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"Monk" Season 7 Thread

post #1 of 122
7/18/08 at 6:47am
Thread Starter 
Tonight Mr. Monk buys a new house and gets a new therapist, after the untimely passing of Dr. Kroger (resulting from the untimely passing of Stanley Kamel).
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post #2 of 122
7/18/08 at 7:00am

Re: "Monk" Season 7 Thread

I've got the DVR all set up to record the new shows on USA-HD. Time to get your Monk on!
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post #3 of 122
7/18/08 at 7:08am

Re: "Monk" Season 7 Thread

I'll be watching this one tonight, for certain. Is this the final season of this excellent series?
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post #4 of 122
7/18/08 at 7:08am

Re: "Monk" Season 7 Thread

Yep. Already have Monk and Psych set to record.
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post #5 of 122
7/18/08 at 7:33am

Re: "Monk" Season 7 Thread

I started losing interest in Monk a couple of seasons ago. Now that I have USA in HD I will start watching it again.
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post #6 of 122
7/18/08 at 9:06pm

Re: "Monk" Season 7 Thread

I liked the way they handled things tonight. I think that anything else would've really seemed cheap.
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post #7 of 122
7/19/08 at 12:29pm

Re: "Monk" Season 7 Thread

Does anyone know if Bitty Schram might make a guest appearance sometime this season? I think it could be worked into the storyline; however, I'm not sure the two parties (Schram and TPTB) left on the best of terms, which might make it difficult for her to return in any capacity. I'd love to see it, though. Some of the dialogue between she and Traylor Howard might be fascinating, to say the least.
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post #8 of 122
7/19/08 at 12:49pm

Re: "Monk" Season 7 Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ockeghem
Does anyone know if Bitty Schram might make a guest appearance sometime this season? I think it could be worked into the storyline; however, I'm not sure the two parties (Schram and TPTB) left on the best of terms, which might make it difficult for her to return in any capacity. I'd love to see it, though. Some of the dialogue between she and Traylor Howard might be fascinating, to say the least.

I fully expect for them to go to this well before the show is over, they'll run out of ideas eventually and suddenly they won't have so much pride.
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post #9 of 122
7/19/08 at 4:33pm

Re: "Monk" Season 7 Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zack Gibbs
I fully expect for them to go to this well before the show is over, they'll run out of ideas eventually and suddenly they won't have so much pride.

Since this is the last season, I seriously doubt they're going to "run out of ideas" before reaching the finale. (I also seem to recall reading that this will be a short season because of budget problems.) As for Bitty Schram returning... I could see it going either way.

Sharona and Benjy did get a name-check when Monk when they were planning Monk's memorial service, which was a nice touch, and it sure looks like Schram is available .

OTOH, mentioning a character costs nothing. Bringing in a guest star does, so they wouldn't have her drop in to do a cameo just because the fans would like to see that. Sharona would have to have a major role in the episode. She'd have to be either the client or the perp. (Which would make for an interesting story, but I doubt Schram would ever go for it.)

Finally, Schram left in a dispute over money, and the show budget has been reduced so much that even Shaloub took a pay cut. So she might not want to return for a one-shot role on an already-cancelled show for a reduced fee.

Back to the actual season debut - I thought the passing of Stanley Kamel/Dr. Kroger was handle with restraint and good taste. Kudos to all concerned.

I loved the morse code jokes and the fact that they tied into the plot at a critical moment. I loved Monk dragging himself to the hammer only to drive the errant nail. I kept waiting for Natalie (at least) to realize that they could have taken the hammer and broken the friggin' tub to free themselves, but I'll forgive the lapse because we got the wonderful gag of Monk making Natalie drag the tub by herself. (The claw-foot tub and the fact that it would be disconnected from the plumbing was another example of how well-thought-out the show is, and how the writers play fair with the audience in setting this stuff up well in advance before pulling it out in the 3rd act. The morse code seemed like a throw-away bit in the "gee, we're bored" scene and with an extra pay-off with Natalie in the door-knock gag.)

