Star Trek films on Blu-Ray... what we know so far - Page 45

I still have my tape of the 25th Anniversary special, as aired on the appropriate channel in the Bay Area in fall 1991, and I think you're right - it was in concert with the 5th Season premiere.

By that time, I'm amazed that they wanted to bring Roddenberry out to a convention, when he was so far advanced in his health issues.  (He had suffered multiple strokes, and was no longer able to function without constant care.  As Susan Sackett relates, by 1990, he was already at the point where he was no longer paying much attention to TNG.  His last real work with Star Trek was his open disapproval of Trek VI - and as with his comments on the other movies after TMP, he was pretty much ignored.  Really a sad ending.)

As for the Robert Wise cut of TMP, knowing Paramount, I'd say that all the negatives for his work on the movie have been carefully preserved by Paramount.  There's too much at stake with the franchise for the studio to abandon anything.  And I don't think it would be as major of a situation to remaster the Wise cut.  Nelson, I stand corrected about whether there's a 35mm answer print - but I still don't think it would be as significant of a project to do this work.  It would certainly cost money - but I don't think anywhere near as much as it cost to do the Wise cut in the first place.  We're not talking about redoing the work - just adjusting the resolution of the existing CGI files and doing a new transfer.  This is more than people were willing to do in 2009, when there were some serious cost-cutting issues going on.  But in 2012, as part of the promotion for the next film, I could see them approving this for a new Blu-ray, since they'd have a guaranteed sales level in any case.

Now, dealing with any of the other series on Blu-ray would be a very different issue.  I don't see how that would make any financial sense - other than with Enterprise.  There's just too many hours of episodes that would all need to be converted and upgraded.  The HD work on TOS was already a fairly expensive effort (and even that one missed many opportunities due to the limits they had in time and budget).  To upgrade just TNG to high definition, including re-doing all of the VFX for over 170 episodes would take so much time and money that I can't imagine it being cost-effective.  Trek fans are happy to get new passes at the original series episodes, but even they have balked at repeatedly picking the same shows up over and over again.  I just had the discussion two days ago with a friend about whether it was worth the money to pick up the Blu-ray of Season Three, when he already had it in the SD set.   For me, I'm happy to have the new transfers, but I don't think there's as large a group willing to repurchase the whole series of TNG just to get new VFX and new transfers.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scott D S 

Enjoy!

 

http://www.adg.org/?content=OFF&&art=adg_tv_player&Vyear=2009&Vcategory=Film+Society+Screenings&Vsection=ADG+TV&show_page=1&Vid=1193803786&Vcategory=Film%20Society%20Screenings

Great stuff! Thank you!!!!!
 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kevin EK 

I still have my tape of the 25th Anniversary special, as aired on the appropriate channel in the Bay Area in fall 1991, and I think you're right - it was in concert with the 5th Season premiere.

 

By that time, I'm amazed that they wanted to bring Roddenberry out to a convention, when he was so far advanced in his health issues.  (He had suffered multiple strokes, and was no longer able to function without constant care.  As Susan Sackett relates, by 1990, he was already at the point where he was no longer paying much attention to TNG.  His last real work with Star Trek was his open disapproval of Trek VI - and as with his comments on the other movies after TMP, he was pretty much ignored.  Really a sad ending.)

 

As for the Robert Wise cut of TMP, knowing Paramount, I'd say that all the negatives for his work on the movie have been carefully preserved by Paramount.  There's too much at stake with the franchise for the studio to abandon anything.  And I don't think it would be as major of a situation to remaster the Wise cut.  Nelson, I stand corrected about whether there's a 35mm answer print - but I still don't think it would be as significant of a project to do this work.  It would certainly cost money - but I don't think anywhere near as much as it cost to do the Wise cut in the first place.  We're not talking about redoing the work - just adjusting the resolution of the existing CGI files and doing a new transfer.  This is more than people were willing to do in 2009, when there were some serious cost-cutting issues going on.  But in 2012, as part of the promotion for the next film, I could see them approving this for a new Blu-ray, since they'd have a guaranteed sales level in any case.

