonetheless.

Why do anything at all to it, on this film? Friedkin didn't want natural, rich hues, but something harsher. Why not allow the negative to be seen as it really is?

I don't really have any complaint about this BD except this: the "color" of the movie seems manipulated, and then you find out that it is. It's a distraction.

I know all movies are color-timed, but this does seem like an extreme way of doing it, getting a color "look" that might have been achieved much more easily.

Re: A few words about...™ The French Connection -- in Blu-ray

Yeah, I actually thought I had a defective disc for a minute because the load time was so long. I'd seen some slow blu-rays but nothing like this.

Also, I just remembered that Fincher completely re-timed his film Se7en digitally for home theater release on the New Line Platinum Series dvd to where it looked completely diffrerent from the theatrical release and no one balked at that or insisted the "original" version be released in the same package. I also don't see anyone calling for the theatrical cut of Zodiac on blu-ray or boycotting the current (DC only) release since it doesn't also include the TC. Added to the titles I mentioned earlier, I really have to wonder why the DVD of Se7en and the blu-rays of Friday the 13th, Sleeping Beauty and Zodiac are somehow exempt from the all-important "must include the original version" rule so vociferously put forth here.

Re: A few words about...™ The French Connection -- in Blu-ray

It's all a matter of preference, I think. Some want this version, others another version. So that's why (in the extreme cases) both versions should be included. But all this 'campaigning' made me realize something: I'm beginning to get to a point where I almost don't enjoy the movies anymore. There sometimes is too much fuss going on, and I really don't want to become someone who argues about every title out there. And I haven't even seen TFC on BD yet (and caps can be faulty too). So I'll probably buy it. Most of the time I tend to watch the director's preferred cut anyway.
Phew, conflicting opinions of a single person, but anyway .

Re: A few words about...™ The French Connection -- in Blu-ray

This is just an opinion but if Mr. Friedkin had more directorial jobs lined up I doubt he'd fine the time to go back and mess around with all these transfers. The debate on who has the right to change something is an interesting one. I've been to a few boards where debates about the colorized Ray Harryhausen films have broken out. Some people fall back on the claim that people are watching these movies for Harryhausen's work so his word on whether or not they should be in color is up to him. Thankfully both versions were released.

I would like to know which side of the fence people will fall on if the director of a B&W movie says he originally wanted to shoot it in color and forty-years later colorizes the movie and only releases that version. It really seems like this is something we're headed for and it's clear Friedkin has nothing better to do than mess around with previous films. I do have to wonder why he has so much control over the films and if some of his comments will hold true in regards to the eventual release of THE EXORCIST.

I almost picked this up at Target yesterday but I eventually walked away. I had to do this with CRUISING as well but I hope that's not the case with future films.