The introduction of the new shrink was also well-handled. And Brad Garrett makes a good comic villain. (Although, again, the script broke down a little with him. Since he was willing to kill his squeeze when she became a liability, and was obviously planning to kill his other accomplice from the start, why would he keep Natalie and Monk around? He couldn't afford to have them as living witnesses, he wasn't at all squeamish about killing in general, and they had no information about where the money was. They should have at least established a reason within the plot for him to keep them alive after Monk figured out what he was up to.)

Regards,

Joe
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post #10 of 122
7/19/08 at 5:11pm

Re: "Monk" Season 7 Thread

IMO the show ran out of ideas several years ago which is why we don't watch it much anymore. We did tune in last night to see how the Kamel transition was handled. Agree they handled it fairly decently.

Unfortunately the rest of the show had the typical flaws of the past few seasons: poor writing, little mystery and an unbelievable plot.

I had not realized that this was the last season, but it's probably time to go. At its best, MONK was one of the finest, most clever shows on TV. Unfortunately it became a self-parody of itself making the OCD the main focus rather than integrating it into the storyline.

Rather than bring back Sharona a better gimmick would be for Monk to finally solve Trudy's murder and to find some inner peace.
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post #11 of 122
7/19/08 at 6:36pm

Re: "Monk" Season 7 Thread

I haven't seen anything saying that this is Monk's last season. I know that the show is expensive and when they renewed for Season 7 (16 episodes) they said they'd have to start looking at "the end," but that doesn't mean it actually is. USA will probably find that money somewhere for Season 8.
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post #12 of 122
7/19/08 at 8:22pm

Re: "Monk" Season 7 Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zack Gibbs
I haven't seen anything saying that this is Monk's last season. I know that the show is expensive and when they renewed for Season 7 (16 episodes) they said they'd have to start looking at "the end," but that doesn't mean it actually is. USA will probably find that money somewhere for Season 8.
Zack,

Thanks. I was curious if there was anything definitive at this point.

Well, I absolutely loved the season premiere. I also loved Psych, but I'll discuss that in passing below, and more so in the appropriate thread.

I too was wondering why 'Honest Jake' kept Monk and Natalie alive; sometimes, I just resort to the 'it's in the script' line, like I do with much of Trek.

I thought the camera work -- and especially the marked pause right before we left the early scene with Monk and his new therapist -- was very well done. The relative symmetry in the room, from the paintings to the end tables at the right and left, to the lines in the trim along the back wall and the number of windows, etc. was a sight to behold. It really conveyed to me how the new therapist knew Monk quite well; that, and the mention of the Chopin piece (the Prelude in A major) being one of Kroeger's favorites was a very nice touch. I really appreciated how the length of the pause as we backed away from Monk and Hector A. (I didn't catch the name of his screen character) was such that we the viewer could let it sink in a bit before we moved to the next scene.

The Morse Code angle was wonderful. I loved how Natalie was the only one who really seemed to be able to decode it. Disher? Right. Stottlemeyer? Maybe. Also, I thought that 1) the fireplace might have been one of the places where the money was hidden; and 2) the fireplace being very clean and subsequently being used (in Monk's new house, no less) was going to be the key that something was wrong, as opposed to the Morse Code in billowing smoke giving it away to the Captain and the Dishman.

Incidentally, although I didn't catch the false wall angle as far as the hidden money is concerned, I did finally deduce (with around twenty minutes remaining) that the off-centered light had something to do with the story line and the money.

N.B.: Did anyone who watched Psych catch what Spencer's Dad said about the mold and spores? LOL! I thought I was having deja vu, having just watched Monk.
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post #13 of 122
7/20/08 at 5:50am

Re: "Monk" Season 7 Thread

Obviously I misremembered something I read as stating that this was definitely the final season. I stand corrected. It is not certain, just "likely."

Quote:
USA's Jeff Wachtel tells Variety that Monk is "a hugely significant show" for the cable channel. He also adds, "It's a tentpole for our success, and it's been a successful launching pad," referring to the fact that Monk was used to bring an audience to USA's hit Psych, which will likely be paired with Monk again this summer. The Hollywood Reporter says Monk will once again split its season, with the first half debuting in July, and the second half in January.

Due to how pricey it's become, it's likely Season 7 of Monk will be the last one. Wachtel tells Variety "We have to be thinking of that," and that producer Breckman is "starting to wrap up the show's mythology if this is, in fact, the final season." -- IGN-TV

Yeah, I thought the mold-spore stuff in Psych was a hoot.

Quote:
Unfortunately the rest of the show had the typical flaws of the past few seasons: poor writing, little mystery and an unbelievable plot.

I guess it depends on your expectations. I never watched Monk for the mystery or the plot - both of which have clearly always been secondary (at best) in the eyes of the producers. I watch Monk for the characters. The plots have always been a thin excuse to trot out Monk's quirks and tics and explore his character. As with any show, some episodes are better than others, and some parts or elements of indivdiual episodes are better or worse than others. If you haven't been watching for the past couple of years, how do you know that tonight was "typical". In fact, where the elements you criticize are concerned, it was subpar. Last year's 2-part finale was much better in these areas - as were any number of other episodes you never saw.

But the weaknesss didn't bother me very much because the point of the episode was Monk coming to terms with a traumatic change. As the new shrink correctly said, Monk's upset over the piano playing was a way of displacing his feelings about Dr. Kroger's loss. In a way this whole episode was a way of displacing everybody's feelings - including the auidence's - about the loss of Stanely Kamel and of a favorite character. So it made sense to go with a less-demanding mystery that would be easy for the audience to figure out, and a less complicated plot (because they needed extra time to deal with the fall-out from Kroger's passing.) The mystery was actually so simple that Monk should have probably solved it in act two. The fact that he didn't is a measure of how distracted he was. He just wasn't thinking straight for most of the episode - and that was part of the plot.

As always, YMMV.

Regards,

Joe
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post #14 of 122
7/20/08 at 7:59am
Thread Starter 

Re: "Monk" Season 7 Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ockeghem
I too was wondering why 'Honest Jake' kept Monk and Natalie alive; sometimes, I just resort to the 'it's in the script' line, like I do with much of Trek.
This was definitely one of the weaker mysteries, even by the looser standardds of the later seasons. I think this has to do with the fact that the script was written before Stanley Kamel died; Dr. Kroeger's death gave Adrian greater motivation to move, but it also ate up a lot of screentime with showing Monk's loss and introducing the new pyschiatrist. That pushed the mystery even further into the background than usual.

Which was okay with me; both the actor Stanley Kamel and the character Dr. Kroeger deserved an episode that paused and paid its respects. The most movie scene in a long time came at the very end, with Adrian back in his apartment reading a book in the open window as Chopin wafted through, the camera pulling back to a photo of Dr. Kroeger and then fading into an "in loving memory" title card for Stanley Kamel.
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post #15 of 122
7/20/08 at 12:13pm

Re: "Monk" Season 7 Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Adam Lenhardt
This was definitely one of the weaker mysteries, even by the looser standardds of the later seasons. I think this has to do with the fact that the script was written before Stanley Kamel died; Dr. Kroeger's death gave Adrian greater motivation to move, but it also ate up a lot of screentime with showing Monk's loss and introducing the new pyschiatrist. That pushed the mystery even further into the background than usual.
Adam,

Very well said. I must say, I was a tad confused as to the why with regard to Monk moving. A Chopin work played too loudly? No way. I was perplexed by that for almost the entire hour, until the writers (via the new therapist) reminded the audience that the composer was one of Kroeger's favorites. I wish I had remembered that, but I did not. It made so much more sense when they informed the viewer of that tidbit later in the episode.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Adam Lenhardt
Which was okay with me; both the actor Stanley Kamel and the character Dr. Kroeger deserved an episode that paused and paid its respects. The most movie scene in a long time came at the very end, with Adrian back in his apartment reading a book in the open window as Chopin wafted through, the camera pulling back to a photo of Dr. Kroeger and then fading into an "in loving memory" title card for Stanley Kamel.
Bravo. I too loved this ending. About the only topper for me (and I realize that this may not be pragmatic at this point) would be to end the series with Trudy somehow being found alive and well....
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post #16 of 122
7/20/08 at 3:02pm

Re: "Monk" Season 7 Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ockeghem
Adam,

Very well said. I must say, I was a tad confused as to the why with regard to Monk moving. A Chopin work played too loudly? No way. I was perplexed by that for almost the entire hour, until the writers (via the new therapist) reminded the audience that the composer was one of Kroeger's favorites. I wish I had remembered that, but I did not. It made so much more sense when they informed the viewer of that tidbit later in the episode.

I'm not sure it was ever established the Kroger liked Chopin. We rarely saw Monk in his waiting room and I don't recall ever hearing any "sourced" music playing in those scenes. I suspect that Stanley Kamel was fond of Chopin, perhaps listened to his muisc in his dressing room, and that the writers used that as a plot point as a kind of private tribute that only the cast and crew would get.


Quote:
Bravo. I too loved this ending. About the only topper for me (and I realize that this may not be pragmatic at this point) would be to end the series with Trudy somehow being found alive and well....

I don't think Trudy's return was ever in the cards, but solving her murder certainly is. And it may be that Monk will move on once that happens and find happiness with someone else.

Regards,

Joe
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post #17 of 122
7/20/08 at 8:43pm

Re: "Monk" Season 7 Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joseph DeMartino
I'm not sure it was ever established the Kroger liked Chopin. We rarely saw Monk in his waiting room and I don't recall ever hearing any "sourced" music playing in those scenes. I suspect that Stanley Kamel was fond of Chopin, perhaps listened to his muisc in his dressing room, and that the writers used that as a plot point as a kind of private tribute that only the cast and crew would get.
Joseph,

Thanks. I too wasn't sure if it was ever established either, as I was relying on memory. I think your idea that it had more to do with Kamel than Kroeger is probably spot on.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joseph DeMartino
I don't think Trudy's return was ever in the cards, but solving her murder certainly is. And it may be that Monk will move on once that happens and find happiness with someone else.
Yeah, I know. The episode with the donation of Trudy's eyes kind of nixed it, but still, I'm hopeful that the writers could somehow come up with a fascinating way around that. Much more plausible, however, is that the final mystery (that of who killed Trudy and why) will be solved. I think we may be seeing Dale the Whale again. I must say, IMO the first actor who played Dale the Whale was more fitting than Tim Curry, although I like Curry in other things.
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post #18 of 122
7/20/08 at 9:12pm

Re: "Monk" Season 7 Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ockeghem
... I must say, IMO the first actor who played Dale the Whale was more fitting than Tim Curry, although I like Curry in other things.
I also liked Adam Arkin in the role better than Tim Curry, and both of those actors better than the third actor to portray him (in Season 6), Ray Porter. He seems to keep getting more repulsive, which may be what they want I suppose.

List of Monk characters - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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post #19 of 122
7/20/08 at 9:28pm

Re: "Monk" Season 7 Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by GlennH
I also liked Adam Arkin in the role better than Tim Curry, and both of those actors better than the third actor to portray him (in Season 6), Ray Porter. He seems to keep getting more repulsive, which may be what they want I suppose.

List of Monk characters - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Glenn,

I didn't know there was a third 'Dale the Whale' episode. I'm now looking forward to it. (I have yet to see all of season six.)
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post #20 of 122
7/21/08 at 12:13am

Re: "Monk" Season 7 Thread

I loved the season premiere and how they handled the loss of Dr. Kroger, it was bugging the heck out of me how they were going to do this and it was a good move having his death already happen prior to this episodes events and having him pass from the same health issue that Stanley passed away from.

It gave Adrian ample time to gather himself so we weren't subjected to him becoming a total basket case upon learning of his death. It also saved us from going the "on a very special episode of Monk" route.

On the whole the eposde was great in the usual breezy way although I must say that the whole plot about there being stolen heist money hidden in the walls of the house seemed very familiar to me, probably because I got the entire series of What's Happening!! for my b-day and there was an episode where the gang is tearing apart Raj's house looking for stolen heist money lol.

Natalie looked yummy as usual, she seems to get cuter with each passing season.

Also, they should definitely not bring Trudy back from the grave, it would be too easy an out for Adrian and it would come off as nothing but an enormous cop-out to let him off the hook like that when we've watched him struggle with his problems like he has been all these years.
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post #21 of 122
7/21/08 at 6:30am

Re: "Monk" Season 7 Thread

Quote:
He seems to keep getting more repulsive, which may be what they want I suppose.

I think the actor change was more a matter of price and/or availability than a planned evolution of the character, but I guess you work with what you have. That's the problem with recurring characters, you can never be sure that you're going to be able to get the actor who created a given role the next time you want to use that character. Then the choice is either use a different character in that particular script or cast a different actor to play the part.

Regards,

Joe
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post #22 of 122
7/21/08 at 6:58am

Re: "Monk" Season 7 Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joseph DeMartino
I think the actor change was more a matter of price and/or availability than a planned evolution of the character, but I guess you work with what you have. That's the problem with recurring characters, you can never be sure that you're going to be able to get the actor who created a given role the next time you want to use that character. Then the choice is either use a different character in that particular script or cast a different actor to play the part.
Joseph,

And in my estimation, neither choice rarely works very well. But I also realize it's not always possible to get the actor again, as you stated above. When I saw Curry in the role, I knew something was missing, and for me it detracted from the episode somewhat.

I've been mulling over your comment regarding Ray Porter. Is this the episode with the 'window' in Dale's prison cell? Or is it another episode? I am trying to recall which of those I have seen thus far. I own the first five seasons of Monk on DVD, but I don't know if that includes two or three 'Dale' episodes.
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post #23 of 122
7/21/08 at 7:29am
Thread Starter 

Re: "Monk" Season 7 Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Inspector Hammer!
Also, they should definitely not bring Trudy back from the grave, it would be too easy an out for Adrian and it would come off as nothing but an enormous cop-out to let him off the hook like that when we've watched him struggle with his problems like he has been all these years.
Not to mention how horrible it would be if she WAS alive somewhere. Either she betrayed him and faked her own death which would go against everything we know about her, or someone held her captive against her will purely to torture Monk. Neither is a scenario I would enjoy.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ockeghem
I've been mulling over your comment regarding Ray Porter. Is this the episode with the 'window' in Dale's prison cell? Or is it another episode? I am trying to recall which of those I have seen thus far. I own the first five seasons of Monk on DVD, but I don't know if that includes two or three 'Dale' episodes.
Without spoiling anything, the third Dale the Whale episode is very recent. Definitely not in the first five seasons.
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post #24 of 122
7/21/08 at 7:30am

Re: "Monk" Season 7 Thread

The window subplot was seen in "Mr. Monk Goes to Jail", the S2 season finale. Tim Curry played Dale "The Whale" in that episode, in which Dales gives Monk a clue to Trudy's murder, and tells him the man he's looking for was last seen in New York. The last shot in the episode shows Dale looking out the new window in his cell at a plane (presumably Monk's NY flight) rising up towards cruising altitude.

Ray Porter appears as Dale in the season six finale - about which the less said the better, as you haven't seen it yet.

