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Two interesting iPod/iTunes questions...

post #1 of 16
8/13/08 at 11:28am
Thread Starter 
Two questions for your consideration...

First, does iTunes support DVD-A or SACD? I would love to rip
my DVD-A discs to iTunes->iPod in Apple lossless so that I can
listen to them in full audio glory on my iPod. Is this even possible?
Will the iPod play the DVD files fully uncompressed so they sound
as good as the original?

Next, how do you join two songs together as one?

For example...

Queen's We Will Rock You and We are The Champions
are one song.

Chicago's Dialogue Part 1 and Dialogue Part 2 are
one song.

The Beatles Sgt. Pepper and With A Little Help From My Friends
are one song.

Okay you get the picture.

Now, how do I assure they always play together as one song?

Sure, I could drag them together in iTunes so hopefully they will
play according to song number.

But how about on shuffle play? They certainly will not play together
then.

Does iTunes have a function where it bonds two songs together so
it will always play as one?
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post #2 of 16
8/13/08 at 2:22pm

Re: Two interesting iPod/iTunes questions...

DVD-A and SACD: I would guess the answer is no, for several reasons:

They're encrypted bitstreams, and Apple would not break encryption. So iTunes proper would not rip the discs. But if you could "somehow" get the digital files:

SACD uses an encoding scheme, 1-bit delta-sigma modulation at 2.8224 MHz, that is completely different than every other common (uncompressed or compressed) audio format. The iPod definitely does not support it.

DVD-A is like higher resolution CD, up to 24-bit at 192KHz instead of 16-bit at 44.1KHz. Theoretically, you could treat this like a much larger WAV or AIFF (or maybe even Apple Lossless) file, a format that iPod supports. Then the issue is whether the various different models can play such a file, with issues such as increased data transfer rate, effect on battery life, and whether the DACs can handle it. It's certainly possible that the firmware will outright reject playing a file that is outside known specs.
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post #3 of 16
8/13/08 at 6:05pm

Re: Two interesting iPod/iTunes questions...

Would an import in CD Spin Doctor (Toast) work?
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post #4 of 16
8/13/08 at 6:32pm

Re: Two interesting iPod/iTunes questions...

For my DVD-Audio discs, I used Audacity to record the output from my sound card as I played the disc on my PC. I then used Nero Wave Editor to break the resulting WAV file into separate tracks for each song. This will not give you sound quality equal to the original high resolution DVD-A track, but it's still decent quality -- especially if you are going to compress it to MP3 or AAC anyway.

I have not figured out any way to rip the audio tracks from my hig-res SACD's. If it's a hybrid SACD/CD disc, you can always grab the audio from the CD layer, of course. But for standard SACD's, I'm stumped.
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post #5 of 16
8/13/08 at 6:54pm

Re: Two interesting iPod/iTunes questions...

One of these days Imma gonna secretly replace Ron's ginormous collection of lossless files with folgers crystals, I bet he never even notices!
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post #6 of 16
8/13/08 at 7:14pm

Re: Two interesting iPod/iTunes questions...

This is hilarious. Ron asking for advice, which, if provided, would be in violation of HTF rules, since both DVD-A and SACD would involve defeating copy protection.

As far as tracks, shift-click to select the contiguous tracks before they are imported, then choose "Join Tracks" from the "Advanced" menu in iTunes. A little graphic will appear showing the tracks are linked and when imported they will be turned into a single track.
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post #7 of 16
8/13/08 at 7:35pm

Re: Two interesting iPod/iTunes questions...

Itunes will read the redbook layer of hybrid sacds. Non-hybrid SACDs don't even show up on the desktop.

I suppose it would be possible to record from a dvd player's spdif, provided, of course, that the player is willing to disregard rules... The Oppos, for instance, do this. However, it would not be as fast as a "rip", and iTunes may discard the ultrasonic information anyway.

As for DVD-A's, the one I just put in is read as a DVD-Video.
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post #8 of 16
8/15/08 at 10:07am

Re: Two interesting iPod/iTunes questions...

