FINALLY.....RHODA!!!!!!!!!!!!! - Page 3

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The more I read about this whole situation, the more I'm beginning to rethink it. I may not be buying Rhoda afterall. The missing scenes with Mary from the pilot episode is a real thorn in my paw. I've never seen those scenes and was really looking forward to this release. I could 'almost' live with the syndicated prints for most of the episodes, but these two missing scenes from the pilot tend to bug me. Especially considering that apprantly there are prints out there with those scenes and in good quality. I getting really, really bummed out over this. One of my all time favorite shows from the 70s is not getting a decent treatment on DVD. ~sigh~ I wonder if maybe Fox might release a better version of the set later? I doubt it, but hope springs eternal. Maybe Shout will correct the problem and issue replacements? Doubtful.

As for further releases, well considering how may folks are not buying this set, we may never get the rest of the series. That's sad. I really love the first three seasons of Rhoda. I don't know what to do at this point. Flip a coin? Heads, yes. Tails, no.

I may get it, and if it is as bad as it sounds I'll return it. I'm only missing two episodes from the series on VHS. I might just try and get those through other means and call it a day. From the sound of it, this DVD set will look just as bad as my VHS tapes from Nik-at-Nite. Major, major bummer.

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Is it a certainty that the complete episodes exist anywhere? Even if they only exist on film, and the film is faded, I personally would rather see completed episodes (with some faded scenes) than episodes that are chopped up.

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I've been reading about the situation on a couple of other boards, and it seems that yes, there are 35mm prints of all episodes in the vaults. The prints (or negatives, I can't remember which was mentioned) are faded. The colors are washed out and in need of major restoration but they do apparantly exist.

There also seems to be a bit of waffling on the part of Shout. First they said they were very pleased with how the set turned out. Now they are saying that they were under a time crunch to get it out and had to go with the best material that they could find. They are also saying they worked with Fox to track down prints of the show and even had to resort ot private collectors for some of the episodes. Something just isn't ringing true here. I beginning to smell a rat in this.

Check out the Shout Factory boards as well as the Sitcoms Online boards and it will make what I'm talking about a bit clearer. Or murkier. Depends on how you look at it.

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I am pleased that an efffort was at least made to locate the original film, and either way, I am pleased that it is released, and hope to see the remainder of the series released.

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Looking in at the Sitcoms message board, this comment that was made from a Shout representative *before* the release paints what can only be called a very misleading picture of what to expect.

"I actually think we did very well with getting the COMPLETE (emphasis mine) episodes of Rhoda. I will forwarn you that there are some OCCASIONAL (emphasis mine) tape problems, simply from the age and storage of the material, but I don't think it'll distract from your entertainment too much."

Reading this from the company itself makes one think that we're going to see truly "complete" episodes on the set and that only some "occasional" imperfections are to be expected, one would have thought, because that was the price to pay for seeing the episodes "complete". I hardly think this falls under the category of a candid revelation to expect 2/3rds of the episodes to be cut and syndicated. We ultimately had to find that out from an outside reviewer.

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I smelled the rat from the beginning. Negatives of major network TV shows from a well-respected independent producer don't just disappear into thin air.

The idea that there was no time (or money, or either) to do a proper restoration/remastering is the most likely one.

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I'll tell you this. I would much rather have unremastered, faded prints that are UNCUT on DVD than what they're giving us. The reason why I have been more tolerant than I should of the substandard looking releases of "Emergency!" that Universal has been putting out is because those episodes at least for all their visual flaws are *uncut*.

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I thought the first 3 seasons of Emergency! looked great! S4 onward the quality of the prints went down. But yeah atleast they are uncut.

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The availability of uncut episodes made it easier to put up with a lot in regards to picture and sound. But crummy picture quality AND cuts? Forget it.

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You're forgetting the sound issues too.

Thanks to those who've brought more information behind this release, to light.

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I too, agree about Emergency! The quality of the prints has gone down, but at least they are complete uncut episodes.

I'm still not sure what to do about Rhoda. I watched the pilot episode (Joe) last night from my tapes from '97. During the closing credits, there is a scene of Mary and Rhoda at the airport that isn't in the syndicated version of the episode. The picture and sound on the episode left a lot to be desired. Unfortunatley, from the looks of things, this is precisely what we're going to be getting on DVD. Perhaps a bit better than something taped off TV 10+ years ago but I'm not expecting much more. My level of disapointment is unmeasurable.

With Rhoda coming out, I was hoping Shout would try Phyliss. Now I'm not so sure I want them to even touch it.

