THX and the value of quality control - Page 2

Re: THX and the value of quality control

Those two rule each other out sometimes. What are you going to do when the director wants the feature in an aspect ratio that's different from the theatrical aspect ratio? Like RoboCop, Paul Verhoeven's preferred aspect ratio is 1.66:1, and in theaters it was shown in 1.85:1. Or the whole situation with The Last Emperor, when DP Vittorio Storaro wants it to be in 2:1, while it was shot in 2.35:1?
That's the problem with films, no two features are alike, and can't be compared with each other.

Re: THX and the value of quality control

Vittorio Storaro also insisted on changed aspect for Apocalypse Now on DVD, right?
Also, wasn't Sleeping Beauty was released in a wider aspect ratio than
theatrically which I think was positively received?
Anyway, as long as there is a justification for changing it, it will be
better than having it cropped or opened up seemingly randomly.

Edit: what I mean is that if there is a stated reason why the aspect ratio is different and has changed
from theatrical release, it would mean that someone is aware of the change and hopefully had reasons for doing so.
Personally, I hate when a newer release crops the picture and hides things that were visible in earlier
releases and/or theatrically.

Re: THX and the value of quality control

I agree with you. There always should be a (good, or valid) reason behind it. And of course it's always the best when the director or dp was involved or gave his blessing. That's actually why I like Criterion, they try to make that extra effort to do that.

Re: THX and the value of quality control

He's wrong. Just like George Lucas was when he made changes to Star Wars.

Re: THX and the value of quality control

Van - very good thread and a very relevent one as well. I still vividly recall the THX room at the General Cinema on Maple Road in Amherst, NY. It used Hafler DH500 amps and was fully certified. Have not seen or heard its equal since. Eventually the cheapos at the theatre did not update to keep its certification and later the building was demolished. I just wonder why companies like Technics that had a THX certified processor in the early 90's get certified and yet quality amp manufacturers like Bryston, speaker manufacturers like B&W and other high end audio companies lack the moniker even though they produce higher quality equipment? Makes the THX moniker on equipment seem cheap. As for THX certified software, very good and from what I have seen consistent as well.

Re: THX and the value of quality control

Who says that ??

while there is some very good pricey equipment, there also is some very crappy pricey gear. If a piece of gear has a THX logo on it, you can at least be assured that it meets a certain level of performance and and other criterias relating to that certification.

There has never been any piece of gear submitted to THX that has been labelled certified without modification. (with the exception of some cabling products).

Re: THX and the value of quality control

when THX was established circa star wars (a new hope), lucas wanted his films to be presented with pristine audiovisual quality. i'm not THAT old, but i have seen films in cinemas that have NOT been renovated since pre70s and i could see why lucas wanted this 'standard' to happen via the TAP (Theater Alignment Program). without THX, we might still have a plethora MONO speaker CINEMAS!!!

so it made sense to have a THX back then to raise the bar. my fav. part of enjoying a film in the early 90s is to pick a film showing in the THX auditorium and i luved luved luved enjoying the THX trailers that were shown back then!!! some of the fav is the THX-EX tex demonestrating the 6.1 capability of the cinema.

all of that changed with the advent of multiplexes and competitive nature of business. cinepliexes begin to offer stadium seating, digital projection, dts alternatives to dolby digital, sdds, and so on. by the time episode i came out, most major cinema chains have become so good at competing with one another, THX is no longer needed. that is not to say, normal theater maintains great quality all the time. in fact, after year 2000, u can see the theaters that used to have THX no longer participate in TAP and then things start to fall back to the way they were. broken subs, awful screen sprocket alignments and MONO makes their way back in a huge wave .

in terms of theatrical presentation, THX needs to evolve their business unit into more of a 'police model' with full participation from MPAA or artists&studio organizations. give out a free 800 number in the beginning or at the end of the films or somewhere in the theaters whereby people can submit complaints. audiences like HTF will be sure to actively participate in this to make sure theatrical presentations are kept in line. FIX that sub, FIX that screen tear, FIX the surround sound! etc.

as for the home video, much like the history of TAP, the home divison used to mean something. equipment makers used to be shoddy and slim on the power specs and so on, but THX brought all of them up to a standard and in the last 8 years have far exceeded the standards by leaps and bounds that THX has had to come up with 'ultra and select' models and so on.

imho, the real compromise began when creative bought 60% stake into the THX business and now we have "THX-certified" 2.1 multimedia computer speakers. imho, that's ridiculous. if PC's want high quality audio, buy a AVR and hookup a pair of real speakers to it.

again, as with the TAP, THX home divisions need to evolve and adapt into different markets. i dunno what, but it needs to become more than it is.

as for certifying titles, was THX trying to be criterion? i dunno, i've always felt criterion showed the respect needed for films to present in such a manner and fashion that the original enjoyment is preserved. yesh i know critieron and THX have worked together to bring catalogue titles to great heights... but even criterion have scaled back on THX releases because their own internal QA have gone way up.

in today's age, THX is irrelevant except in spirit. on the software side, i'd like to see some sort of a 'quality police' so i can spam them about all my BD's with DNR problems (like patton), lol.

