*** Official GRAN TORINO Discussion Thread

*** Official GRAN TORINO Discussion Thread

Now we know who did the ADR for Christian Bale in BB and TDK.

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The brilliant thing about that trailer is how it leaves out so much of the movie -- most of it, really. There's still a whole story to discover when you get to the theater.

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That's great to hear as I have high expectations for this film.





Crawdaddy

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I see that even a lot of the favorable reviews (and most are favorable) are calling it a "minor" Eastwood film. The more I think about it, the less I think that's accurate. Without knowing what else Eastwood may yet achieve, I still think Gran Torino ranks with Unforgiven and Letters from Iwo Jima as an unsparing and unsentimental meditation on the uses and costs of violence.

And on top of all that, the damn thing is funny.

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Michael-

I agree with you and I don't think I'd describe it as a minor Eastwood film. It's damn funny, but it's so damn well written that you just feel absolutely sucked into it. This is easily one of my top films of the year.

I will tell you, the very end of this film is DAMNED rewarding.

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I want to see this movie now!!!!! I cannot wait much longer...

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I'll be in Detroit area today and will be watching this film along with "Doubt", this Christmas Day. My Christmas Day tradition of going to the movies goes back to watching "The Towering Inferno" in the 1974 time frame.






Crawdaddy

Re: *** Official GRAN TORINO Discussion Thread

Both excellent choices, Crawdaddy. I'm still not sure how I feel about Doubt, but that's because I love the play, and the movie is very different, even though it was John Patrick Shanley who adapted his own play and directed the film.

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I swear I'm the only person who doesn't like this film at all. It felt like a *more* heavy-handed "Crash" (which is hard to do), with kids that give even more stilted performances than Brendan Frasier or Sandra Bullock. For his part, Clint gamely spouts every racial epithet in the book (except the n-word, for no apparent reason) which doesn't really have any kind of impact after the eighteenth time. I enjoyed seeing Clint growl at his midriff-exposing granddaughters and such, but to me this is worse than "Space Cowboys".

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Michael,
I was laughing throughout the film and though it's a rather poignant story, I couldn't help myself. Eastwood's character reminded me so much of actual people I knew early in my career about 30 odd years ago. Sure, they had racist views and shared them quite often with me, but they took care of me while I learned the manufacturing floor as a young supervisor. They gave me a lot of shit, but would never put me in a position in which my boss could criticize me about my work performance and they taught me well. Many of them were war veterans like Kowalski with their war experiences being WWII, Korea and even Vietnam for a few of the younger ones. In their lives, they've seen and experienced some horrible things that branded them forever.

Anyhow, excellent movie and one that I'm going to see again.






Crawdaddy

Re: *** Official GRAN TORINO Discussion Thread

For some reasons, I think this film has reasonated more with the general public than with the critics or Hollywood folks. I think it will be underappreciated by the latter while the former will think more highly of it and the work Eastwood accomplished with this film and its actors. I hope I'm wrong, but I don't think Hollywood is going to give Eastwood another acting nomination for this film.





Crawdaddy

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It's mainly because there are about 7-8 solid "Best Actor" worthy performances this year, and Eastwood may come in 6th or 7th in the nomination balloting.

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Considering they gave a film like CRASH the Best Picture award, I doubt these same people are going to pay tribute to a film or character like this.

I posted my review in the TRACK thread but I took my girlfriend to see this last night and I'm still shocked at how much she loved the movie. Afterwards she even asked if we could go see it again AND she ordered the soundtrack when she got home. She isn't the type to watch that many movies and she only went to watch this because I wanted to go. She always bragged that she didn't cry at movies but she certainly did here. I was really shocked at how it went over with her as well as the crowd of people I watched it with.

As for the film's success, there are several thoughts that come to mind. I don't think people watching the film share ALL of Eastwood's characters thoughts but I do think a lot of people are sick of gangs and their ilk taking over neighborhoods. I think these same people like seeing someone like Eastwood clean up the streets so to speak. In interviews Eastwood has called American's soft so you have to wonder if he feels the world needs old timers like Walt. He has called American's too politically correct, which this film certainly isn't. Once again, I don't see anyone watching this movie walking out and putting Walt down for his racial views. If you go to other boards there's more of an outcry on people supporting this film and character. I think these people are going to share the same opinions as many Oscar voters, which is a shame. I hope the film and Eastwood get credit but I don't see it happening.

I also wonder how many people are walking into this film expecting to see a Dirty Harry movie. While waiting for the movie to start yesterday I heard at least three people mention something along the lines that they never thought Eastwood would do another Dirty Harry movie. Even a news broadcast here linked the film up to another Dirty Harry movie. I know early rumors got out that this would be the sixth film so perhaps that has something to do with the film's draw.

Either way, I'm happy that something "smart" and for adults won the box office over the "dumbing down of America" as Eastwood would say.

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When I first saw the trailer, I thought it was one of the cleverest pieces of marketing I'd seen in years, because (a) it looked like a Dirty Harry-type film, but (b) I knew it couldn't possibly be one. Ever since Unforgiven, it's been clear from both the work and his comments in interviews that Eastwood's views on violence have become more thoughtful and nuanced, and you see that throughout Gran Torino.

