THE FUGITIVE - Season 2 Volume 2 - Page 13

Re: THE FUGITIVE - Season 2 Volume 2

I'm sure that's the case that CBS made a big deal over what would have been a big nothing. But the episodes in this state don't bother me the same way their hatchet job on "The Odd Couple" did, which is why the right level of original cues preserving the integrity of the sound of the show as I understand it as a casual fan has been more than enough with just a few exceptions.

Re: THE FUGITIVE - Season 2 Volume 2

"Masquerade". More abundance of Heyes alas. I think the thing I'm finding most irritating is how it seems like *EVERY* time there is a chase in an episode they insisted on using Heyes as if the guy responsible for deciding what went back in and what didn't had some kind of unnatural love for Heyes and his blasting chase music.

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It's not even the Heyes chase music that bothers me so much -- a lot of chase music is pretty generic anyway -- but the volume of it. Some Heyes non-chase cues are actually pretty good, and they're brought in at the right sound level. But those chases! Memo to whoever is the CBS/P music editor on this: Chase music doesn't have to blow your ears out! Back off the gain a little!

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I'm not going to buy S2V2, and I plan on writing a scathing one-star review on Amazon. I see there are already a bunch of negative reviews on there for it. CBS deserves no accolades for a half-assed job. This "fix" appears lazy and thoughtless. Who was the dope they hired to fix the problem? Heyes? I'm not gonna sit back like a lot of folks and pretend this is OK. CBS has ruined one of the greatest TV shows of all time.

We shouldn't have to be talking about altered music. CBS, I hate you. You're a bunch of jerks.

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It seems some of the issues with the replacement music is it's not mixed at the proper levels.

Has the same problem been noticed on the MY THREE SONS episodes with replacement music?

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Just remember though, that *if* these episodes were done before the V1 replacement set was done, then that would explain the shoddier standards of restoration. Look, I'm not happy with what's happened here, but truthfully to have only 50% restored music back with uncut episodes story wise and superior picture quality is ultimately for me something easier to live with than old recordings that suffer from speed-up, lower quality source elements or edited scenes. 100% music replacement is another matter entirely but imperfect as this is, I've already had to live with other sets that IMO are even more compromised than this one is. Odd Couple S4-5 is *always* going to be the worst thing CBS/Paramount has done because in those releases their cuts tampered with the integrity of the *comedy* of the episodes (and IMO this issue with CBS/Paramount pales before the deceit with Shout!'s decision to release a compromised set of "Rhoda" with 66% syndicated episodes and withhold that information until an outside reviewer picked up on it).

We have to keep a cautious attitude about this and more importantly *wait for S3* before we can make a final verdict on the state of how CBS/Paramount is handling this show the rest of the way. If on S3, the ratio is like on V2, then CBS/Paramount will deserve more catcalls. If it's like V1 replacement though, that's another matter. If in the final analysis this show makes its way to the finish with only these 15 episodes (2 of which have no music changes of note) in semi-compromised quality out of 120, then I will in the end in this day and age of so many great titles not getting out on DVD or getting abandoned altogether would feel that was an accomplishment.

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I'm with you on this one.

Dave

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Make sure you write that last part in your review so everyone takes you seriously.

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Well...I'll even the score and stick with Jack's analysis.

I've seen too many shows not get out of the gate or get abandoned way too early without these types of complications. I'd like to see this one get to the end (especially since it is more critical to the story-line then some shows).

As long as it doesn't do an "Odd Couple" where every season get pregressively worse. While I have not watched S2V1 replacements yet, based on the words of others, if it can at least maintain that approach the rest of the way with mayby a few tweaks (making the Heyes a bit less noticeable), I'll be happy enough.

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CBS was sort of dishonest when they released S2V1 with the music changed and I was kind of pissed but then they released the replacement set and I was so impressed that they had the integrity to do it right even though a lot of music was still missing and whole scenes were edited out but I understand and changed my 4 star Amazon rating to 5 star Then it turns out that the replacement release was just a set up to boost sales of V2 which also is full of the shi**y music so now I am only going to give it 4 stars. So if S3V1 has replacement music I will only give it 4 stars and if S3V2 has the Heyes music I might go down to 3 stars. If S4V1 still has the bad music I will stick with 3 stars but might not be so trusting. The real acid test will be the S4V2 set. If S4V2 has the Heyes, well I think I might get a little mad, I might even give them a 2 star rating to show them who's who. Trick me once , shame on you. Trick me six times, well shame on you again.

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I'll probably still end up ordering it regardless of the changes to music.

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Better get them all watched by 2012.

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The set is ending on a stronger note as "A.P.B." had more the sound of a V1 episode in terms of music restoration. Well over 90% restored with even the minimal replacements less intrusive (the main score comes from the TZ episode "King Nine Will Not Return".

"The Old Man Picked A Lemon" also sounds totally untampered. I heard nothing that sounded like Heyes.

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My buddy loaned me his Twilight Zone definitive Collection and while watching an episode called "Back There" with Russel (The Professor) Johnson, I heard some great TZ clips that have been in The Fugitive series.

This is the first time have noticed music from both series and are some great clips !!

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And I can also happily report that the last episode of S2 "Last Second Of A Big Dream" is also completely unaltered which means the set ended on the best possible note and that 5 of 15 episodes are almost totally unchanged. Of the remaining 10, I would only rate 2-3 at most as seriously damaged by a higher percentage of replacement music with "Moon Child" topping the list there.

