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Is it me or does the 'TERMINATOR 2' BD look no different than the UE DVD? - Page 2

post #31 of 53
7/23/08 at 7:06am

Re: Is it me or does the 'TERMINATOR 2' BD look no different than the UE DVD?

As one of Lionsgate's first BD releases, I'm sure they could do much better now.
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post #32 of 53
7/23/08 at 9:05am

Re: Is it me or does the 'TERMINATOR 2' BD look no different than the UE DVD?

I own both the BD and German Steelbook HD DVD and I can say with absolute certainty that the HD DVD is noticeably cleaner, sharper and the audio rocks on it. Totally worth the $50 I paid for it.
Now if Kinowelt would just put out English tracks to download for the trivia and bloopers extras, I would be the happiest camper.
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post #33 of 53
7/23/08 at 4:17pm

Re: Is it me or does the 'TERMINATOR 2' BD look no different than the UE DVD?

Not sure if this is the same encode as the HD DVD or not, but the UK is getting a BD release.

Amazon.co.uk: Terminator 2 - Judgment Day [Blu-ray] [1991]: Arnold Schwarzenegger, S. Epatha Merkerson, Linda Hamilton, Robert Patrick, Edward Furlong, Joe Morton, Xander Berkeley, Earl Boen, Jenette Goldstein, Castulo Guerra, James Cameron: DVD
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post #34 of 53
7/23/08 at 5:40pm

"I'll Be Back!!!"

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brandon Conway
As one of Lionsgate's first BD releases, I'm sure they could do much better now.
Yeah...
looking forward too the AVC (advanced codec) remastered video w/DTS HD Master audio.
Can you believe this disc is MPEG2?!?!?!?!
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post #35 of 53
7/24/08 at 12:27am

Re: Is it me or does the 'TERMINATOR 2' BD look no different than the UE DVD?

At the moment I have three Hi-Def versions of this movie, the US BD (Lionsgate), the french HD DVD (Studio Canal) and the german HD DVD (Kinowelt).

I agree that the screenshots from Xylon's thread are not conclusive, but when the film is viewed in motion, the Studio Canal HD DVD (dir. cut) has the sharpest, most hi-def, appearance. That being said, it still fails to achieve the wow-factor of many superior Hi-Def releases. There is room for improvements.

Due to hardware bottlenecks, I have high hopes that the forthcoming Blu-Ray from Optimum UK will port the Studio Canal transfer and thus replace the HD DVD as my preferred release of this film.

On a sad note: On my last viewings of this movie I've become aware that I've watched it too many times. I just can't get into it anymore and find my mind wandering. I've watched this film to death, literally, and am actually dreading having to watch it again to appraise the next version's PQ/AQ. Let that be a lesson to you, boys and girls, too much of a good thing will ruin it.
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post #36 of 53
7/24/08 at 6:19am

Re: Is it me or does the 'TERMINATOR 2' BD look no different than the UE DVD?

Quote:
For the German?

The French release from Studio Canal.

Before my purchase, I thought I read somewhere the German version had forced subtitles so I went with the French version which was cheaper. Perhaps it was a French-run website still a bit angry over that whole WWII thing...
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post #37 of 53
7/24/08 at 3:31pm

Re: Is it me or does the 'TERMINATOR 2' BD look no different than the UE DVD?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Clinton McClure
Before my purchase, I thought I read somewhere the German version had forced subtitles so I went with the French version which was cheaper.

It´s actually the 2-disc French-version (HD DVD), which has "forced" subs with "Theatrical version". "Special Edition" version of the film has optional subs.
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post #38 of 53
7/25/08 at 1:22am

Re: Is it me or does the 'TERMINATOR 2' BD look no different than the UE DVD?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Reuben
I often regret that Cameron and his team did so much to publicize the Super35 process. Now it's almost impossible to discuss T2 or The Abyss without someone trying to explain some visual element by referencing Super35. Funny how that rarely happens with films that people don't automatically associate with Super35, e.g., Black Rain, Ridley Scott's film from 1989, two years before T2; or Apollo 13 and Se7en from 1995; or (gasp!) The Fifth Element from 1997.

All of those are Super35 films. (And all of them were pre-DI, too.)

M.

Silverado is one of my favorite movies and I think even to this day one of the best looking Super 35 movies ever made.

Doug
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post #39 of 53
7/25/08 at 6:43am

Re: Is it me or does the 'TERMINATOR 2' BD look no different than the UE DVD?