In real life, anyone who can do what Harry Callahan does and walk away with no aftereffects would have to be a sociopath. Walt Kowalski is a real person, and he's paid a life-long price for the violence he committed as a young man. We see it in the wreckage of his family life.

The only thing that's ever bothered me about Unforgiven is that, after two hours of showing you the awfulness and tawdriness of violence, it concludes with the visceral satisfaction of Eastwood's William Munny inflicting extreme violence on a group of scumbugs who deserve it (all the while proclaiming, "Deserve's got nothing to do with it!"). Gran Torino appears to be leading you down the path to that same satisfaction, but then it pulls the rug out from under you.

Where in the film did your girlfriend start crying? I know I found the concluding church service very moving, but also utterly unsentimental. A rare achivement. (Kudos to Christopher Carley, who plays Father Janovich, for how he handled that scene.)

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It also probably isn't Eastwood's favor that he's been nominated or won multiple times in the last decade.

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For Best Actor? He's an Academy favorite (and has directed multiple Oscar winning acting performances), but we'll see how the balloting goes.

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I hope you're right... I loved the movie but as far as acting goes, it's Clint Eastwood being Clint Eastwood. We've seen this character many times (the cranky ole timer with a heavy past), and that's actually the greatest thing about the movie: It continues the deconstruction of Clint Eastwood ['s characters] which began since Unforgiven.

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H

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I haven't seen it yet, but I don't get how anyone could think that this was a new "Dirty Harry" film. To me, the trailer just shows that the main character is some old, racist curmudgeon who doesn't want anything to do with neighbors, especially Asian ones.

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My wife and I saw this yesterday. It's a bit simplistic at times, and some points are made in a little heavy-handed fashion, but it was one of those films that I think will grow on me. It made me think about issues like forgiveness, redemption, and salvation. It's also a very interesting cultural commentary on immigration, religion, and changing neighborhoods, and what are shared values, regardless of race, religion, or culture.

Definitely an ending I didn't expect in some ways, but is perfect in most other ways.

Clint has been making films with one of the main messages being about how awful killing human beings is since he stopped being Dirty Harry, it seems to me - and filmgoers have been the better for it, IMO.

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No but I'd imagine (but could be wrong) that there might be a "Let's give someone else a chance" mentality that could bump him out.

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Eastwood has never won an Oscar for acting. I don't know if he'll be nominated for this film or not, but there may be some votes thrown his way as a "catch-up". His 4 Oscars are 2 each for best director and best picture.

Other than "Peoples Choice" type awards, I'm not sure if he's ever won any kind of "best actor" award.

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Usually that works in reverse: He's old as dirt, better get him an Oscar now before he dies, the other actors are young and have more opportunities in the future.

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Gran Torino has been completely shut out from the GG (got a song nom I think, that's it.) The Oscar crowd is very different of course, but it's still something to note for a well received, obvious Oscar contender.

Well, I wrote the above before I checked RT, and was surprised to find it rated at a relatively low 75%. That certainly explains the GG shut out -- not everyone is impressed.

In a strange way, I am OK with that. I loved the film, but it doesn't bring anything terribly new to the table.

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H

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And every year I wonder why people take the GG's seriously (as I certainly don't). Who the hell makes up the Foreign Hollywood Press anyway?

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When he actually got killed. You'd have to know my girlfriend but she's a tough as nails type and it really, really shocked me to see her get that wrapped up in a movie. It shocked me more than if PROM NIGHT took home Best Picture honors. She refuses to watch IT'S A WONDERFUL LIFE with me because she finds it stupid yet this one touched her for some reason.

I think the ending shocked a lot of people in the crowd. This is just my opinion but I think a lot of the shock is by this movie hitting the "mainstream" and in most mainstream movies the hero walks away at the end. I think the ending here shocked people because it was going to require them to think on the way out of the theater.

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Clint Eastwood has become one of the finest directors today but Gran Torino just seemed like a departure from what he is capable of.
Clint Eastwood was the only decent actor in this movie and the rest were just awful. But even Clint seemed very over the top in this for me as well.
I thought the story was good but the writing wasn't great, it just didn't blend well together from scene to scene, and some of the dialog seemed very unnatural.

I loved the ending though, thank you Clint for not going the traditional route. I hate it when Hollywood can't pull the trigger and deliver an ending that makes people feel uneasy or out of the ordinary. (Soprano's)
I think everyone thought he was going to do it and spend his remaining days locked up. But he didn't, he went the smarter way out and the movie was better for it because it redeems him as a good man which is contrary to what he thinks of himself through out.

I see a lot of people talking about Oscar which surprises me. I would love to see Clint get a Best Actor Oscar because he is an unbelievable actor most of the time, but this won't get it for him.
I'm just going to save everyone the heart break for nomination day next week and say that Gran Torino won't get even a single nod. And it wont be a snub either, it's because Gran Torino will not stack up to Oscar quality. Clint would be the only person to get a look and he just didn't deliver what it takes this time around.

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I think this film has a very high "Shawshank" type potential.. maybe it gets few awards, or doesn't make big waves.. but as years pass, I see a lot of repeat viewings/airings for it.