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Well, it's not like Fox could have done any better, either.

Of all the TV libraries, the MTM library is the one that is the most severely mistreated:

The Mary Tyler Moore: It's bad enough that Fox was too lazy to clear the scene where Mary sings "White Christmas", but then they abandon it, and become very vague about the way the rest of the show will be completed.

The Bob Newhart Show: Last two seasons still not around.

WKRP: Don't even get me started on that.

The White Shadow: Uncut for the most part, but one episode from season 1 is missing almost 5 minutes worth of footage. Only the first 2 seasons have been released on DVD, but oddly enough, 14 of the 15 season 3 (last season) episodes can be viewed on Hulu.

Hill Street Blues: Abandoned after two seasons.

Remington Steele: Although completed (and I'd figured they would because of Pierce Brosnan's popularity), this show used a good chunk of licensed music that, again, Fox was too lazy to clear.

Newhart: Presumed abandoned after one season, and someone even made an assumption that this show used plenty of licensed music that yet again, Fox would be too lazy to clear.

St. Elsewhere: Abandoned after one season, although much of, perhaps all the music on that set, was cleared.

And now, of course, Rhoda.

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Unfortunately, their own library TV shows get no respect whatsoever from Fox. They don't appear to have been run through a telecine since the 1980s. From their attitude you'd think "M*A*S*H" was the only show they ever produced before "The Simpsons." It's almost like they're ashamed of their TV catalog.

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The Irwin Allen shows other than LIS were remastered and look great. "Daniel Boone" was a Fox show but thankfully wasn't under their control any longer and the color episodes look spectacular.

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It just breaks my heart that I may have to pass on Rhoda. After viewing the first seven episodes of Room 222 from Shout, I might go ahead and get Rhoda. Things may not be as bad as they have been painted. I know that's a very Pollyanna view of the situation considering how many cut episodes are on the set. It's more a combination of poor picture quality, poor sound quality AND cut episodes that is sticking in my craw. I could live with cut episodes (it's all that I've ever seen of the show anyway) if that is all that there is left but poor picutre and sound as well just really bugs me. I don't know if I should take a chance on this or not. I'll think about it more as the release gets closer.

What would really help is if I could see one episode from the set before I make my deciscion. Maybe Shout will release clips closer to the release date.

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Hmmmm I hate to tell you guys I told you so, but shout is turning into a very half arse fly by night company. The last set I bought from them was Adam 12 and shouts video captures were a step down from the S1 universal release (shouts a C- , universals b-) sound was also better on the universal set ,were universal boinked it was with the use of flipper disks that have very high defect rates. And I'm still p.o.'d over there cancellation of Ironside in the US but they clearly (despite what they say otherwise) were heavily involved in the australian release of Ironside s3. Shouts getting shader and shader by the minute and the half arsed rhoda release is more proof shouts more hype than qaulity.

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Are disc producers aware of the current economic climate their customers are enduring?

The dvd collecting hobby isn't a necessity, it's a luxury, and for me the first thing to be scaled back during tough times.
With that in mind, why a producer would feel confident enough to release an over half edited, sub par release, leaves me feeling there's either ignorant or arrogant decisions made at the top.

I guess the sales figures will show just how much mileage fans have for such a release.

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EDIT

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Well sadly they will be decent due to alot of blind buys for this series, honestly I very very very rarely blind buy any dvd set these days I wait for professional reviews to make sure the dvd set meets basic quality standards (burned on the Crime Story s1 and s2 releases so it not a new thing for me to wait and see). I dont mind workman plain wrap releases (ie Jag s8) as long ans the video and audio quality are decent, Shout should have nuke the Rhoda release and publically explained to fans why (extremely poor qaulity and incomplete masters) than to stealth release a wonder turd release, did they think no one would notice? Yes in bad ecomonic time you dont want to screw your fan base, but shout doesnt seem to care.

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I'm not trying to be argumentative when I say I think you have it exactly backwards.

Restoring masters, tracking down full episodes that are often extremely elusive (through no fault of a DVD producer)… these things cost money. A lot of money. Spending that kind of time and money on a DVD set that seems a long shot to be much of a seller (given the poor sales of "Mary Tyler Moore") would seem to be a very foolish business decision indeed, especially in the current economic crisis.