Quote:
Originally Posted by JeremyErwin
Itunes will read the redbook layer of hybrid sacds. Non-hybrid SACDs don't even show up on the desktop.
Yeah, I don't think there is a computer drive out there that is capable of reading the SACD layers.

-Christian
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post #9 of 16
8/15/08 at 10:09am
Thread Starter 

Re: Two interesting iPod/iTunes questions...

The joining of song tracks was invaluable advice. Never knew
this could be done and it was done flawlessly.
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post #10 of 16
8/15/08 at 11:12am

Re: Two interesting iPod/iTunes questions...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Christian Behrens
Yeah, I don't think there is a computer drive out there that is capable of reading the SACD layers.

-Christian

IIRC, the leadin is encrypted. I don't think that the drives in consumer SACD players are all that special. Sony chose not to supply a computer SACD player because they knew it would get cracked.

Best solution would be to record from the analogue outputs of an sacd player-- just as you do with records.

AFAIK, there's no portable SACD player either. A bit of a hole in my opinion.
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post #11 of 16
8/16/08 at 6:30pm

Re: Two interesting iPod/iTunes questions...

Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnRice
This is hilarious. Ron asking for advice, which, if provided, would be in violation of HTF rules, since both DVD-A and SACD would involve defeating copy protection.

As far as tracks, shift-click to select the contiguous tracks before they are imported, then choose "Join Tracks" from the "Advanced" menu in iTunes. A little graphic will appear showing the tracks are linked and when imported they will be turned into a single track.

first part, nevermind my bad.

second part, very helpful instructions of which i wasn't aware.
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post #12 of 16
8/16/08 at 8:58pm

Re: Two interesting iPod/iTunes questions...

Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyD
first part, was that really needed, ron was asking if it is supported, not how to get around something illegal.
Well, I hope Ron understood my comment better. It wasn't criticism so much as an amused observation. I hope that if he took it badly I would have heard from him. The fact is, SACD and DVD-A are copy protected, so...

Having said that, Ron, I hope you did take the comment in the manner it was intended.

Also glad to impart the info on joining tracks. Originally, iTunes didn't have that (talking about years ago) and at some point I just stumbled across it. I'd like to point out the I use LAME to encode mp3s, which does not observe these markings, but I found a nice workaround. You first import the CD into iTunes using a lossless or uncompressed format, during which the tracks will be joined, then use LAME to encode the already joined tracks.
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post #13 of 16
8/17/08 at 1:13am
Thread Starter 

Re: Two interesting iPod/iTunes questions...

Well, to be honest, I wasn't particularly bowled over by the comment.

I would hope that it would have been obvious that I wasn't
seeking advice on how to do anything illegal. My fault was not
knowing about the copy protection. I was just looking for a means
of listening to my DVD-A music on my iPod.

Now that the conversation has continued on this issue, I understand
where you guys are coming from and I'm no longer bothered by the
tone of the original response.

Appreciate the advice as always, guys.
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post #14 of 16
8/17/08 at 9:51am

Re: Two interesting iPod/iTunes questions...

Sorry about the misunderstanding Ron.

Not the first time I've inserted my foot. Won't be the last.
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post #15 of 16
8/17/08 at 11:45am
Thread Starter 

Re: Two interesting iPod/iTunes questions...

Don't be so hard on yourself. It's all cool.
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post #16 of 16
8/18/08 at 2:21pm

Re: Two interesting iPod/iTunes questions...

iTunes does support 24/96 wav files. iPod won't play them, but iTunes does support them.

The new John Mellencamp release "Life, Death, Love, and Freedom" comes packaged with a redbook CD and a DVD containing the album in 24/96, and pre-ripped MP3 and AAC tracks.

But the real beauty is that the disc is designed to allow you to import those tracks, including the 24/96 straight to your Mac or PC. No ripping, extracting, or any of the above required. Just click on the "download" button on the DVD menu. And then they can be imported to your iTunes library.

IIRC, iTunes can in fact output 24/96 digitally, so in theory you could actually assemble a hi-rez music server based on iTunes, and use it to drive the DAC of your choice.

Brian
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