 

Now, dealing with any of the other series on Blu-ray would be a very different issue.  I don't see how that would make any financial sense - other than with Enterprise.  There's just too many hours of episodes that would all need to be converted and upgraded.  The HD work on TOS was already a fairly expensive effort (and even that one missed many opportunities due to the limits they had in time and budget).  To upgrade just TNG to high definition, including re-doing all of the VFX for over 170 episodes would take so much time and money that I can't imagine it being cost-effective.  Trek fans are happy to get new passes at the original series episodes, but even they have balked at repeatedly picking the same shows up over and over again.  I just had the discussion two days ago with a friend about whether it was worth the money to pick up the Blu-ray of Season Three, when he already had it in the SD set.   For me, I'm happy to have the new transfers, but I don't think there's as large a group willing to repurchase the whole series of TNG just to get new VFX and new transfers.

I think eventually we will see some blu ray's of the other Trek series. It may not be whole seasons, but maybe just some key episodes from each of the series? 

I'm sure even the DVD encoding has improved since when TNG, Voyager and DS9 were put on DVD too. 

It'll be interesting to see what happens with Trek releases next year. 

Enterprise and The Animated Series would be easy blu ray releases for Paramount. But not sure if sales would be there. 

I started recently watching Enterprise again last fall. Season 1 and some of season 2. It's a much better show than I gave it credit at the time. By season 4 I couldn't wait for it to end. 

As far as the Trek films, I'm sure Paramount will eventually do the Director's Cut of TMP on blu ray. As well as the director's cut of Khan and maybe Undiscovered Country? I agree that nothing will be done further with 5. 

Hopefully the next set of original Trek films on blu ray will have new transfers too. I've been pleased with the set of the TOS films, but know they weren't the best that could've been done. I know Khan was the only one that had a full restoration done. 

I've held off picking up the TNG blu ray set. I keep thinking a reissue could just be a few months away in 2012??
 

Pretty good stuff here on TMP DC on Daren's website...

http://www.betafive.com/PORTFOLIOSITE/TrekTMP.html

Even Wrath of Khan on Blu had a picture issue that I still don't understand.  The whole image has been blue-shifted in a very strange way.  I've done compare & contrast between the Director's Edition DVD and the Blu-ray, and white ships look blue-ish.  It's very odd.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nelson Au 

Okay, the scene in Star Trek The Motion Picture blu ray where Nimoy's make-up looks especially bad is at the 1 hour, 45 minute 30 sec point where Spock says: V'Ger is a child.

His cheeks and ears don't match! And you can see his skin tone through the make-up and in his real ear.

Shatner and De Kelley also look pasty in the sequence in his quarters when Decker and Illia are in the rec deck. Not sure if that's DNR.

Just watched the scene. Yeah, not very good match with the make up!! I have never noticed this before. I have a 50" screen so I had to get close to see it. I wonder if it was a lighting issue as well? Seems like they cover things in other shots well, but this one not so much. The lighting of the bridge on TMP is pretty odd isn't it? 

I'm guessing it was a combo of the scene not being lit right or in a way that would cover the make up effectively. Just my 2 cent guess! 

With all of the talk of the Director's Cut, I may have to switch over and watch that one on DVD. 

I do wonder what TMP, III - VI will look like with better mastering for blu ray. Perhaps they will show even more make up issues, etc?? 

The detail of the Trek films on blu ray is pretty amazing though compared to DVD. As is the difference in richer color. 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kevin EK 

Even Wrath of Khan on Blu had a picture issue that I still don't understand.  The whole image has been blue-shifted in a very strange way.  I've done compare & contrast between the Director's Edition DVD and the Blu-ray, and white ships look blue-ish.  It's very odd.

Interesting. Maybe something was missed in the color timing? Wasn't Nick Meyer involved with the Trek 2 restoration process for blu ray? 

This was a topic of debate earlier. On my TV, I think the color change is welcome as I always thought it looked too red before. Actually, I think I can make this same statement with how it looked on my previous CRT as well.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kevin EK 

Even Wrath of Khan on Blu had a picture issue that I still don't understand.  The whole image has been blue-shifted in a very strange way.  I've done compare & contrast between the Director's Edition DVD and the Blu-ray, and white ships look blue-ish.  It's very odd.

Kevin, not so sure I'm all that correct about whether a 35mm film version of the DE of TMP was ever done or not. I was just conjecturing based on information I read at the time. 

Tim, that is odd Nimoy's make-up is so bad there. In the entire run of TOS, he always looked right. The blu-rays didn't reveal any problems, other then the ear joint.

