Star Trek films on Blu-Ray... what we know so far - Page 5

Re: Star Trek films on Blu-Ray... what we know so far

There is a mention of a Christmas party where Kirk sweeps Dr. Noel to his cabin in a fictional situation placed into his mind in Dagger of the Mind.

Re: Star Trek films on Blu-Ray... what we know so far

Idealy Roddenberry envisioned the people of the 23rd century, at least on earth, to be free from religion. Obviously at the time you couldn't just come out and say we're all atheists in the future, so the best they could do was ignore it.

The few times "god" was mentioned on TOS directly always read as untrue to me, but there aren't as many as you'd think. Using a phrase like "My God" is nothing more than an expression, likewise celebrating christmas is already done out of tradition as much if not more than it is a religious celebration.

Re: Star Trek films on Blu-Ray... what we know so far

What a wise man!


That tradition now being, of course... the annual Doctor Who Christmas Special! :-)

Re: Star Trek films on Blu-Ray... what we know so far

Didn't know/remember the TV version.
This REALLY could be a "BR"-like release.
Now I'm torn. I had NO problem picking up the theatrical; then maybe the DC later on. Butt now, I want it ALL in 1!
(not unusually for me or this forum!!! ;-) )

Re: Star Trek films on Blu-Ray... what we know so far

It really does suck. I know there was at least one fairly influencial voice pushing for all three versions of ST:TMP to be put in a single HD-DVD set (on the assumption back then that HD-DVD would still be Paramount's format of choice). I'm sure that voice is still pushing for a definitive BD set.

I'm sure it'll come but this Paramount and Star Trek is their no.1 cash cow.

Re: Star Trek films on Blu-Ray... what we know so far

Dang. Well, the OFFICIAL trailer release on the net is this mon

Re: Star Trek films on Blu-Ray... what we know so far

Well let us not forget the most blantant reference to religion in TOS at the end of "Bread and Circuses" when Uhura says that the "sun worshipers" are really "son worshipers" worshiping the Son of God (paraphrasing here) and Kirk says "Caesar and Christ, they had them both."

True they rarely mentioned religion in the show, but that was, IMO, the most obvious reference to it.

Re: Star Trek films on Blu-Ray... what we know so far

Huh? I remember the end of "Bread and Circuses", where Uhura told the crew that the escaped slaves worshiped "the son of God", followed by Kirk concluding that the "modern Roman civilization" had Christ, followed by Spock commenting that the religion would replace the Roman Empire. That was anything but "steering away".

Re: Star Trek films on Blu-Ray... what we know so far

I know this is now starting to veer extremely off topic and likely to become extremely controversial but this an interesting appraisal of religion in Star Trek:

Ex Astris Scientia - Religion in Star Trek

And as it says here: "Roddenberry insisted that no currently existent religion was practiced in the 24th century and all humans were atheists and the world was a better place for it. Positive religious themes were not part of Roddenberry’s universe":

http://www.starbase10.com/trek/religion_in_trek.htm

Controversial but interesting. And a view I happen to vigourously share!

Getting back on topic, I thought Shatner's reading of "Oh my God" was just perfect.

Re: Star Trek films on Blu-Ray... what we know so far

You can share whatever you like with Roddenberry, but such a view was NOT manifested in the actual series (as shown by the two examples), and could never have been in a 60s TV show. He had a hard enough time getting the revealing costumes and interracial/interspecies aspects past the censors without tackling religion.

And the delivery of the "Oh my God" line was, well, godawful.

Re: Star Trek films on Blu-Ray... what we know so far

Personally, from what i remember, I really like Shatner's reading of the "Oh My God" line. It was the next few lines after that that seemesd flat to me.

I know he's trying to convey his being stunned at what happened, but the "Starfleet, do you have them?" just seemed so blah, and then the guy from Starfleet with the "Enterprise, what we got back didn't live long...fortunately." makes me cringe every time I hear it. You want to talk about a line being read flat. THAT was it in spades!

