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How The West Was Won in CINERAMA with no seams!

post #1 of 22
2/17/08 at 7:05am
Thread Starter 
Check this out. Looks like the new DVD of How The West Was Won will not have the CINERAMA 3-strip seams:

HP Labs - Movie makeover : HP and Warner Bros. give old movies new life
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post #2 of 22
2/17/08 at 7:30am

Re: How The West Was Won in CINERAMA with no seams!

Neat!
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post #3 of 22
2/17/08 at 7:32am

Re: How The West Was Won in CINERAMA with no seams!

The examples shown in that article are interesting. The top is obviously from a reduction print, but the removal of the seams is impressive, although I could still see the remnants of one seam between the left and center panels in the upper left sky (a difficult prospect in any event).
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post #4 of 22
2/17/08 at 7:48am

Re: How The West Was Won in CINERAMA with no seams!

I've never minded the seams since I saw the original film in a real Cinerama theater decades ago, and they came with the territory. Looks like the movie will be a completely new experience without them, and I'm eager to see it.
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post #5 of 22
2/17/08 at 8:56am

Re: How The West Was Won in CINERAMA with no seams!

That should be interesting to see. I only hope the color looks better than what I saw in the corrected stills. I have seen this film twice in Cinerama and the uncorrected version is closer in color to what it's supposed to be.
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post #6 of 22
2/17/08 at 9:00am

Re: How The West Was Won in CINERAMA with no seams!

Quote:
Originally Posted by RolandL
Check this out. Looks like the new DVD of How The West Was Won will not have the CINERAMA 3-strip seams:

HP Labs - Movie makeover : HP and Warner Bros. give old movies new life
I'm glad they've figured out how to correct the the seam problems inherent in 3 camera Cinerama productions, but what happened to the blue skies? A color corrected 70mm print derived from these new electronic files should look sensational projected onto a deeply curved Cinerama screen.
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post #7 of 22
2/17/08 at 9:04am

Re: How The West Was Won in CINERAMA with no seams!

It would be interesting if Disney used this technique to someday release a disc of Circlevision 360 features, using multi-angle for side or rear views. I would probably pick up such a disc - perhaps release it as a theme-park exclusive or something.

And just as an aside, anybody else think the still from 'King Kong' at the link from the original post looks better pre-processing?
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post #8 of 22
2/17/08 at 10:28am

Re: How The West Was Won in CINERAMA with no seams!

The processed image from How The West Was Won has been horizontally squeezed. It looks like one of those old films where an anamorphic print was televised without correction for the squeeze. I'd rather look at seams if the byproduct of the processing is an incorrect aspect ratio.

The King Kong image looks flatter and less dimensional after processing, at least to me. It also appears to be a little less detailed, but maybe that is just a matter of perception.
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post #9 of 22
2/17/08 at 10:34am

Re: How The West Was Won in CINERAMA with no seams!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Edwin-S
The processed image from How The West Was Won has been horizontally squeezed. It looks like one of those old films where an anamorphic print was televised without correction for the squeeze. I'd rather look at seams if the byproduct of the processing is an incorrect aspect ratio.

The King Kong image looks flatter and less dimensional after processing, at least to me. It also appears to be a little less detailed, but maybe that is just a matter of perception.
I'm going to wait until I see the finish product before passing judgement as stills can be deceiving to me. However, I noticed a difference in the blue skies between the two stills of HTWWW. The restored still has less pronounced blue sky so the question is whether the original still had ovesatuated blue sky or not? I hope this isn't going to be another argument like we had on "The Searchers".
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post #10 of 22
2/17/08 at 10:41am

Re: How The West Was Won in CINERAMA with no seams!

I too thought that the King Kong sample looked a bit worse after processing. Darn "grain reduction"...
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post #11 of 22
2/17/08 at 10:44am

Re: How The West Was Won in CINERAMA with no seams!