I'm looking forward to 2012, and not for the next Trek film, but the TMP blu ray! I guess I can check that new film out, still not too crazy about what they did with the last film.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nelson Au 

Kevin, not so sure I'm all that correct about whether a 35mm film version of the DE of TMP was ever done or not. I was just conjecturing based on information I read at the time. 

 

Tim, that is odd Nimoy's make-up is so bad there. In the entire run of TOS, he always looked right. The blu-rays didn't reveal any problems, other then the ear joint.

 

I'm looking forward to 2012, and not for the next Trek film, but the TMP blu ray! I guess I can check that new film out, still not too crazy about what they did with the last film.

All though the original film elements were rescanned for the project, all post, i.e. editing, color corrections, new visual effects, titles etc, were done on video at 480p resolution.  My understanding is that there is no 35mm version of the director's cut.

Doug
 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kevin EK 

Even Wrath of Khan on Blu had a picture issue that I still don't understand.  The whole image has been blue-shifted in a very strange way.  I've done compare & contrast between the Director's Edition DVD and the Blu-ray, and white ships look blue-ish.  It's very odd.

As a general rule of thumb, I don't know that it's really fair to use an older DVD as the reference point for whether a restoration or new transfer is accurate.  It could very well be that all of the previous home video releases featured too much red, and that we're just used to it being that way, as opposed to there being anything wrong with the Blu-ray.  (Or maybe you're right, and the techs who mastered it just took the term "Blu-ray" way too literally...)  Every now and then it seems like a 35mm print of Wrath Of Khan makes its way around at midnight screenings and whatnot; I'd definitely be curious to see it on the big screen again and compare that to both the DVD and Blu-ray.

For the first 6 original series films, I think the blue rays do look much better than my DVD's. I figure they were scanned from the original master. The improvement in picture can't be attributed to resolution alone, and they do say they are remastered. no matter what, they were gonna look better on blue. If star Trek 2 was restored, I have little faith in future restorations from this series. I wonder if some shots of TMP are even up to a 4k scan at all. If they have OCN out there, they need to use them

As far a TMP 480 p going to film, they had to add film grain anyway. Why not make it real film grain. Though it probably did not happen
 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Josh Steinberg 

As a general rule of thumb, I don't know that it's really fair to use an older DVD as the reference point for whether a restoration or new transfer is accurate.  It could very well be that all of the previous home video releases featured too much red, and that we're just used to it being that way, as opposed to there being anything wrong with the Blu-ray.  (Or maybe you're right, and the techs who mastered it just took the term "Blu-ray" way too literally...)  Every now and then it seems like a 35mm print of Wrath Of Khan makes its way around at midnight screenings and whatnot; I'd definitely be curious to see it on the big screen again and compare that to both the DVD and Blu-ray.

Quote:

Originally Posted by FanboyZ 

Weren't all the new effects for TMP done in 480P? Wouldn't they have to essentially re-do a redux?
Either way if any Trek film were to have the time taken to fix it again it should be Nemesis, the original ending is a perfect bookend to the TNG cast.

I wasn't happy with the continuity issues that Nemesis introduced into the film series, remember Data had a brother in the tv show but they totally ignored this fact when finding the double in the film, i think i remember reading somewhere why they did that but to me it disrespected the fans and the people who had seen all the television shows.

I just cannot see why it would cost too much to redo the first movies new effects in 1080p, even if it costs $1m dollars it could easily be justified for future preservation, while they are at it they really need to strike new masters for Star Trek 3,4,5, and 6, static grain patterns because of poor DNR exist on all of them, the smoothie look because of DNR is particularly bad on 6, sure Nimoy is getting old in Undiscovered Country but that smooth look is not bad makeup its DNR and probably because they decided to just do a quick fix digital makeover rather than spend the cash on new transfers, such short sighted thinking, they should be thinking long term and looking after their product and its a shame business people rather than movie people run the movie studio's, the business people have no respect for the films in their library.

Look at the recent Trek film, beautiful transfer and Nimoy is even older but doesn't have the plasticine botox look that they gave him because of the DNR in earlier films.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Josh Steinberg 

Every now and then it seems like a 35mm print of Wrath Of Khan makes its way around at midnight screenings and whatnot; I'd definitely be curious to see it on the big screen again and compare that to both the DVD and Blu-ray.