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Excellent, Jack. Glad to hear it. Thank you.



"Moon Child" even surpasses "Brass Ring" in terms of "heavy on Heyes"? That's hard to believe. (I haven't watched "Moon Child" yet, though.)

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Does any one know if "Moon Child" had more TZ and Capitol cues then original Fugitive cues? If so this may explain CBS/Paramounts original intent in that the music sheets for season two were not in any order. I am not holding up for them but I can't see them restoring the original music in some episodes and not in others without some type of reasoning. Any thoughts????

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lol. Actually, my brother bought it, so I'm just gonna watch his. Seriously, it is a little disheartening to read that S2V2 seems to be a step backward. What's worse is there are no explanations from CBS, and we're all left wondering why it is OK to have some CBS-owned cues in this spot, but the same cues removed in another spot and replaced with lousy Heyes. It makes no sense. Hate is a strong word, so maybe I should "replace" it with "strongly dislike?" I'm not taking back the "bunch of jerks" part because that pretty much sums up what they are for the ringer they continue to put FUGITIVE fans through.

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I agree with your point but if you start calling CBS names, I think it diminishes your point.

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Yes, and personally, I think nothing should be said or done until (if) Season 3 is released. I maintain that S2V2 are the replacement discs, so no amount of b*tching and moaning is going to do any good. Most likely, Season 3 will be no worse than the semi-restored music in Season 2...and possibly (hopefully) even better.

BTW, I was an avid listener of the CBS Radio Mystery Theater in the mid-1970s. So when that show's famous tympani/cello introduction is frequently heard in The Fugitive, it's quite a distraction for me (ex: Nemesis). More so than the TZ cues.

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Actually that CBS Radio Mystery Theater intro was taken from a TZ score ("Two").

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I've finished all the episodes in S2V2, and for the most part I'm satisfied that it does feel like the show I know. The replaced carousel music in "Brass Ring" didn't bother me very much, though I'll readily agree that a better job could have been done on it. "Moon Child" was over the top, though. My remaining complaints have to do with the chase music, where whoever serves as music editor set the volume way too high. I'm not going to rail at Heyes, though. Toned down, the chase music would probably have worked, and there were some Heyes cues (brought in at the right levels) that worked well. A couple of times I found myself really liking a cue and then realizing it was Heyes!

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I learn something new every day. Thanks for the heads-up Jack.

CBS sure got excellent mileage out of this music!

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This is the funniest, albeit sadly ironic, line in this entire thread. I'm not sure you aren't right, LOL. It would explain a lot, wouldn't it?

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Harry, I believe there is a Capitol cue in the S1V2 episode "Where the Action Is," in the scene at the pool where Kimble and Telly Savalas' daughter are playing around a bit. It's standard music I do not believe is part of the CBS library. Don't take this for Gospel, however, because I'm uncertain.

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I decided to give "Moon Child" a second viewing after checking with the Janssen Archive site which lists no fewer than six TZ scores as appearing in this episode and to also see if I might have exaggerated the level of replacement music that's in the episode. Well, on second viewing I can say that maybe I did paint too negative a picture of this episode by a little owing to the fact that when Heyes does pop in it is so distracting in volume and with the obviousness of too modern synths that it clashes with what we're seeing on screen. The high volume of Heyes is at the 11 minute mark in the first chase sequence and then for three solid miniutes from 20 to 23 minutes in the episode. Then when Joanne is fixing a sandwich we get a quiet Heyes that sounds like a knockoff on the Rugolo theme and the climactic Act IV chase is also all Heyes. This adds up to about 8 minutes or so of replacement music in a 51 minute episode that altogether still has most of its original music intact since I did hear five of the six TZ scores listed at the Janssen archive for this episode still there (the one exception was "King Nine Will Not Return" but maybe that is present and I didn't notice). So if in fairness I were giving a percentage total on this episode of replacement music we'd be talking about 20% tops. And there are many stretches of this episode of dialogue with no underscore so I think overall on the second viewing, I found the episode more watchable than I did the first time.

Now here's one bit of silliness though I did pick up on the second time. The teaser sequence for this episode features a scene at the 20 minute mark when the truck of vigilantes and the sherriff pulls up outside the abandoned factory and in the episode this is where we get Heyes blasting replacement stuff kicking in for the second time for almost three uninterrupted minutes. But the teaser clearly features the ORIGINAL cue that was replaced in the episode! So that means while I do feel compelled to say I may have exaggerated the level of how much replacement music is in the episode, I did notice another thing that shows how the restoration work on this was done in a haphazard fashion and this validates what others who have the original versions at their disposal have commented on regarding how some cues that were replaced in some episodes were left alone in others.

Bottom line, it is a testament to the strength of the show that even with these oddities, the episodes with this 70-80% restoration job still manage to come off as well as they do.

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Most of the time, the teaser would in fact feature the same score you'd hear when the scene comes up in the episode. And I'm reasonably sure there's at least one instance where a teaser already features Heyes music so that's why I think it is reasonable to presume that in this case, we're hearing the original cue.

I will note that I did not recognize this cue as coming from a particular TZ episode.

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The CBS Syndication Bible has just updated its entry for "The Fugitive" to indicate that the S3 HD transfer work has been finished (it says "in progress" but also says that episodes 1-90 have been transferred which means the work is done). So, one would have to presume that at this point whatever they're planning to do with the music for S3 has already been done.