They mention in the article that the automated process does not work as well with older b&w grainy films. Maybe that King Kong picture is supposed to show when the process removes too much.
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post #12 of 22
2/17/08 at 11:29am
Thread Starter 

Re: How The West Was Won in CINERAMA with no seams!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Edwin-S
The processed image from How The West Was Won has been horizontally squeezed. It looks like one of those old films where an anamorphic print was televised without correction for the squeeze. I'd rather look at seams if the byproduct of the processing is an incorrect aspect ratio.

It's just the opposite. The top frame looks like it came from the old DVD which was from a 35mm scope print. It was stretched too much. The bottom frame looks normal.

Check out this page on my web site:

New Page 1
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post #13 of 22
2/17/08 at 11:44am

Re: How The West Was Won in CINERAMA with no seams!

I agree the CleanKong looks bad.

I think their HTWWW looks fantastic. Those commenting on the sky and squeezing, I wouldn't read into any of that, its just an example of the process. The entire picture is actually less saturated, personally I think it looks much better and far more realistic.
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post #14 of 22
2/17/08 at 11:45am

Re: How The West Was Won in CINERAMA with no seams!

Looks like you are right. Or has the top image been cropped on the sides? Robert Crawford was right. One still can be deceiving and is not really indicative of anything. Either way, I got the wrong interpretation from those images.

Unfortunately, I have never seen a theatrical presentation of the film, so I can't say if the blue sky in the top image is accurate to the original film. The Blue sky in the processed image looks closer to the natural color of sky, at least to me.
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post #15 of 22
2/17/08 at 12:08pm

Re: How The West Was Won in CINERAMA with no seams!

FYI:
This article is from May 2006
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post #16 of 22
2/17/08 at 12:24pm

Re: How The West Was Won in CINERAMA with no seams!

The image from King Kong also looks like it was compressed to make it load quickly on the website. Jaggies galore.
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post #17 of 22
2/17/08 at 1:25pm

Re: How The West Was Won in CINERAMA with no seams!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Edwin-S
The processed image from How The West Was Won has been horizontally squeezed. It looks like one of those old films where an anamorphic print was televised without correction for the squeeze. I'd rather look at seams if the byproduct of the processing is an incorrect aspect ratio.
.

I don't think it's horizontally squeezed. You have to remember that these images were not meant to be seen flat. They were supposed to be seen on a deeply curved screen which would tend to negate the apparent distortion when seen flat.

Doug
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post #18 of 22
2/17/08 at 1:29pm

Re: How The West Was Won in CINERAMA with no seams!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott Kriefall
I too thought that the King Kong sample looked a bit worse after processing. Darn "grain reduction"...


I have mixed feelings about this. While I'm not normally a big fan of grain reduction, in the case of King Kong, because the elements that are available are so far removed for the camera original, I can kind of see doing some grain reduction to try and get it to look like it did in its original release. I mean Kong was not meant to be seen with golf ball sized grain.

Doug
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post #19 of 22
2/17/08 at 1:47pm

Re: How The West Was Won in CINERAMA with no seams!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Craig_Ehr
It would be interesting if Disney used this technique to someday release a disc of Circlevision 360 features, using multi-angle for side or rear views. I would probably pick up such a disc - perhaps release it as a theme-park exclusive or something.

And just as an aside, anybody else think the still from 'King Kong' at the link from the original post looks better pre-processing?


That's exactly what I thought. Degraining took out all the detail. Don't they realize that this movie was made in the early 30's?
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post #20 of 22
2/17/08 at 1:51pm

Re: How The West Was Won in CINERAMA with no seams!

In the end, arguing about King Kong is a moot point. The DVD release looks spectacular, and I'm sure any BD release Warner might give us down the road will be just as impressive.
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post #21 of 22
2/17/08 at 2:10pm

Re: How The West Was Won in CINERAMA with no seams!

Color correction happens AFTER seam removal.
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post #22 of 22
2/17/08 at 2:23pm

Re: How The West Was Won in CINERAMA with no seams!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brandon Conway
In the end, arguing about King Kong is a moot point. The DVD release looks spectacular, and I'm sure any BD release Warner might give us down the road will be just as impressive.

I agree the dvd looks fantastic. However knowing how far away from the original negative this film is, I'm not sure how much more detail is really there. An HD release might not show very much improvement.

Doug
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