I saw a 35mm print of TWOK at the Alamo Drafthouse about a week after the JJ Abrams film was released.  The print was a brand new print struck from the restoration that was used for the Blu-Ray & had the blue shift in the color timing.  I think it was something that Nick Meyer had done during the restoration.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vincent-P 

I saw a 35mm print of TWOK at the Alamo Drafthouse about a week after the JJ Abrams film was released.  The print was a brand new print struck from the restoration that was used for the Blu-Ray & had the blue shift in the color timing.  I think it was something that Nick Meyer had done during the restoration.

Awesome! I'd love to see TWOK in the theater again. How was the audio for the theater presentation? 

I was very disappointed with the transfers of each of the original films except II.  I think they just went way overboard on the DNR and even some EE.  There are a couple of instances in III where the DNR for whatever reason is not present; plenty of detail and grain emerges which only made me think about how they could have looked.  However, I'm hopefully these are re-released (improved) next year with the next movie coming out, but who knows.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave H 

I was very disappointed with the transfers of each of the original films except II.  I think they just went way overboard on the DNR and even some EE.  There are a couple of instances in III where the DNR for whatever reason is not present; plenty of detail and grain emerges which only made me think about how they could have looked.  However, I'm hopefully these are re-released (improved) next year with the next movie coming out, but who knows.

Yeh but that grain in 3 has static moments, its obvious on a big screen so whilst it can be there the moments where it suddenly forms a static grain field is off putting and weird, thats due to the DNR used.

Like you say all except 2 could do with redoing.

Its going to take new masters from a 4K film scan to do it right and i don't think Paramount want to spend the money as they are cheapskate businessmen and not movie lovers.

When I finally get my bigger monitor this year, I'll spin up the other Blus to see what is really going on the with the PQ.

I still think STII was blue-shifted, not just in comparison to the Director's Edition DVD but every prior version of that film I have seen, from the theatrical presentation through the widescreen laserdisc.  I understand if this was Meyer's choice, but it's really odd.  I also understood that Lowry had to stop before they were really finished due to the very limited budget afforded the restoration.  I don't know if this meant they didn't totally finish their work on II or if they got that one done, but couldn't do anything else for any of the other movies.

A new 1080p transfer of the Robert Wise cut of TMP would cost far, far less than 1 million dollars.  I venture to guess that if a proper mastering of an older film costs around 80K, it would probably be even less than that.

One other thing - Nemesis (which I actually enjoyed as the last feature film) does acknowledge the earlier familial fun for Data and his creator.  Where Data had a brother named Lore, the new brother is called B4, as a prototype.  Picard wryly notes that Dr. Soong's predilection for whimsical names for his "children" is again at work.  (Although if you think about it, B4 would have preceded both Data and Lore, since his circuitry and connections are far simpler.  In the end, even Data notes that B4 does not have the mental ability to ever be another Data - he's simply too primitive of a version of the same idea.  (Kind of like trying to make an old Apple IIe do the same things as a MacBook Pro - just not an option...)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kevin EK 

When I finally get my bigger monitor this year, I'll spin up the other Blus to see what is really going on the with the PQ.

 

I still think STII was blue-shifted, not just in comparison to the Director's Edition DVD but every prior version of that film I have seen, from the theatrical presentation through the widescreen laserdisc.  I understand if this was Meyer's choice, but it's really odd.  I also understood that Lowry had to stop before they were really finished due to the very limited budget afforded the restoration.  I don't know if this meant they didn't totally finish their work on II or if they got that one done, but couldn't do anything else for any of the other movies.

 

A new 1080p transfer of the Robert Wise cut of TMP would cost far, far less than 1 million dollars.  I venture to guess that if a proper mastering of an older film costs around 80K, it would probably be even less than that.

 

One other thing - Nemesis (which I actually enjoyed as the last feature film) does acknowledge the earlier familial fun for Data and his creator.  Where Data had a brother named Lore, the new brother is called B4, as a prototype.  Picard wryly notes that Dr. Soong's predilection for whimsical names for his "children" is again at work.  (Although if you think about it, B4 would have preceded both Data and Lore, since his circuitry and connections are far simpler.  In the end, even Data notes that B4 does not have the mental ability to ever be another Data - he's simply too primitive of a version of the same idea.  (Kind of like trying to make an old Apple IIe do the same things as a MacBook Pro - just not an option...)

