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AV Processor Comparison

post #1 of 13
1/26/09 at 10:56am
Thread Starter 
I currently have a Anthem AVM-20 and it sounds great; however, I am thinking about purchasing a new Processor. The new processor would have to have HDMI switching as well.

I really like the multi-room capability and flexibility that the AVM-20 has always provided me.

Any thoughts or comparisons of what is on the market today that sounds as good as the AVM-20 but adds video switching (1080P)? Why would you recommend this particular piece of equipment versus other competitors?
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post #2 of 13
1/26/09 at 11:43am

Re: AV Processor Comparison

Off the top of my head you may want to consider:

Marantz AV8003, $2,599
Rotel RSP-1570, $2,199
Integra DHC-9.9, $2,000

Plus the usual suspects from Anthem, Lexicon, Emotiva, Outlaw, etc. Or if money is burning a hole in your pocket, consider the Denon AVP-A1HDCI for $7,999

Cheers,
Alon
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post #3 of 13
1/26/09 at 5:01pm
Thread Starter 

Re: AV Processor Comparison

Really interested in what makes a processor a good processor (or better than the others).

Is it the amount of formats, codecs, inputs / outputs, ... ?

Why would you recommend any of these? Maybe money is burning a hole in my pocket if the Denon was substantially better than the rest.

So how do I compare and contrast these units?
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post #4 of 13
1/26/09 at 5:14pm

Re: AV Processor Comparison

Sure, here is how I would compare the various pre/pro's:

1. Quality of the power supplies and signal path
2. Circuit layouts that shorten audio and video signal path
3. Number of individual transformers to power each discrete circuit
4. Toroidal transformers for audio playback
5. Separated power supply
6. Build quality, ability to isolate vibrations
7. DAC'c, DSP's, audio decoders (ability to decode Dolby TrueHD, DTS-HD, etc)
8. Video processor (e.g. Farouja DCDi, Silicon Optix Reon, Silicon Optix Realta, Anchor Bay VRS)
9. Number of HDMI 1.3a inputs and outputs
10. Number of balanced XLR inputs and outputs
11. Multi-zone capabilities
12. Additional features such as Audyssey, digital media connectivity, XM Radio, Ethernet capability, etc

Also, I find that with any pre/pro, synergy with your speakers is key! If possible, audition before purchasing. What multi-channel poweramp and speakers do you presently own?

Cheers,
Alon
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post #5 of 13
1/27/09 at 5:58am
Thread Starter 

Re: AV Processor Comparison

Current System

Pre/Pro - Anthem AVM-20
5 Channel Amp - Aragon 3005
5 Channel Amp (for other zones) - Adcom GFA-7500
TV - Panasonic TH-58PX600U
Blu-Ray - DMP-BD55
CD/DVD - Denon DVD-2910
Sat Receiver - DirecTV - HR20
Front Speakers - Vandersteen 3A Signature Series
Surround Speakers - Vandersteen 2Ce Signature Series
Center Channel - Klipsch KLF-C7
Subwoofer - Vandersteen V2W
Remote - Logitech Harmony 890

Lots of other gear in 2 other zones.
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post #6 of 13
1/27/09 at 6:45pm

Re: AV Processor Comparison

If you want my honest opinion I would keep the AVM-20, and purchase a DVDO Edge video processor. This will give you the best of both worlds, without blowing a small fortune on a limited upgrade. Also you may want to replace your center channel with a matching Vandersteen so that your front three speakers are timbre matched

The only thing missing would be decoding of Dolby TrueHD and DTS-HD, however you can still achieve full HD audio via the analogue outputs on your BR Player.

Great system by the way

Cheers,
Alon
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post #7 of 13
1/28/09 at 6:18am
Thread Starter 

Re: AV Processor Comparison

Just so I make sure I understand what you are suggesting:

If I keep the AVM-20, it does not have the capability to do Dolby TrueHD or DTS-HD. This is not a function of the DVDO Edge video processor. Is that correct?

If I just want to add video processing capabilities, then the DVDO Edge looks like an interesting device. A cheaper switching option could be the DVDO VS4 (since my current TV is not 1080P).

Does the DVDO Edge really make the picture quality much better for say my HR20 (DirecTV receiver)? I have no experience with video processors.

On a side note, I did not purchase the Vandersteen VCC-1 center channel at the time because it seemed under powered and sounded hollow. It is the only Vandersteen product that I have heard that I did not care for. They did not have the VCC-5 at the time. I've never heard this as I have not found a dealer with one on hand when I am close to their location. For $2,000, I image it sounds great.

If you want my honest opinion I would keep the AVM-20, and purchase a DVDO Edge video processor. This will give you the best of both worlds, without blowing a small fortune on a limited upgrade. Also you may want to replace your center channel with a matching Vandersteen so that your front three speakers are timbre matched

The only thing missing would be decoding of Dolby TrueHD and DTS-HD, however you can still achieve full HD audio via the analogue outputs on your BR Player
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post #8 of 13
2/8/09 at 6:51am

Re: AV Processor Comparison

Robert,

I was recently in the same situation as you: I went Blu but my beloved AVM20 did not decode the new HD audio codecs! If you search for my name, you will see that I auditioned the Integra DTC 9.8 as an HDMI solution, but missed the naturalness and warmth of the Anthem so promptly returned the Integra.

My solution was to spend about the same amount of money to buy a high quality Bluray (and audio) source (Denon 3800 retails for $2000) to decode the codecs and then send them via RCA cables to the Anthem's 6 channel analog inputs. If you set the Anthem's inputs for that source to Analog-DSP, you even retain full sound management control and processing (i.e. THX Ultra 2).