There is a fantasy that we TV-on-DVD obsessives (and I'm one of them) often have, and that's that a significant number of buyers or potential buyers are aware of cut episodes, or music replacement, or what have you. Realize, though, what a small group we really are. Catering to us (much as I appreciate it) will not help sales appreciably. The fact is, the vast majority of sales are made to people who see the box and say to themselves "Hey, I liked that show." To assume that these studios are imperiling themselves by not groveling to a fringe group like us is actually more ignorant, and arrogant, than I think the studios are (generally) being.

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I've always loved Valerie Harper and "Rhoda," a show that's been out of reruns for a decade now, so I'll still be somewhat happy to buy this. I'll just expect the absolute worst, in order to stave off any further disappointment. Music cuts, syndi cuts, awful sound and picture -- bring it on. At least I can hear the theme song again, and the box will look nice on my shelf.

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You said it!!

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Well, Shout has released some clips from the set. Here's the link:

Rhoda DVD news: Video Clips for Rhoda - Season 1 | TVShowsOnDVD.com

Not a real good way to judge the set becasue they used clips from the Wedding episode, which as we've all read is one of the few uncut episodes in good condition. Glad they provided clips, but I'd rather have seen clips from a couple more of the episodes to get a better overall picture of how the set is going to look. Oh well. At least they did provide clips.

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Is that a fact? Why is it a crime to desire quality in our dvd purchases? And let me add that I can't understand any dvd company--Shout! included--that would actually want to put out a sub-par product. Anybody in business understands that the more often you do a crummy job--the closer you come to unemployment. I don't expect them to grovel to me by putting out quality merchandise--they should answer to themselves first and foremost. They should have the satisfaction of a job well done. I don't understand any other reason to get up in the morning. Why would anybody want to be in the dvd production business full knowing they're not doing a good job?

Also, although internet posters may be a minority, our opinions usually are representative of the general populace. You don't expect everyone with an opinion to suddenly rush to hometheaterforum.com and post their views on every dvd they buy now do you? No. We may be a "fringe" group, but we say what the majority are thinking anyway.

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You'll also notice, if you read the press release, David Lambert mentions Shout brainstorming ways to make improvements to future sets, even though there haven't been any promises yet.

Shout has improved on shows in the past. Fans complained about Father Knows Best season one being plagued with syndicated episodes, and in response to that, season two was released in an unedited fashion, and so will the upcoming season three release.

Who knows. If S2-S5 are unedited, it may convince them to redo season 1. First Look did that with The Cosby Show.

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Please read what I wrote more carefully. Of course they don't want to put out a sub-par product. They simply must weigh -- as all companies must -- costs vs. potential sales. Spending hundreds of thousands of dollars on a niche product that won't likely sell very well under ideal circumstances just isn't possible. Spending enormous resources on a product that will not make it back is the single best way to come to unemployment. I don't know how anybody can possibly argue with that.

Go to a forum about something you don't care at all about and see what those people are claiming "we" want. They are all, like this forum, echo chambers that suggest a groundswell of like-thinking people, when that rarely exists. Go to the Game Show Network boards, where fanatics insist "we" demand they cancel some new poker show because it's keeping "$25,000 Pyramid" reruns off the air. Or the movie soundtrack forums, where the posters (okay, I'm one of them) are delusional enough to believe the public at large are clamoring for a release of the complete score to the movie "Link." My favorite was several years ago, when fans of the original "Battlestar Galactica" had actually convinced themselves that there would be a march on the Sci-Fi Channel in NY, 100,000 people strong (!), protesting the new version of the series. If anybody actually showed up, they were never heard.

Truly, as a TV on DVD fanatic myself, I wish this were not the case. And truly, I mean this all with respect. But let's have a little perspective here.

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David Lambert is the biggest Shout cheerleader/apologist on the Internet so take anything he says with a grain of salt. You'll remember he also tried unsuccessfully to convince his readers that the WKRP mess was no big deal. Sorry Dave, you can shill for Shout all day long but their actual work is consistently second rate and their lackluster reputation is well deserved.

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I agree this show will be a blind buy for me but still plan to buy it in the future.

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Don't you dare talk **** about him like that. I hope you get banned for that.

I refuse to take anything he says with a grain of salt. A lot of people on these boards have nothing but good things to say about him, but it's really sad and pathetic that you, on the other hand, don't.

Like I said before, I hope you get banned for talking **** about him.

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Well, we'll ALL have to cross our bits this first season sells well enough to the fans (who the hell else will be buying) for SF to continue it, otherwise we shall be left with another dropped series.

I however won't be buying into it until they improve in quality. This isn't due to other more pressing releases, personally I don't buy into (knowingly) censored shows/films, period.