And for what it's worth I would much rather wait for a blu-ray release with all 3 versions on it, than just the thearical cut now, and maybe, which would most assuredly happen, the director's cut later on. I saw the theatrical in December 79 when it first was released, but as I was only 8 can't remember the major differences between that and the TV version released years later, and then the DC. I remember reading about the differences and how the newer version made it a much better film, but I would like the choice to be able to view all 3 versions and choose for myself on the same blu-ray release.

I don't want it to hinge on the fact that if this version of TMP sells good, then Paramount will revisit it and release the other versions, which seeing as it is Star Trek I doubt it would. Paramount will milk it until the cow is dried up and then sell the cow for meat. That just smacks of greed to the nth degree, but I think Paramount has proved their intentions regarding the Star Trek franchise often enough.

Just like with the LOTR blu-ray releases later next year, where the word going around is that they will only release the theatrical cut now, while waiting to release the uber box set around the time The Hobbit comes out in theatres. If that turns out to become true, then I will have no problem waiting for the box set as long as it will include both the theatrical and extended editions. Same goes for TMP, and ST:II and ST:VI for that matter. Tell me you are going to eventually release all the versions on a blu-ray but it will take an extra year or so and I can easily live with it. Just don't have us live in ignorance and buy the theatrical release and then 6 months later announce a new blu-ray with all the various cuts.

Re: Star Trek films on Blu-Ray... what we know so far

I believe the "oh my god" was cut not because it was just "bad", but as part of a larger effort to tone down the cumulative effect of having so much of Shatner's......Shatner-ness.
Now to open a new can of worms...if the theatrical version of VI is included, what ratio will it be? And what should it be? I still am not sure.

Re: Star Trek films on Blu-Ray... what we know so far

The thing about taking lines out to "improve" a movie is that 99% of the audience know where the lines used to be and never truly "forget" they were there. A bit like the narration in Blade Runner. Hence we're here now talking about a line that was removed in 2000 to supposedly improve the movie. It might change the movie but it doesn't change our memories.

I guess future generations might benefit... but they're just as likely to want to seek out the theatrical version because they're just as much purists as we are!

Re: Star Trek films on Blu-Ray... what we know so far

By the way, I think the "bring them back" line by Grace Lee Whitney that preceded the Shatner line was godawful as well.

Re: Star Trek films on Blu-Ray... what we know so far

is there a list of what paramount has released as a part of their older/catalog movies on hi-def either HD DVD or BD? i have to say, other than Godfather trilogy, paramount has not done a good job with presenting older classic catalog titles. they seem to 'go with the flow' when necessarily. after all, u don't see paramount doing their own blade runner, how the west was won, or even how sony treats their rudy, starship trooper or even fox's releases (when unmarred by DNR). does paramount even care? that's why i'm hesistant when i think of trek on BD because of my personal experiences with it on home video prior to BD.

when VHS came out, it was obviously a godsend. now u can finally watch it @home... but over the years they keep repackaging it with different graphics covers to resell it as different box sets. when LDs came out, the PQ was an improvement over VHS, but not by a huge margin. i know the trek movies had always been given the shaft in terms of budget (which is why the new movie will be a huge departure in terms of that).

when DVDs came out, i feel like the same pattern of behavior happened. use the same masters and release them on DVD. TMP never got released, just 2-TNG era movies. the reason why TNG movies like First Contact were great transfers is because they are new, not because paramount cared about them. then when the SE/CE's came out with TMP being the first, i was almost excited about 2-10, if that was going to be the same treatment. sadly no.

trek is one of the largest (if not THE largest) and most profitable franchise for paramount, but they've always treated them as a bastard child and punish rabid fans (like me) who keep buying everything that comes out.

1. does paramount even have a remastering facitility? if so, they need to keep up with competing studios. u just dont hear HTFers being excited about them compared to George from WHV. hell we're on the FIRST name basis with the head of WHV!!! where are the other studios?
2. all 20 bond had been through LDI's remastering process. has paramount ever done anything like that for their movies?
3. i understand it's a business. oh i get it. but so does WHV/Sony/every other studio! and it's good biz to sell consumers what they want, not craptastic transfers.

