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Star Trek The Next Generation appreciation thread - Page 5

post #121 of 235
7/25/08 at 5:59pm

Re: Star Trek The Next Generation appreciation thread

I love "Q Who" and not just because it introduces the Borg. I think it's a high point of the second season.
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post #122 of 235
7/25/08 at 9:01pm

Re: Star Trek The Next Generation appreciation thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bryan^H
I love "Q Who" and not just because it introduces the Borg. I think it's a high point of the second season.
Agreed. A fabulous episode, and one which sent chills up my spine the first couple of times I saw it. I actually have two all-time favorites from that season (and one of them isn't Measure Of a Man, although I do like that one a whole lot). I love Q Who and Unnatural Selection.
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post #123 of 235
11/16/08 at 10:34pm

Re: Star Trek The Next Generation appreciation thread

I just watched "The Drumhead" from season 4.


Astonishing. Probably the most well written episode I have seen yet.
It truly shows what a great captain Picard is.

Think I'll watch it again tomorrow
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post #124 of 235
11/27/08 at 8:52pm

Re: Star Trek The Next Generation appreciation thread

Over the past week or so, I've watched some excellent episodes of TNG. Some of these have included A Matter of Honor, Sins of the Father, Emissary, Reunion, and Redemption (pts. 1 and 2). We also watched The Sword of Kahless (DS9). And tonight, we watched Generations. The only episode missing from the theme was The Sons of Mogh. It was a good way for some of our children to see the inner workings of the Klingons and the Klingon Empire, the Duras family, and to see the concept of Worf's discommondation (and restoration) a bit more clearly. It's been some wonderful viewing.
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post #125 of 235
11/28/08 at 4:34am

Re: Star Trek The Next Generation appreciation thread

You might also watch The Sons of Mogh (DS9) and Firstborn (TNG). Great theme you have going. I also thought the complex Klingon society shown on TNG and DS9 should have been shown in the films, but all we ever got in the movies were cartoon Klingons. And if you want to see the story that started in Reunion through to its conclusion, you have to see The Dogs of War (DS9) and the events leading up to it.
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post #126 of 235
11/28/08 at 7:35am

Re: Star Trek The Next Generation appreciation thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam Favate
You might also watch The Sons of Mogh (DS9) and Firstborn (TNG). Great theme you have going. I also thought the complex Klingon society shown on TNG and DS9 should have been shown in the films, but all we ever got in the movies were cartoon Klingons. And if you want to see the story that started in Reunion through to its conclusion, you have to see The Dogs of War (DS9) and the events leading up to it.
Sam,

Yes, I mentioned The Sons of Mogh above. That's one of my favorites, and one I watched around three weeks ago. The Dogs of War is a good choice, as is Firstborn. In Firstborn, I never saw the conclusion of that one coming the first time I saw it! And speaking of Firstborn, I love the work of James Sloyan in Trek. He has played several roles and has been in at least three Trek series.

James Sloyan - Memory Alpha, the Star Trek Wiki

The Duras/Romulan angle in Generations was a nice sub-plot to that film, I thought. I liked the concept of 'trilithium.' And it's great how the Duras sisters' ship was destroyed, and how they got caught up in the Nexus, regressed in age, and ended up on the earth-like planet in Miri.

Just kidding about the last part, of course.
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post #127 of 235
11/30/08 at 5:00am

Re: Star Trek The Next Generation appreciation thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ockeghem
And speaking of Firstborn, I love the work of James Sloyan in Trek. He has played several roles and has been in at least three Trek series.

Agreed. My favorite part of his is Admiral Jarok from The Defector, one of the best episodes of any series, IMO. You can also see a very young Sloyan in an old episode of Buck Rogers, circa 1979.

Quote:
The Duras/Romulan angle in Generations was a nice sub-plot to that film, I thought. I liked the concept of 'trilithium.' And it's great how the Duras sisters' ship was destroyed, and how they got caught up in the Nexus, regressed in age, and ended up on the earth-like planet in Miri.

It's more fun if you consider that, in Starship Mine, the thieves were stealing trilithium -- perhaps to sell to the Duras sisters for a plot that was already underway.
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post #128 of 235
11/30/08 at 5:47am

Re: Star Trek The Next Generation appreciation thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam Favate
Agreed. My favorite part of his is Admiral Jarok from The Defector, one of the best episodes of any series, IMO.
Sam,

I share this opinion as well. When I first saw the episode, I had no idea he was an Admiral (Worf's hintful remarks notwithstanding). A great, great episode.
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post #129 of 235
11/30/08 at 9:03am
Thread Starter 

Re: Star Trek The Next Generation appreciation thread

Me three! The Jarok episode and The Enemy and those episodes including Tomalak are some of the really good Romulan episodes. I particularly enjoyed The Enemy and Picard's talking to Tomalak to lower their weapons as they had an opportunity to make something of the situation rather then mutual destruction.