My problem with Nemesis though is that they ignore the fact Lore ever existed, no mention is made of Data having had a "brother" called Lore, they make it seem like B4 is the first twin android Data or Picard has seen, at least thats how i remember it...Maybe i'm wrong as it's been a good few years since i watched it.

I mentioned this earlier in the Ten Commendments Forum, but since this is Star Trek, I've decided to repost it here.

Director's Edition DVD

BluRay

Skin is naturally a bit green on both Vulcans and Humans, right?

Quote:

Originally Posted by FoxyMulder 

My problem with Nemesis though is that they ignore the fact Lore ever existed, no mention is made of Data having had a "brother" called Lore, they make it seem like B4 is the first twin android Data or Picard has seen, at least thats how i remember it...Maybe i'm wrong as it's been a good few years since i watched it.

 

I really liked Nemesis the first time I saw it, and it's kind of been a case of diminishing returns with each subsequent viewing.  I remember having the same feeling about Lore being mentioned; I'm OK with the movie not featuring Lore, but at the least, when they're discovering B4's body parts in the desert, I'm shocked that no one even wasted a breath saying, "Could this be Lore?" and answering why it wasn't very quickly.  That was just a bit sloppy, I thought.

Quote:

Originally Posted by FoxyMulder 

My problem with Nemesis though is that they ignore the fact Lore ever existed, no mention is made of Data having had a "brother" called Lore, they make it seem like B4 is the first twin android Data or Picard has seen, at least thats how i remember it...Maybe i'm wrong as it's been a good few years since i watched it.

 

It's not so much that they directly contradict anything, just that no one brings it up, and that's the problem. You'd think someone would have piped up when they started to assemble B4: "Anyone remember the last time we did this? It didn't turn out too well..."

This is kind of a dead horse, but that was my main problem with most of the Next Generation movies; there weren't that many direct continuity contradictions, but the characters seemed to develop amnesia about things that really should have had some bearing on their actions. The films are full of "Seriously-No-One-Thought-About-This?" moments that are frustrating for even casual fans. And it's not just the geek desire to "get the references;" we're talking about character threads that could have had a positive impact on the plots. Why not mention Lore (and Data's mother, for that matter); you'd need a few lines to get general audiences up to speed, but it could have made the B4 subplot a whole lot more interesting.

I know they were always concerned about making a movie that non-Trek fans would enjoy, but you don't want to do that at the expense of your core audience. If they don't go to it; it's doubtful anyone else will, either. Of course, by Nemesis, the longtime fans were about all they had left.

Anyway, back on topic, I remember it seeming like a minor miracle that The Motion Picture got a real director's cut at all. It would have been nice if they had just finished it on film back then, but that will almost certainly never happen now, so I do hope they at least re-do it for 1080.

I'm with Nelson in remembering that a theatrical release of the TMP - DE was talked about for months leading up to the DVD release, but that it never happened.  So a film print was never made.  I think the decision to go with DVD 480 resolution is what killed the idea, but that info didn't get out until after the work was done.  There was a "premier" party (complete with the actual 8-foot filming model of the Enterprise as a centerpiece on a table) for the DE release, but was just a video showing of the DVD itself.  If I'm not mistaken, The Digital Bits was there and took pictures.

Being the one that mentioned the idea that the DE was sort of a sanctioned "fanboi" cut - I have to add that this wasn't a new thought - nor my own, really.  I don't know how I really feel about it myself.  I was on some of the Trek forums a lot more during the years prior to the DVD release and there was one member who was ecstatic about the upcoming release (he even personally sent me a screen cap of the CGI bridge-walk scene about 6 months before the actual release - so he knew someone on the inside).  When it was released, he turned totally against it - calling it a hack job and what-not.  Some of the arguments against it sounded plausible, others, not so much.  It did help me to look at the DE more closely.  Overall, I still do like the effort.  But, as I said before, there are some editing choices that just bother me.  Losing Kirk's second, louder, "viewer off" was one.  Uhura was in a bit of shock at what just happened.  As originally done, seemed natural and emotional enough.  But there was lots of fan chatter years prior to this that they didn't like it.  Losing it on the DE seemed like fan committee taking charge in that decision.  Same with Kirk's "Oh my God" in the transporter malfunction scene.  Again, I thought was perfect and natural as is.  But reading forum comments about this scene way before the DVD was even considered, I read many comments saying people laughed at that in the theater.  Although I did not experience that reaction when I saw it in the theater back in early January of 1980, and was extremely surprised that apparently other people actually thought it was a silly reaction for Kirk. 