Re: Star Trek films on Blu-Ray... what we know so far

IIRC, Martin Blythe of Paramount used to come to the HTF and join in the threads. But I think there was a point when he was getting flak that he felt it wasn't worth being attacked and stopped. Can't blame him. And it was a real shame too.

I remember when Star Trek 2, The Directors Cut came out, Martin was here and gave info on the disc and Nic Meyer's appearances to sign and talk about the film.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but that's how I remember it. Maybe he got married and didn't have anymore time for this.

Re: Star Trek films on Blu-Ray... what we know so far

Just thought I'd mention, since there is talk of religion here in regards to Trek, that Kirk specifically mentions in "Who Mourns for Adonis" that they have no needs for gods... just the one. That was the only direct reference to practicing reliigion I ever heard, it was otherwise avoided throughout the series.

Re: Star Trek films on Blu-Ray... what we know so far

True enough...then we get another example of Kirk's "assholeness", as he dumps his sending-condolences duties onto the poor transporter tech over at Starfleet, makes him do the actual research on how to find Sonak's family, and further insults him by telling which embassy to contact, as if the guy was going to call the Tellurite embassy concerning a Vulcan officer.

"I'm sorry, Admiral, but did someone assign me as your friggin' personal assistant without me knowing?"

Re: Star Trek films on Blu-Ray... what we know so far

They did for the Indiana Jones trilogy. And they had Robert Harris restore the Godfather trilogy. Those are all on Paramount.

Re: Star Trek films on Blu-Ray... what we know so far

godfather stems from coppola's desire to do it and telephoned spielberg's power/cloud while dreamworks was still chummy with paramount to make this happen. paramount didn't do it on their own and was probably resistant to the idea.

indy is more lucas/spielberg than paramount.

so neither counts imho even if u see the paramount banner.



now that i've not heard of. u talking about SD DVD masters?

Re: Star Trek films on Blu-Ray... what we know so far

LOL Too true, but hey he's an Admiral. If he can't lay that off on some schlub transporter tech, then what's the point in having the rank at all.

Re: Star Trek films on Blu-Ray... what we know so far

Paramount's choices in restoration all come down to money, and I'm sure Trek makes them enough to justify reasonable expenditure. I expect the Blu's to look good, not necessarily as good as they possibly could, but good none the less.

Re: Star Trek films on Blu-Ray... what we know so far

I know I may be jumping the gun (as the full announcement has not been made RE: this potential box set and it's supplements) but this all seems really lazy on Paramounts part. In this day and age there is no reason why all versions of ST-TMP cannot be released via seamless branching on Blu Ray.
This is a clear cut case of potential future double dipping.

I know Im moaning ahead of schedule, but I feel we ST fan's have been grossly short changed over the years. I can't think of one ST DVD release that has truly wowed me, the vast majority of supplements have fallen short of my expectations (true I may have been spoilt by the likes of CE3K, Alien Quadrilogy Blade Runner etc) and I've never been overly impressed by the A/V presentation of any pre 2000 filmed Trek.

Im sick of being screwed by Paramount, I stupidly bought the bare bones DVD's back in the day (most of which were none anamorphic) then I upgraded only to find major faults with transfers such as Generations.
I know Paramount doesn't really care, I know that technically they owe me jack sh!t, but damnit, why couldn't Paramount have invested money in a DVD/BR producer like Charles de Lauzirika, David Prior or Laurent Bouzereau?

What are the chances of any truly in-depth documentaries on the TOS films? very doubtful I suspect
What are the chances of the lost footage from the abandoned ST-TMP memory wall sequence being included? (yes it was shot!) Or the wealth of deleted footage from Wrath of Kahn? Or the deleted Vulcan footage from Search for Spock? etc etc
Will it be included in this release? Im certainly not getting my hopes up.

Trek has come pretty close to permanent death recently, the Abrams re-boot being the only potential ray o light. Trek really needs a major boost right now and it needs it's fans to stand by it. Aside from fan projects and the hard work of Michael and Denise Okuda on TOS-R, Paramount seem to have done squat off their own backs.