Starship Mine is always a favorite too!
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post #130 of 235
11/30/08 at 9:37am

Re: Star Trek The Next Generation appreciation thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nelson Au
Me three! The Jarok episode and The Enemy and those episodes including Tomalak are some of the really good Romulan episodes. I particularly enjoyed The Enemy and Picard's talking to Tomalak to lower their weapons as they had an opportunity to make something of the situation rather then mutual destruction.
Nelson,

Tomalok played his role exceedingly well, didn't he? His responses to Picard, while well written, were conveyed by Katsulas with such conviction and measured passion (even for a Romulan). I think he was probably my favorite Romulan from TNG, although I also liked the Romulan commander in Face of the Enemy.
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post #131 of 235
11/30/08 at 9:49am
Thread Starter 

Re: Star Trek The Next Generation appreciation thread

Yes Scott, poor Carolyn Seymour's character as the Romulan Commander was good. Troi kept provoking and poking at her and I felt it wasn't deserved. But she was playing her part as the Tal Shiar.

Seymour played 2 Romulan Commanders who got the shaft, the other was in Contagion. In researching for this reply, I didn't realize she played such a wonderfully positive character in the TNG episode First Contact as Mirasta Yale. And she was in Voyager too as Mrs. Templeton.

I might have to watch The Enemy again soon!
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post #132 of 235
12/1/08 at 6:27am

Re: Star Trek The Next Generation appreciation thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nelson Au
Yes Scott, poor Carolyn Seymour's character as the Romulan Commander was good. Troi kept provoking and poking at her and I felt it wasn't deserved. But she was playing her part as the Tal Shiar.
Nelson,

I felt badly for the Romulan Commander in that episode. She was being shafted, yet because of the Tal Shiar, she really had little choice. On a positive note, I think it was one of Troi's better roles.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nelson Au
Seymour played 2 Romulan Commanders who got the shaft, the other was in Contagion. In researching for this reply, I didn't realize she played such a wonderfully positive character in the TNG episode First Contact as Mirasta Yale. And she was in Voyager too as Mrs. Templeton.
I remembered that she played Mrs. Templeton, but had forgotten about her role in Contagion. Nice tidbit there.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nelson Au
I might have to watch The Enemy again soon!
That episode was an excellent vehicle for Geordi. Or was 'The Enemy' shorthand for Face of the Enemy?
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post #133 of 235
12/1/08 at 9:13am
Thread Starter 

Re: Star Trek The Next Generation appreciation thread

I meant The Enemy, Scott. I did play it yesterday! And I got halfway into The Defector, but had to stop it.
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post #134 of 235
12/1/08 at 9:28am

Re: Star Trek The Next Generation appreciation thread

Those Romulan episodes from the first four seasons or so created a running storyline for TNG that was never adequately followed up (and certainly not by Nemesis). The Romulans were almost the main adversaries on that show, as they seemed to pop up pretty regularly from the end of season 1 through season 4 (or into season 5 with the Unification arc).

I guess the producers thought the Borg were sexier.
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post #135 of 235
12/1/08 at 6:10pm

Re: Star Trek The Next Generation appreciation thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam Favate
Those Romulan episodes from the first four seasons or so created a running storyline for TNG that was never adequately followed up (and certainly not by Nemesis). The Romulans were almost the main adversaries on that show, as they seemed to pop up pretty regularly from the end of season 1 through season 4 (or into season 5 with the Unification arc).
Sam,

I suppose I'm one of the few that actually liked Nemesis. I thought the action was quite good, and that the Romulan angle was intriguing. I also loved the concept of Thelaron radiation (and thought that the disintegration effect was done quite well). I also find the score to be quite ambitious. There are a few segments (particularly when Picard and Data are on the Scimitar) where the trombones are very melodic (almost in trademark Klingon fashion ) and where they are stretched (range-wise) quite nicely. And I really enjoy the opening overture (especially with regard to the percussion) as we are brought inside of the Romulan Senate.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam Favate
I guess the producers thought the Borg were sexier.
Speaking of the Borg, I saw Drone (VOY) for the first time ever last night. I though that that episode had 'teeth.' I really enjoyed it. 'One' certainly was not Hugh's brother.

Okay, back to TNG.
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post #136 of 235
12/2/08 at 4:50pm
Thread Starter 

Re: Star Trek The Next Generation appreciation thread

As I recall, Drone was a pretty good one!

I'm watching Contagion now. Looking back, seems kind of simplistic today to simply re-start the Enterprise as the solution!
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post #137 of 235
12/2/08 at 6:51pm

Re: Star Trek The Next Generation appreciation thread

Ock,

Even with it's flaws, I also think Nemesis had its moments. Heck, I liked it better than Insurrection and The Final Frontier. Could'a done without B-4, though!

Even Wrath of Khan ain't perfect (Khan remembering Chekov)!
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post #138 of 235
12/2/08 at 8:39pm

Re: Star Trek The Next Generation appreciation thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ric Easton
Ock,

Even with it's flaws, I also think Nemesis had its moments. Heck, I liked it better than Insurrection and The Final Frontier. Could'a done without B-4, though!

Even Wrath of Khan ain't perfect (Khan remembering Chekov)!
Ric,

Hey, it's great to see another fan of the film. It's not my favorite, but as you say, it has its moments. Even Star Trek V: The Final Frontier has its moments. I tend to find things in just about any film (and in most music) that are worth appreciating and discussing.
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post #139 of 235
12/3/08 at 4:33am

Re: Star Trek The Next Generation appreciation thread

I agree that Final Frontier has its moments, as did Generations (another film I didn't like). I can't agree, however, that Nemesis did. I thought everything about the film - especially the feel of the movie - was wrong. Even my wife, who was introduced to TNG a few years back and who loved all of DS9, watched Nemesis with me and was yelling at the screen, saying "Oh come on!"

We recently watched TMP, Khan, and Search, and enjoyed them all. We're making our way through all the films in anticipation of the Abrams movie. I hopeful that we'll get at least a glimpse of the TNG era in the film, as rumored.
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post #140 of 235
12/3/08 at 8:40am

Re: Star Trek The Next Generation appreciation thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam Favate
I agree that Final Frontier has its moments, as did Generations (another film I didn't like). I can't agree, however, that Nemesis did. I thought everything about the film - especially the feel of the movie - was wrong. Even my wife, who was introduced to TNG a few years back and who loved all of DS9, watched Nemesis with me and was yelling at the screen, saying "Oh come on!"

We recently watched TMP, Khan, and Search, and enjoyed them all. We're making our way through all the films in anticipation of the Abrams movie. I hopeful that we'll get at least a glimpse of the TNG era in the film, as rumored.
Sam,

As you are making your way through all of the films, I would appreciate it if you would watch Nemesis at least twice (and preferably thrice), just for good measure.








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post #141 of 235
12/3/08 at 9:04am

Re: Star Trek The Next Generation appreciation thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ockeghem
Sam,

As you are making your way through all of the films, I would appreciate it if you would watch Nemesis at least twice (and preferably thrice), just for good measure.

Your just all kinds of sick and twisted, arent you Scott?

If they had filmed what was written, Nemesis might have been better. Some of the deleted scenes i ask myself why! This movie needs all the help it can get.
I also dislike Trek actors being given script approval, and the chance to write it better than the writers. B4 is a good example of what an actor does to dumb down the story, just cause said actor, wants to do something new.

And Pickard had red hair when he was young, he wasnt bald...so why would the clone guy be any different?
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post #142 of 235
12/3/08 at 9:19am

Re: Star Trek The Next Generation appreciation thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ockeghem
As you are making your way through all of the films, I would appreciate it if you would watch Nemesis at least twice (and preferably thrice), just for good measure.

Actually, we just watched Nemesis a few months ago, and that was when my wife was yelling back to the screen. We're planning to watch through the sixth movie right now (we watched 7-10 in the past year, with Nemesis literally only about 4 months ago).

I've now seen Nemesis at least four times. For me, it gets worse each time, I'm sorry to say. Scott, I really did want to like it.
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post #143 of 235
12/3/08 at 9:29am

Re: Star Trek The Next Generation appreciation thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam Favate
Actually, we just watched Nemesis a few months ago, and that was when my wife was yelling back to the screen. We're planning to watch through the sixth movie right now (we watched 7-10 in the past year, with Nemesis literally only about 4 months ago).

I've now seen Nemesis at least four times. For me, it gets worse each time, I'm sorry to say. Scott, I really did want to like it.
Sam,

I understand. I don't like all of the films equally either. It just happens that Nemesis had a lot to offer, from my perspective.
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post #144 of 235
12/4/08 at 6:39pm

Re: Star Trek The Next Generation appreciation thread

People say one of the reasons "Nemesis" was bad was because it was ripping off "Wrath of Khan", but not well. I agree because I think its villain was trying to be a really threatening enemy specifically focused on the captain, but he wasn't as convincing as Khan since, unlike Khan, he and the captain didn't really have much of a history. Does anyone else think it would have worked better if they ripped off "Wrath of Khan" in a different way by bringing back a villain from the series that did have a history with the captain? My pick would be Q. I think they should have brought him back and called it "Star Trek: The Whimsy of Q". Every episode he was in was great, so isn't it reasonable to imagine a big screen appearance would have been good too? They just needed to find the right story. As for how to explain him to the "uninitiated", I imagine a scene of starfleet staff receiving a briefing about him and his history with the enterprise (as alluded to by Sisko on DS9).
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post #145 of 235
12/4/08 at 6:50pm

Re: Star Trek The Next Generation appreciation thread

I Could never understand why Q was'nt in a movie, later I read somewhere that De Lancie has some sort of falling out with the Trek Producers after his appearances on Voyager.
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post #146 of 235
12/4/08 at 7:17pm
Thread Starter 

Re: Star Trek The Next Generation appreciation thread

Well, First Contact worked well with the general audience because they did use a villain that had a history and were pretty menacing. A buddy of mine didn't like it cause it left him cold. Not sure why.

Not so sure Q is a good idea. He lost his teeth somewhat towards the end and they had him in All Good Things which was a really good send-off.

And why does a Star Trek film need to have a bad guy. I really liked simpler mystery stories too such as TOS Errand of Mercy, where mankind learned humility. Probably won't break any box office numbers I know. But the mentality seems that each of these movies has to be an event film. That is most unfortunate.
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post #147 of 235
12/4/08 at 7:30pm

Re: Star Trek The Next Generation appreciation thread

It's true that Q Lost his Menace after the Episode Q Who, they lost me somewhat after having the Next episode after Q Who for Q Be a comedy, I would've thought Picard would be Pissed at Q For Killing many on his Crew and almost destrying his ship. But anyhow Q Could've been used as a fulcrum for propelling them into the movies Villian, not the villian so much
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post #148 of 235
12/4/08 at 8:33pm

Re: Star Trek The Next Generation appreciation thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nelson Au
And why does a Star Trek film need to have a bad guy. I really liked simpler mystery stories too such as TOS Errand of Mercy, where mankind learned humility. Probably won't break any box office numbers I know. But the mentality seems that each of these movies has to be an event film. That is most unfortunate.
Nelson,

I agree with this. Another episode with humility was Devil In the Dark. The arrogance of humanity could well be the makings of a wonderful story.
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post #149 of 235
12/4/08 at 9:53pm

Re: Star Trek The Next Generation appreciation thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ockeghem
The arrogance of humanity could well be the makings of a wonderful story.

Yeah, when I mention Q I don't mean he has to be a traditional villain who antagonizes/fights with them. I imagined him doing something like testing them, as he would on the show. Yes, he became more comedic over time, but in his first few appearances on the show, he was always posing some moral or philosophical dilemma for the crew. Whether it was with Q or not, what I think the last movie really needed was something more true to the spirit of the show. The story that the movie went with was just too far removed from the show...odd since the writer was supposedly a fan of it.
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post #150 of 235
12/5/08 at 4:48am

Re: Star Trek The Next Generation appreciation thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ockeghem
I agree with this. Another episode with humility was Devil In the Dark. The arrogance of humanity could well be the makings of a wonderful story.

I agree with this, but I very much doubt Rick Berman or Paramount saw it that way. They wanted a traditional, good vs. evil space opera, but what they got, repeatedly, was cliched and just bad. The only decent TNG movie, First Contact, deviated from this formula - and even then, it changed the original concept by introducing a Borg Queen, something that was not part of the original Borg mythology. And they did so to have a central "villian," someone for the audience to hiss at.

I grew very tired of hearing Rick Berman promote every TNG film as "the best since Khan." In every promotion, he would say "we have the best villian since Khan" and "this movie is the most like Khan." He said it so much that it became simply not believable. He couldn't have believed it either; he was just telling audiences what he thought they wanted to hear to get butts in the seats.

The concept behind the show is about so much more than militarism, battles or good and evil. I always thought it was about human understanding, accomplishment and discovery. Maybe the studio doesn't think those things make a blockbuster movie, but they worked well enough to launch a TV show 40+ years ago that still endures.
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