Don't get me started on the sound effects changes.

It's just that years worth of fan comments seemed to shape some of those editing changes that really didn't need to be done.

On the other hand, a lot of the added dialog near the end was an improvement.  That's where the time was extended.  Being actual story elements, it does help keep it from seeming like it gets long.  Some of that ended up in the TV version, but redone nicely for the DE.

I would like to have the original mix available.  I don't have the Blu-ray, so does it not have at least the original surround soundtrack?  The widescreen laserdisc has some nice bass extensions in the soundtrack that the DVD is missing, although the LD could have used a little more upper-end eq'ing.

Joel,

I was never on any of those Trek forums back then. As much as I love Star Trek, I'm not sure I'd want to be!  I'm a member on one of the newer private Trek forums that focus on props, and while this one is well maintained and moderated, I can see they get testy!

One thing you said about the edits reminded me of something. My good friend went to see the very first showing of TMP in the Coronet Theater in San Francisco. He was sure the local film critics were there to review the film. He said one guy laughed when you see the close-up reaction shot of Kirk as he sees the Enterprise head on for the first time, that goofy look he has. That stuck with me all these years. So I always wondered if the added reflection of the Enterprise was done to cover his face a little. Perhaps Wise didn't like his expression on his face.

I had class that morning, I should have cut class!

I have the blu ray, Joel. But I don't recall if it has the original surround track. I'll have to check. When the laserdiscs came out, I got the Special Longer version. I always liked how the thunder clap sounds in the V'Ger chamber would crack in the rears on that Dolby track! "I want this JIm! As much as you wanted the Enterprise, I want this."

One thing I was disappointed by and I guess it was never filmed, if the scene with Admiral Nogura could have been inserted instead of that long shot of the orbiting station. That would have better shown how driven Kirk was. How dark he was as Wise said in the commentary.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joel Fontenot 

I'm with Nelson in remembering that a theatrical release of the TMP - DE was talked about for months leading up to the DVD release, but that it never happened.  So a film print was never made.  I think the decision to go with DVD 480 resolution is what killed the idea, but that info didn't get out until after the work was done.  There was a "premier" party (complete with the actual 8-foot filming model of the Enterprise as a centerpiece on a table) for the DE release, but was just a video showing of the DVD itself.  If I'm not mistaken, The Digital Bits was there and took pictures.

 

Being the one that mentioned the idea that the DE was sort of a sanctioned "fanboi" cut - I have to add that this wasn't a new thought - nor my own, really.  I don't know how I really feel about it myself.  I was on some of the Trek forums a lot more during the years prior to the DVD release and there was one member who was ecstatic about the upcoming release (he even personally sent me a screen cap of the CGI bridge-walk scene about 6 months before the actual release - so he knew someone on the inside).  When it was released, he turned totally against it - calling it a hack job and what-not.  Some of the arguments against it sounded plausible, others, not so much.  It did help me to look at the DE more closely.  Overall, I still do like the effort.  But, as I said before, there are some editing choices that just bother me.  Losing Kirk's second, louder, "viewer off" was one.  Uhura was in a bit of shock at what just happened.  As originally done, seemed natural and emotional enough.  But there was lots of fan chatter years prior to this that they didn't like it.  Losing it on the DE seemed like fan committee taking charge in that decision.  Same with Kirk's "Oh my God" in the transporter malfunction scene.  Again, I thought was perfect and natural as is.  But reading forum comments about this scene way before the DVD was even considered, I read many comments saying people laughed at that in the theater.  Although I did not experience that reaction when I saw it in the theater back in early January of 1980, and was extremely surprised that apparently other people actually thought it was a silly reaction for Kirk. 

 

Don't get me started on the sound effects changes.

 

It's just that years worth of fan comments seemed to shape some of those editing changes that really didn't need to be done.

 

On the other hand, a lot of the added dialog near the end was an improvement.  That's where the time was extended.  Being actual story elements, it does help keep it from seeming like it gets long.  Some of that ended up in the TV version, but redone nicely for the DE.

 

I would like to have the original mix available.  I don't have the Blu-ray, so does it not have at least the original surround soundtrack?  The widescreen laserdisc has some nice bass extensions in the soundtrack that the DVD is missing, although the LD could have used a little more upper-end eq'ing.