I really am disillusioned with Paramount right now. Trek fanatic though I am - I will not be buying any sub par, mediocre supplemented Blu-Ray releases.

We can argue about the pro's and cons of the ST-TMP DC till we are blue in the face, but the simple fact of the matter is that some are going to end up double and maybe even triple dipping, it's gotta stop. Direct to DVD nonsense gets treated better than Trek these days.

There are no excuses Paramount, get your act together! Stop selling ST fans short, YET AGAIN!
Argh! I need to calm down lol

Re: Star Trek films on Blu-Ray... what we know so far

I recently watched the director's cut of TMP; thought it was really good, and I am someone who liked the theatrical cut of TMP. I would rather see the Blu-Rays delayed (not going to happen, since they want to cash in on the new movie) and include the DC as it appeared on DVD (with the theatrical cut scenes included on the disc).

Also, I guess there is not an incentive to provide fans with a "definitive" set of any movie series; that way, studios can keep going back to the well and producing sets that incorporate one thing but omit another. With the exception of Close Encounters, I can't think of any BD sets that I would call definitive.

Re: Star Trek films on Blu-Ray... what we know so far

I completely agree with David Simkiss...........

There are many cut scenes from Star Trek 2, 3 & 6.
From Khan:

Saavik's Romulan heritage mentioned
Khan's 'child' on the planet
Sulu's promotion
The original Kirk vs David fight (which was reshot)
the 'Eden cave'
the original finale' on the bridge

From Search:
a long Kirk/Mccoy scene in a turbo-lift
a long Kruge scene after the Enterprise destruct
a long Saavik scene where she explains Spock's potential fate to Kirk
the actual climb up Mt Selaya & the Hall of Anchient Thought walkthrough

From 'Undiscovered' :
a tour of the Enterprise for the klingons
much longer version of the Dinner argument
a scene where arm's makers try to convince the Fed president to gear up for war
lots of nice extended bits from the trial
a longer Martia intro

Even Frontier & Voyage home have a few sequences unseen.

How many home video releases before Paramount bothers to let us see these? 10.........15?
Are deleted scenes an unwarranted request for iconic movies like these--especially to fans as loyal as we have been?

I'm just plain scared we won't even get the extended version of Khan or Undiscovered.

TMP has many, many changes from version to version, but there is NO excuse for not having seamless branching for Khan & Undiscovered.

Until I actually hear what versions there are going to give for 2 & 6, I'm very worried about double-dipping for not only TMP, but the other two as well.

How about putting our fears to rest early before the actual in-depth specs are announced?

Re: Star Trek films on Blu-Ray... what we know so far

see? i wasn't the only one . i hope paramount reads this thread. i should email paramount and link them to here, lol. after all, we're the ones buying their discs!!!

indy4 is an example of a good PQ and audio quality. i'd like to see my paramount BDs be more like that!

like many of u, i will be SHOCKED (SHOCKED I SAY) if paramount actually comes through with a new pristine totally remastered lowry style presentation.

i mean Blade Runner Final Cut is another example of an awesome presentation of a similar era movie.

Re: Star Trek films on Blu-Ray... what we know so far

Not only should deleted scenes be included, but the made for TV features made at the time to promote the films. I remember a great one hour show to promote Khan hosted by Nimoy. MGM/Fox include all the Bond Tv spots from the sixties. I'm sure collectors would be glad to see these again. The Voyage home feature from the letterbox home video is the only one I've seen ported over to DVD.

Re: Star Trek films on Blu-Ray... what we know so far

"IJ&TKotCS" is an '08 flick; how are films from the 70's going too look & sound like 21th century movies?
Are you thinking: 4K?
(I would think that would be desirable/doable as well)

"BR" is a GREAT comparison.
(I've ALREADY made it!)
I would venture too add: "ST" has MORE fans than "BR"; therefore deserves (& will have a greater payoff) a "Ultimate Collector's Edition".

We're not asking for much...