Alternatively, you could spend (again) the same amount ($2000) and let Anthem upgrade your AVM20 to an AVM50, which includes HDMI inputs, HD audio decoding, HDMI switching (with conversion of component inputs to HDMI outputs if desired) and really phenomenal video upscaling. In fact, I will probably end up doing this very soon because I want the new Anthem Room Correction! Then I will probably sell the Denon 3800 in favor of a less expensive BD player (as I will no longer need the analog outs).

Actually, send me a pm if you are interested in the Denon option at a discount.... : )

Oh yeah, in my opinion, the only thing that sounds as good as an AVM 20 but has HDMI switching is an AVM50....

Hope this helps!
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post #9 of 13
2/8/09 at 7:09pm

Re: AV Processor Comparison

I agree with Alon that the Denon AVP-A1HDCI is in a class by itself but that also refers to cost ($7500 list). Top of the line components through and through with a lot of flexibility for upgrading. I was lucky to buy one before the economic turn and am constantly amazed at the sound it produces. It's so good that I actually got rid of several component boxes to ease the pain of its cost.

Coincidentally I just wrote an article (which is referenced in the the first thread in this section) describing my current thoughts on such matters. Don't get me wrong - I'm not trying to tell you that there aren't other options than the AVP. There are lots of pre/pros out there that will do an admirable job in most areas. You just have to consider your budget and which features are the most important to you. As Mr. Goldberg said, "If money is burning a hole in your pocket...." One thing for sure, the AVP compares favorably with units costing much more than it (these do exist for those with deeper pockets than mine!).
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post #10 of 13
2/9/09 at 8:12am
Thread Starter 

Re: AV Processor Comparison

My local dealer is no longer available to discuss an upgrade to an AVM-50. Anyone know of a reliable contact for this discussion?

Interesting thoughts on single versus multiple components. I think this discussion centers around the idea that there is one pre/pro that will be able to be upgradeable, have the features that I need, play new codecs, etc. This is the basic reason that I purchased the AVM-20 a while back. It doesn't really matter whether or not you select a Denon, Anthem, etc.

It looks like I am at the point where I need to spend some additional $ to upgrade my system. The question is, which path to select:

1. Lowest cost - perhaps the DVDO Edge (no help with codecs issue but does video switching) - $700
2. Middle cost - upgrade the AVM-20 (possibly meets current needs) - $2,000
3. Highest cost - new pre/pro (current needs plus more future proof) - $7,500

It looks like I still need help with a few topics for me to make the best choice. I plan on keeping a 5.1 system for the foreseeable future. My space just doesn't allow for 7.1 or more.

With this in mind, which codecs options do I really need, and where can I get a better explanation of the codecs available? Are there really standard codecs for Blu-ray, ... I just don't have a good background in this area so I am looking for help.

No matter which magic box I buy, I understand it will be outdated next year. I don't believe any product on the market today is bullet proof in terms of being obsolete; however, I don't want to spend $2,000 if this is a one year fix due to codec options, etc. This seems to be driving sound both on PCs and pre/pros. The marketplace seems to be far from standardized in this area. Eventually, I think a great media player will come around that supports all of these concepts, but much like the PC, it too will become obsolete.
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post #11 of 13
2/9/09 at 11:10am

Re: AV Processor Comparison

The difference between the new HD audio codecs goes way beyond just a difference between 5.1 and 7.1 sound. In other words, 5.1 Dolby True HD or any other 5.1 HD codec will sound much better than 5.1 "regular" soundtracks. Think SACD quality vs. CD quality. It's a dramatic improvement even at 5.1. Of course this assumes that your system is capable of reproducing all the additional aural resolution of 5.1 HD audio codecs. (No kidding - I once had a heated "discussion" with someone who claimed that he heard no difference between 5.1 sound and 5.1 HD sound. I was puzzled until he told me that he did all his listening through his display's speakers!! "It's a very good display" was his rationalization.

Aaachh!)



Most people can readily distinguish between an HD picture and an SD picture but in my opinion, just as important to the whole HD experience is the so-called HD "sound" which is measured in megabits rather than kilobits of sampling resolution. To me some of the greatest buys in HD media are some of the concert discs. They truly sound like the performers are in the room!
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post #12 of 13
2/9/09 at 8:25pm
Thread Starter 

Re: AV Processor Comparison

I did a little reading tonight. It appears that a source containing TrueHD, there is no performance advantage to moving the decoding out of the source and into the preamp. Plus the source's HDMI ouput is sending this signal via mulichannel PCM audio to the processor. If you didn't do that, you would have a loss of interactive audio features built into the disc (such as language selection).

http://www.anthemav.com/NewSitev2.0/...stions_PDS.pdf

In other words, it doesn't appear that the codec issue matters if you are feeding your pre/pro as a multichannel PCM.

So doesn't that as long as your source (in my case a panasonic DMP-BD55) has the codec support, it won't matter if your pre/pro does?

So wouldn't I just be upgrading (option 2) for HDMI switching? It would seem option 1 would work in this case.
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post #13 of 13
2/11/09 at 9:17am
Thread Starter 

Re: AV Processor Comparison

Also, the upgrade path for the AVM 20 has been discontinued as of Sept 2008. Since the new AVM 50 V will have features like True HD and DTS-MA, HDMI 1.3 connections, there is not enough processing power on the AVM 20 to accommodate.

It looks like option #2 isn't really an option any more.
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