Thanks for the post and thoughts. 

I do believe that the film was never originally edited, so some of the lines of dialogue that were in the original film were most likely intended to be cut. I recall Star Trek.com running many articles with Robert Wise being interviewed about the project and it's either there or in the documentary where they discuss the fact that some of the lines or visuals were placeholders in case things were not finished... 

I also believe that Robert Wise did intend to edit the film before theatrical release and was not allowed too. The special effects that were updated for the DE were storyboarded but again they were out of time to finish things. It had to be released. 

I think again, the best move at this point is to release both versions. As well as maybe the video version? 

On the audio for the TMP blu ray, English 7.1 Dolby True HD, French 2.0 Dolby Surround and Spanish mono. Great question. I had actually never looked to see if the original English mix was included. 

Wow.. Ok I stand corrected. It appears that all of the articles about the Director's Cut that were on Startrek.com have been removed!!! Very sad. 

There was quite a few of them about the project on the site. I really wish I had copied and pasted them into a document to save. I do have a few other magazines from the time TMP DE was released and will see if I come across anything interesting. 

I wonder if Paramount pulled the TMP DE articles for a specific reason? 

I did find a few random video clips.. 

Unused trailer for Star Trek The Motion Picture Director's Cut...

http://www.startrek.com/watch_video/unused-teaser-trailer-ncc-1701

alternative scene from the DE.. 

http://www.startrek.com/watch_video/tmp-de-outtake-rack-focus-kirk

Unused effects shot:

http://www.startrek.com/watch_video/unused-fx-shot-vgers-fireballs-over-earth

A couple of more TMP videos on the Director's Cut here:

http://www.startrek.com/videos/documentaries/all/clips/title

Have you tried digging up some of those articles via the Wayback Machine?  I'm not sure exactly where on the site to look, but they have a bunch of older versions of the site archived, maybe you can find some of those articles on the Director's Edition there.

Quote:

Originally Posted by cafink 

Have you tried digging up some of those articles via the Wayback Machine?  I'm not sure exactly where on the site to look, but they have a bunch of older versions of the site archived, maybe you can find some of those articles on the Director's Edition there.

Thanks for the tip! 

The making of the DE feature on the DE DVD is pretty much all about the new effects shots. Really nothing about editing changes..

I did locate the following which is also included in the TMP DE DVD insert... 

A Sub-Space Communication from the Director...

It isn't often that an artist gets to revisit an old work, and ordinarily, I wouldn't consider it. Art, and especially film, which is an inherently collaborative medium, is not created in a vacuum. Rather, it results from a combination of forces and personalities, coupled with limitations of time, budget, and technology, which all converge in a way that is unique to a moment in time. Gene Roddenberry seemed to understand concepts like this, and he also believed, ifSTAR TREK is to be accepted as a mirror of his imagination, that time travel would one day be a reality. My experience in creating "The Director's Edition" of STAR TREK: THE MOTION PICTURE has come closer to that reality than I ever imagined.

STAR TREK was a prestigious film for Paramount Pictures, and their support was unswerving. Unfortunately, even they couldn't stop the clock from ticking, and as we began to assess the ambitious technological breakthroughs we were attempting, we gradually realized that it was going to be a race. Thanks to a dedicated cast and crew who worked far beyond the call of duty, we survived the chaos of our final weeks and delivered a movie on the date promised...December 7, 1979. We had removed several key dialog scenes in order to accommodate our incoming effects work, but no time remained to work on properly balancing these two components.

Thanks once again to Paramount's support, we have been able to complete the film as "The Director's Edition." In addition to finding a new, and I feel, proper editorial balance for the film, we have also completed those effects shots and scenes which we had to abort in 1979, and have given the film a proper final sound mix. It has been an opportunity which I never believed would happen, and one for which I am grateful beyond words. Gene Roddenberry was right... time travel IS possible.

- Robert Wise

 

I'm sure the audio commentary may have more to say as well about editing and dialogue changes. That will take a bit more time though. 

I recall in addition to the editing, the music and sounds mix was not finished properly. I believe the new sound elements that were used in the DE were actually still in the Paramount vaults from the making of the film. Again there was not time to finish. I'll look for more info on this as well. 

Did a bit of reading on the DE cut and here are some quotes from Robert Wise about making TMP and the DE cut: