Fringe - By J.J. Abrams - Page 14

Re: Fringe - By J.J. Abrams

Hehe...yeah, the coincidence is that JJ, Kurtzman, Orci, Lindeloff and the rest of that 'crew' all talk and work together and they do so much they probably forget they've used certain things in the past. Or they just don't care because if it worked once, it can work again.

Re: Fringe - By J.J. Abrams

This was the best part of the episode for me, and when I enjoyed Walter most.

Re: Fringe - By J.J. Abrams

didn't we already know that Massive Dynamics was associated w/all this crap in the first place? linking Bell to ZFT was just natural.

Re: Fringe - By J.J. Abrams

We didn't "know", we just suspected.

Re: Fringe - By J.J. Abrams

Well, that was satisfying...

Re: Fringe - By J.J. Abrams

You know sometimes, I think JJ Abrams has somehow invaded my subconscious, tapped into *exactly* the sort of things I find awesome, and is making them into television shows and movies

Re: Fringe - By J.J. Abrams

So many Star Trek connections tonight...

Re: Fringe - By J.J. Abrams

What happened after Nina got in the elevator? My DVR switched off the station.

Re: Fringe - By J.J. Abrams

Two men in ski masks approached her and one of them shot her with a silenced pistol.

Re: Fringe - By J.J. Abrams

A little BBQ Harris on the side? He played the obnoxious boss out for revenge so well that I was quite surprised to see that he was part of it all. Very nicely done.

This week's glyph code turned into Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)

Re: Fringe - By J.J. Abrams

Walter: "That could have been one of my records"

Later, Walter was playing Robert Johnson, or at least someone who sounded very much like Robert Johnson.

Re: Fringe - By J.J. Abrams

Awesome revelations and tons of fun in that episode. Great stuff.

Has Walter figured out that Olive is Olivia or not? I can't tell. What he can't figure out is what they were doing or why. He left the manifesto behind, so it will be interesting to see what it holds.

So, I'm guessing that Olivia has the power to shift between alternate realities. yeah...nice power! But, in a war ZFT has described, warriors with such power would be necessary.

Re: Fringe - By J.J. Abrams

I think he knew it was her when he was looking at the tape. He might have even known before, but I don't know.

Re: Fringe - By J.J. Abrams

Does anyone have Walter's exact quote about it probably not being spontaneous combustion? Something about that being a one-time experience, or something along those lines...

Re: Fringe - By J.J. Abrams

"a war is coming" is a motif that is prevalent in both lost and fringe . i wonder if fringe will takeover some of the Lost fans =P

Re: Fringe - By J.J. Abrams

I think Bell's Massive Dynamic is the competitor of Charles Widmore's company, and ZFT is behind the "Shadow of the Statue" group. (Seriously, though, how much fun would a Fringe/Lost crossover be? Can't you just imagine Hurley and Walter teaming up? )

Regards,

Joe

Re: Fringe - By J.J. Abrams

lol, time travel back to the 70s and find out that both william bell and our dr. walter bishop are the FOUNDERS of the dharma initiative from thousands of years ago in a parallel universe and Spock has come back to save them

Re: Fringe - By J.J. Abrams

This morning I glanced at the time my DVR thought Fringe was going to start tonight and saw 9:05 PM. I have no idea whether that is correct or not, but anyway folks should be on the alert to it started late and ending late. (The DVR guide only gives it as ending at 10 PM, though.)

Re: Fringe - By J.J. Abrams

We guessed the reveal right at the very begining when there was a reference to the attack.. and the coin. It just made sense, given what else was going on. Still, a great payoff.

Now, you have to wonder how often Nimoy will actually appear going forward.

Re: Fringe - By J.J. Abrams

The reveal of Peter's identity gave me goose flesh. Though the alternate universe concept is very familiar by now, the personal nature of Walter's manipulation of it is creepier than anything I've seen before. Maybe it's that the idea of kidnapping and raising a child as your own is in itself reprehensible, but to kidnap the doppelganger to replace the one that died just...seems all kinds of wrong.

Re: Fringe - By J.J. Abrams

On the contrary, the reveal shows us how much Walter loved / loves Peter.

- Walter.

Re: Fringe - By J.J. Abrams

So, the White House was destroyed instead of the WTC in the world Bell has decided to inhabit. I first thought she was going to see the towers when she looked out the window, but I tumbled to the fact that she was in one of them before they made it clear.

The girl who led Liv into Bell's office was niiice.

I found the Peter reveal to be very sad. I didn't think about the possibility that Walter was kidnapping him from another Walter, but maybe that reality's Peter's parents were dead. Who knows. In any case, a very moving reveal.

There was a lot that was Stephen Kingish in this. He writes a lot about areas where the wall between realities is thin, and I'm surpised he hasn't written about a grieving father taking a child from another reality. There might actually be something along those lines in regards to Jake in the Dark Tower series. The beach house seemed like a classic King setting, and the lake scene reminded me of the setting for the walk-ins discussion in one of the Tower books.

Re: Fringe - By J.J. Abrams

In a way he did, of course, in Pet Semetary. I doubt it is a theme he'd want to revisit. I know it was a hard book for him to write, precisely because the death of a child is every parent's (and grandparent's) worst nightmare.

Well, that was one of the best season finales I've seen this year. Lots of information revealed and plot points explained or clarified, while a whole new set of questions is raised. This is how serialized TV shows should work. Fringe is turning out to be the show that X-Files wanted to be, but never quite could. It can do cool monster of the week shows, but more often than not they turn out to be individual tiles that make up a mosaic. It has a continuing conspiracy/arc, but one that has clearly been thought-out in advance, instead of being improvised week-to-week, which makes for more coherent story-telling. (Granted we've only had one season, but I think the way they tied past events together last night shows that the producers have a handle on things.)

So - if the man we saw last night is really "our" William Bell, where is the "Other" Bell? And if he isn't, where is "our" Bell?

Walter is a much more sympathetic character, now. His madness seems to have resulted from a combination of the loss of "his" Peter, the effects of crossing between worlds and guilt over what he had done. (I wonder if the death of Walter's wife was payback - cosmic or literal - for his taking of Peter.)

Wonder how Peter is going to handle all this when he (inevitably) finds out.

Olivia has spontaneously "travelled" - but not the way Jones tried to. It seems more like her mind occupied her doppelganger's body, always at moments when their actions and situations were closely parallell. Or maybe she physically swapped places with her. (I lean towards the mental swap, given her similar psychic connection to the killer earlier in the season.) Does that mean her doppelganger is "here" whenever Olivia is "there"?

Somebody please tell me this show has already been picked up for next year!

Regards,

Joe

Re: Fringe - By J.J. Abrams

This show has already been picked up for next year.
FOX renews Fringe for a full second season

It was a great finale. Remember the scene at the end of the second episode? Was that Walter with Peter on the slab from the other reality?

It could be that the Bell in the other reality was killed in some accident and this one is acting as both now.

We saw Olivia in the other reality in the Visions episode for a few moments and she was experiencing both realities at times. I think they can somehow share. I guess we'll find out later.

As far as the Fringe glyphs this time they were Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)

Re: Fringe - By J.J. Abrams

In all fairness, I don't think The X-Files ever really wanted to be serialized in the way that 24, Lost or even Fringe is. As much as I love The X-Files and think it's a superior show to Fringe (although if you just want to compare the first season of each show, Fringe blows The X-Files out of the water), I do think Fringe has one upped The X-Files by having monster-of-the-week episodes that have elements of the show's mythology and almost all of the episodes can still be easily understood by a new viewer.

Re: Fringe - By J.J. Abrams

Wow, talk about your all around great mind-fucks lol.

HTF is truly a site populated with gifted minds if you guys were able to follow and make sense out of what happened, I had to come here and read what you were saying to piece it all together and I still don't think I grasp it fully.

I get the whole opening a porhole to an alternate reality thing, saw that in an episode of Transformers when I was a kid where a herd of Woolie Mammoths came through a hole that looked a lot like the one we saw here lol, and I get what happened with Walter and Peter...tremendously sad.

The part i'm actually really confused about is what happened to Olivia in the elevator at the end? I know she traveled to a dimension where the WTC is still standing (that made my stomach sink seeing that and made me gasp out loud) but how did she get there?

Re: Fringe - By J.J. Abrams

Oh, that's definitely clear, but it's still wrong. Grief and love have motivated all kinds of wrongful actions.

Re: Fringe - By J.J. Abrams

William Bell obviously has found a way to create a reasonably stable gateway between worlds. One end of the path (in our world) is in an elevator in that hotel, the other in an elevator in the Trade Center. But it still appears that you have to carefully coordinate exact location and timing, and have the euipment working properly in order to pull a transfer off. (Hence Nina's non-appearance, stalling Olivia in the restaurant and then the phone call directing her to the elevator.)

The meeting with Bell was arranged (probably with some difficulty) as Olivia's reward for stopping Jones. Presumably at some point in her elevator ride either hidden machinery in her car or equipment on Bell's world locked in on her and shifted her to the alternate universe. Where she materialized in an elevator car in the WTC.

BTW, I agree about the woman who met Olivia and escorted her to Bell's office. We need to see a lot more of her.

Regards,

Joe

Re: Fringe - By J.J. Abrams

Ah, okay, thanks, Joseph.

And just to confirm whether i'm clear on Walter and Peter, the Peter in this world died when he was seven and so Walter snatched Peter away from the other Walter in the alternate universe, brought him back here to our world and raised him?

One has to wonder what effect that had on the other Walter since he lives in a universe where Peter disappeared.

Re: Fringe - By J.J. Abrams

Just an incredible finale. I re-watched it immediately.

I love the questions you bring up, Joe, because they build upon what we just saw!

Is that our Bell or the 'other' Bell? The same question must be asked about Walter and his wife. I can't fathom that Walter would just TAKE Peter away from his alter-self. Perhaps that Walter is dead? Perhaps that Bell is dead? Perhaps when one crosses over he/she assumes control? I don't have any answers, only questions. But, I'm sure this is an area we will see explored.

You delve further when you ask about Walter's wife's death as karmic payback. What IS the price for crossing over?

And, yes, Olivia clearly moves between universes in a much more 'organic' way. I think this shows the difference between Bell's philosophies and the other contingent. Jones and others attempt to bend the rules using technology. Bell and Walter seem to have attempted to alter people in order that they may cross over 'organically'.

As for the Observer (seriously, when is Marvel going to file suit?) - he may not be from either world. And, much like Marvel's Watcher, his comments make it sound like he is not supposed to be interfering.

Love this show! And, yes, it is back next year...