Does anyone know where one can find more information regarding this release, particularly what cut is on it?
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post #40 of 53
7/25/08 at 7:17pm

Re: Is it me or does the 'TERMINATOR 2' BD look no different than the UE DVD?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Douglas Monce
Silverado is one of my favorite movies and I think even to this day one of the best looking Super 35 movies ever made.

Doug

Another gorgeous pre-Digital Intermetiate Super-35 film is Martin Scorsese's KUNDUN. I saw that projected and it was absolutely stunning visually.

Vincent
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post #41 of 53
7/25/08 at 7:22pm

Re: Is it me or does the 'TERMINATOR 2' BD look no different than the UE DVD?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Douglas Monce
Older Super 35 films might appear a bit more grainy, but they should have considerably more detail than an SD DVD. Mid 80s films such as Silverado and Top Gun are likely to be fairly grainy, but T2 was made after Eastman introduced the t-grain film stocks and should look pretty darn good.

Doug

"A bit more grainy" than what, though. Even "older" Super-35 should look better, all things considered, than a 1.85:1 movie from the same era in High Def, if we're going by the size of the negative as a deciding factor, since the 1.85:1 negative is only around 21mm wide and that will be spread completely across the HD frame, compared to 24mm for Super-35 spread across the same width.

Vincent
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post #42 of 53
7/25/08 at 7:45pm

Re: Is it me or does the 'TERMINATOR 2' BD look no different than the UE DVD?

Quote:
It´s actually the 2-disc French-version (HD DVD), which has "forced" subs with "Theatrical version". "Special Edition" version of the film has optional subs.

Thanks Jari. I haven't watched the theatrical version, only the special edition version, so I did not know that.
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post #43 of 53
7/25/08 at 9:11pm

Re: Is it me or does the 'TERMINATOR 2' BD look no different than the UE DVD?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vincent_P
"A bit more grainy" than what, though. Even "older" Super-35 should look better, all things considered, than a 1.85:1 movie from the same era in High Def, if we're going by the size of the negative as a deciding factor, since the 1.85:1 negative is only around 21mm wide and that will be spread completely across the HD frame, compared to 24mm for Super-35 spread across the same width.

Vincent

A bit more grainy that later Super 35 films shot on improved Eastman film stock, or than anamorphic films shot on the same film stock.

If we are talking about Super 35 at 2.35:1, its almost a toss up with Academy 1.85:1. Yes there is more image area horizontally, but there is more cropping on the top and bottom.

Of course Super 35 framed for 1.85:1 SHOULD look better than Academy 1.85:1.

Doug
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post #44 of 53
7/28/08 at 2:45pm

Re: Is it me or does the 'TERMINATOR 2' BD look no different than the UE DVD?

BD25
MPEG2
lossy
lack of special features

this will go down in history as one of the weakess HDM's ever from a major
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post #45 of 53
7/29/08 at 7:13am

Re: Is it me or does the 'TERMINATOR 2' BD look no different than the UE DVD?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ed St. Clair
BD25
MPEG2
lossy
lack of special features

this will go down in history as one of the weakess HDM's ever from a major
That's a bit of hyperbole IMO. There were a ton of discs on both sides that had essentially the same specs. For instance, Paramount's Jack Ryan Collection and "Top Gun"--or any Paramount catalog title, really--on HD DVD had poor PQ, no features, and lossy audio as well. Same goes for several early Warner BDs.
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post #46 of 53
7/29/08 at 7:49am

Re: Is it me or does the 'TERMINATOR 2' BD look no different than the UE DVD?

I pulled the U.S. Blu-ray verison out last night just to look at several scenes as it had been a while since I watched it. It's not that bad really. Admittingly, it's not great by any means, but a number of shots look decent and definitely excel over the UE SD DVD. One of the positives is it doesn't seem filtered and grain is very evident throughout the film.

While I'm sure a higher bit rate encode will definitely help somewhat, but unless Lionsgate does some major restoration work (which I doubt they will do), I don't think we're going to see a huge improvement - it will be more subtle and probably more on par with the overseas HD DVD version.
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post #47 of 53
7/29/08 at 3:24pm

Re: Is it me or does the 'TERMINATOR 2' BD look no different than the UE DVD?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jesse Blacklow
That's a bit of hyperbole IMO. There were a ton of discs on both sides that had essentially the same specs. For instance, Paramount's Jack Ryan Collection and "Top Gun"--or any Paramount catalog title, really--on HD DVD had poor PQ, no features, and lossy audio as well. Same goes for several early Warner BDs.
Don't wish too start any format war situations so I wont ask which Para HD DVD titles had "bad" PQ. ;-)
I'll just say those titles too you are in the same boat as this one for me.
Let's both hope for better in the near future! :-)
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post #48 of 53
7/31/08 at 6:19am

Re: Is it me or does the 'TERMINATOR 2' BD look no different than the UE DVD?