Regards,

Joe
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post #25 of 122
7/21/08 at 7:34am

Re: "Monk" Season 7 Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Adam Lenhardt
Not to mention how horrible it would be if she WAS alive somewhere. Either she betrayed him and faked her own death which would go against everything we know about her, or someone held her captive against her will purely to torture Monk.

Or she's been living somewhere else under another name, a victim of that ol' TV stand-by, amnesia.

I agree, it would be a total cop-out and undercut everything we've seen in the series. Finally there's the ending I know we won't see - where Monk wakes up one morning, goes to the bathroom to find the shower already running and pulls the curtain back to reveal Trudy. (Or Suzanne Pleshette, if she were still around.)

Joe
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post #26 of 122
7/21/08 at 12:31pm

Re: "Monk" Season 7 Thread

Joe, I think Adam tried to avoid giving even that much spoiler info on the latest Dale sighting, since his appearance was not obvious in that storyline until it happened.
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post #27 of 122
7/22/08 at 5:55am

Re: "Monk" Season 7 Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Adam Lenhardt
Not to mention how horrible it would be if she WAS alive somewhere. Either she betrayed him and faked her own death which would go against everything we know about her, or someone held her captive against her will purely to torture Monk. Neither is a scenario I would enjoy.Without spoiling anything, the third Dale the Whale episode is very recent. Definitely not in the first five seasons.
Adam,

The first thing I thought of was another alternative -- perhaps amnesia -- when I read your post. But I see that Joseph already thought of that before me. (Incidentally, I could not logon to the Board yesterday at all for whatever reason.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joseph DeMartino
The window subplot was seen in "Mr. Monk Goes to Jail", the S2 season finale. Tim Curry played Dale "The Whale" in that episode, in which Dales gives Monk a clue to Trudy's murder, and tells him the man he's looking for was last seen in New York. The last shot in the episode shows Dale looking out the new window in his cell at a plane (presumably Monk's NY flight) rising up towards cruising altitude.
Joseph,

Okay, thanks. I didn't realize it was that early on in the series.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joseph DeMartino
Ray Porter appears as Dale in the season six finale - about which the less said the better, as you haven't seen it yet.
Great. I'm pleased that a fourth actor wasn't brought in to play Dale!
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post #28 of 122
7/22/08 at 6:06am

Re: "Monk" Season 7 Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by GlennH
Joe, I think Adam tried to avoid giving even that much spoiler info on the latest Dale sighting, since his appearance was not obvious in that storyline until it happened.

The problem is I didn't see Adam's post until after I posted mine, since we were composing our messages around the same time. And actually...

Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
...I was expecting Dale to show up in that episode given the subject matter and the fact that the guy Monk tracked down was, in fact, the guy Dale said was involved in Trudy's murder back at the end of season 2 when he sent Monk off to New York.


I couldn't log in to the HTF at all last night. Not sure if I tried from work during the day. Obviously the site was having some problems.

Regards,

Joe
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post #29 of 122
7/22/08 at 6:29am

Re: "Monk" Season 7 Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joseph DeMartino
The problem is I didn't see Adam's post until after I posted mine, since we were composing our messages around the same time. And actually...

Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
...I was expecting Dale to show up in that episode given the subject matter and the fact that the guy Monk tracked down was, in fact, the guy Dale said was involved in Trudy's murder back at the end of season 2 when he sent Monk off to New York.
Joe,

That's good information. Thanks. I am looking forward to another appearance of Dale. I was quite repulsed the first time I saw him, but I realize that his episodes do move the Trudy aspect forward nicely. As someone mentioned (I think), Dale will probably be in the series finale as well.
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post #30 of 122
7/26/08 at 3:20pm

Re: "Monk" Season 7 Thread

Am I the only one who thought the 'irresistable Poison Pawn' would be the wife herself, and that she was somehow involved with the plan?

Also, for him being such a genius, the explanations of how he did it were really lame.
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