Re: THX and the value of quality control

I think THX did a great job at first and for many years afterword and did a great job. And I would agree that if you see THX on a peice of hardware it usually is a good sign. I would not go as far to say everything with a THX logo is gold.

I remember when Kenwood came out with there THX certified pre/pro and power amplifier, it was not all that great. And when Kenwood had there trailer touring the country a rep admited to me that Kenwoods amplifiers where not being used in the demo.

Now when a product is so bad that it can not even get THX certified I would say that also speaks volumes as well. Now if I see a THX badge on something now, it does not automatically get placed above something that doesn't. I like the fact that some products from companies like Onkyo, Marantz and Pioneer are THX certified. How ever would I not rule out a product like Denon just because there is no THX logo. I do not think McIntosh is gracing there equipment with THX logos anymore and that is some of the best gear I have ever heard. But when Bose can not get THX certified it has to make you wonder why? There are companies that just do not want to pay the cost of the THX logo being on there product, how ever I do not think this is the reason why THX is not on Bose products. Now I might be wrong on this but even though Onkyo has models that are THX Select2 Plus and THX Ultra2 Plus certified but do not necisarily deseve it. All you have to do is look at the Onkyo TX-SR805 that was discontinued and replace with the 806, the 806 is no where near the 805 but it is ultra THX certified.

I honestly feel that THX needs to step back and see what it needs to do to make themselves viable again. They need to regain what there where at the begining when there where a big brand name. We have consumers that are willing to place convience over quality, just look at internet downloads and mp3 players. Many people are happy with dvd and don't care about SACD or high resolution audio. THX needs to remind people and convince them all over again that THX makes a real difference when they watch a movie!

Re: THX and the value of quality control

Don't you mean "The Abyss" box set...?

I was a huge fan of THX theatrical certification, and then laserdisc certification. But by the time THX certified VHS players and tapes started showing up, I started getting disenchanted.

Re: THX and the value of quality control

For software I believe the THX logo has outplayed it's relevance. I am not aware of what THX certification for software requires at the moment, but I believe they should aim for regaining the trust of the very demanding people who seek out forums such as HTF.

The criteria by which recent blu-rays are being scrutinized by us are, in no particular order, DNR, lack of EE, OAR, Codec (audio/video), Compression, fidelity to the source material (e.g. original mono soundtrack availability). I just don't believe the THX program is as thourough as we'd like it to be.

At this point the Robert A. Harris seal of approval carries much more weight with videophiles than THX does (Business opportunity for Mr. Harris, there). Maybe even a Xylon-certified transfer for those of us who frequent "that other forum". According to postings on these forums, their opininons influence buying decisions.

For videophile formats such as laserdisc was, the THX logo certainly influenced purchase decisions and made economic sense for the studios. For the mass-market DVD I don't believe it has, or ever had, impact on sales. Maybe the Blu-Ray market is the opportunity for THX to reclaim their status, but they'd have to apply it to all the factors mentioned above.

Maybe it is unreasonable to expect THX to be the fanboy watchdog of video, and the fact remains that there is no way THX can appease the hardcore, uncompromising (unreasonable?) perfectionists that represent a certain portion of the posters here. - But they should perhaps try? -

Re: THX and the value of quality control

I agree with Fritz, about the Robert A. Harris on film preservation. THX, is mind control thingy it’s good that it insures quality at the cinema.

We might as all well have two DVD players one loaded up with a six-track Amazing Life “deep tone” to play and wow friends alike!

Then wait for it to fade to black and then switch over to DVD 2 player for main feature.

When you think about some of the small titles that have had the THX intro on it and so on etc, etc and why doesn’t Lawrence of Arabia have THX stamped on it!

I believe Lawrence of Arabia 70mm Dolby SR was played at the Warner West End London many moons back in THX sound system before the cinema was remodelled into 9 screen multiplex.

I was fortunate enough to see it at the Odeon Marble Arch, London, on what was the largest screen in the UK around 1988.

Make the film transfer as close to the 35mm/70mm what ever to DVD or other and get rid of that god awful edge enhancement for once! That is one thing you’d never see on film.

Well I did see a digital version of The Spy Who Loved Me at the Empire Leicester Square last year and I could have stood up and raised my voice!

35mm70mm Rules! Okay some digital films are getting better but TSWLM please I can only dread what the son of the third edition looks like which is why I’ve laid off paying anymore of the same title that I already have.

Plus the sound mix went cockeyed half way though, not the fault of Empire it was lousy digital print!

Re: THX and the value of quality control

THX meant alot more to me in the Laserdisc days