My question now is how long will it take for Lionsgate to remaster Terminator 2 and give it the transfer it deserves? I am not saying the transfer looks horrid but there is room for improvement. And how long will it take them to remaster T2 with a lossless audio track? My reasons for it to be remastered is more for a better audio track, just being honest.

I would like to see T2 have both versions of the film via seamless branching and possibly a 5.1 or 7.1 DTS-HD Master Audio track. Hell I would be thrilled to get a LPCM track or even Dolby True HD. And while the lossy DTS track was good it could be better with lossless.
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post #49 of 53
7/31/08 at 8:03am

Re: Is it me or does the 'TERMINATOR 2' BD look no different than the UE DVD?

Based on Van Ling (Insider´s section) and the fact, that JC has a new major film "in progress", it seems that Cameron is quite busy for a while (at least 2008-2009). This means, that he probably can´t participate, let alone supervise any new DVD/Blu-ray-releases of his films.

So I would say, that now it´s best just to wait a while and do both of these films in a "proper way" when Cameron is on-board and all that. Why keep releasing these, if they don´t have any new extras etc (and perhaps they have to do "new" transfers also)?

IMO, they should just wait and then in the late 2009 (or something), release new kick-ass editions of both of these films on Blu-ray (and DVD). Then again, this is just me.
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post #50 of 53
7/31/08 at 8:29am

Re: Is it me or does the 'TERMINATOR 2' BD look no different than the UE DVD?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Moritz
My question now is how long will it take for Lionsgate to remaster Terminator 2 and give it the transfer it deserves? I am not saying the transfer looks horrid but there is room for improvement. And how long will it take them to remaster T2 with a lossless audio track? My reasons for it to be remastered is more for a better audio track, just being honest.

I would like to see T2 have both versions of the film via seamless branching and possibly a 5.1 or 7.1 DTS-HD Master Audio track. Hell I would be thrilled to get a LPCM track or even Dolby True HD. And while the lossy DTS track was good it could be better with lossless.

I agree with everything you're saying. I'd have to believe we'll see something from Lionsgate next year to cross promote with T4. I mean how many times has T2 been re-released on DVD over the years? We're about due.

My pure speculation is we'll see maybe some sort of remaster, but definitely a new encode with a DTS-HD or DTS-MA track which seems to be what Lionsgate uses these days. I would also expect to see the extended cut.

For me personally, I don't have much of a preference for the theatrical or extended cut; nor do I care about the extras. So, Lionsgate is going to have to improve the audio and more preferably the video for me to double dip. (I just hope they don't clean this up by going excessively with DNR as they have with some of their other catalog titles. The current T2 is not perfect, but at least DNR is not a problem with it.)
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post #51 of 53
8/1/08 at 2:57pm

Re: Is it me or does the 'TERMINATOR 2' BD look no different than the UE DVD?

Just an FYI...

I came across a Web site which does A/B comparisons for screenshots. Here's some more on T2. All you have to do after clicking the image you want is to move your cursor back and forth over the image to see the difference. However, it seems the HD DVD version is slightly compressed. They pretty much mirror Zylon's screenshots.

High Definition / Standard Definition Battle
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post #52 of 53
8/1/08 at 3:39pm

Re: Is it me or does the 'TERMINATOR 2' BD look no different than the UE DVD?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave H
Just an FYI...

However, it seems the HD DVD version is slightly compressed. They pretty much mirror Zylon's screenshots.

High Definition / Standard Definition Battle
Your terminology was a bit confusing. The HDDVD is compressed in the vertical dimension. The way you had expressed it, I thought perhaps you meant codec compression.
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post #53 of 53
8/1/08 at 3:51pm

Re: Is it me or does the 'TERMINATOR 2' BD look no different than the UE DVD?

Quote:
Originally Posted by RobertR
Your terminology was a bit confusing. The HDDVD is compressed in the vertical dimension. The way you had expressed it, I thought perhaps you meant codec compression.

That's what I thought too. Anyway, from the screen shots there doesn't appear to be much difference to me. I guess I will see for myself with moving images once the Terminator 2 UK BD, which has been confirmed to be the director's cut, ships to me.
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