Universal at CES - Page 7

Re: Universal at CES

Some European HD-Dvd releases from France and Germany feature Dts-MA including the upcoming 'T2' Ultimate ( 7.1) in March

~M~

Re: Universal at CES

BD+ was cracked about 2 weeks after the first disc was released, or so it was reported.

And its not as if DVDs have NO protection. You need specialized software than has been deemed illegal to sell in the U.S. to copy them. I would say that at this point most people don't have the ability to make a copy of a DVD, unlike CDs where anyone who has Windows media player can.

The point being however that a PCM is much easier to copy and manipulate.

Doug

Re: Universal at CES

You don't need to break the DRM to "tap" the PCM that's coming out of an analogue channel.
But then again: you don't need to break anything to tap the signal coming out of a receiver/decoder and going to the end-amps either.


Cees

Re: Universal at CES

Thats true of course. It wouldn't be a bit for bit copy but I doubt anyone would be able to tell the difference.

Doug

Re: Universal at CES

There's plenty of freeware out there. If you have the internet, you can find it.

Re: Universal at CES

Yes.

And he developed a preference for Blu-ray * AFTER * collecting and reviewing more than 500 BD and HD DVDs (roughly 50:50 split) and comparing them carefully on his 1080p projector and AV system.

Crawdaddy, my comments below are not in response to your balanced post, but I want to nip this in the bud for other readers who are knee-jerk-wired to label any pro-BD remark as inherently "biased":

Despite what some HD DVD enthusasts claim, Dan's conclusions that BD delivers (on average) superior picture and sound versus HD DVD is not "bias" because Dan only formed these conclusions after a very careful analysis of actual software which he spent over a year reviewing. Dan took a scientific approach: he objectively observed both formats and was actually surprised to find that he *did* see (and hear) improvements with BD despite what many HD DVD-proponent sites would want you to believe.

He goes into great detail explaining all of this and the basis for his position in the editorials on his site. I don't think you're saying this, but I know many folks who refuse to believe that anyone who prefers BD is objective, and fanboyism blocks any particular reader from accepting the objectivity of Dan's views that's not because Dan hasn't taken the time to come to his conclusions the right way, and he's certainly taken the time to explain them in an objective and dispassionate manner. Some people cannot respect a different point of view and that's their own limitations.

Dan's done his homework and come to his conslusions in probably the most empirically solid manner of anyone on the net. He openly admits that he now has developed a preference for Blu-ray because he's seen and heard the improvements over HD DVD (on average) that it delivers. He certainly didn't start out that way, and was staunchly "format neutral" until he began to see AV-quality trends in software releases that unambiguously were in BD's favor.


Agreed Ron.

Re: Universal at CES

PCM hasn't presented Sony or Disney with any problem thus far; they seem pretty comfortable with providing it for even top-tier releases. But if any studio did view linear PCM as a security loop-hole, then those studios could use TrueHD or DTS-HD MA knowing that hardware is steadily catching up with full lossless extraction for both codecs.

BTW there are many European HD DVD discs that use DTS-HD MA as well as some PCM titles. The idea that HD DVD is a "VC-1 and Dolby" format is a US-centric thing (not sure why we see more AVC and DTS/PCM on European HD DVDs than in the US but that's the way it is for some reason).

Re: Universal at CES

How did this thread turn from Universal at CES to David yet again extolling the virtues of BD?

Re: Universal at CES

It started when someone said that all of BD's advantages were on paper, and that lossless-audio wasn't something important that HDM should provide consumers.

If folks would steer clear of posting false statements like that, then there would be nothing to counter with correct information.

Whether one personally *cares* about the advantages of BD or the fidelity of losselss audio is their own business, and their personal opinion (just fine). But to state declaratively that those advantages and fidelity increases don't exist is not only false, but runs counter to the objetive of an AV community that should place emphasis on HT transparency and education about how to acheive it.

Naturally those of us who do value that increased potential for fidelity (especially lossless audio) are hopefuly that Universal and Paramount will strive to provide higher-quality product when they finally do release software on BD.

Re: Universal at CES

David,
Some posts are not worth commenting on and if anybody is suggesting that lossless-audio isn't important on HDM then they simply haven't bought into the HTF's mission statement, but that doesn't mean we have to hijack this thread to combat such a comment.





Crawdaddy

Re: Universal at CES

Hey, secretly I wanted a pat on the back from you when I bought a PS3...

I'm secretly still waiting. Even a high five would be sweet.

Re: Universal at CES

You're the one that brought Dan Remar's name into this discussion and mentioned his unbiased report on HDM. So maybe it's best that we leave him out of this discussion all together.






Crawdaddy

Re: Universal at CES

Maybe the topic has run out? I think we have 3 or 4 threads that are all starting to look so much alike, everyone is forgetting what the topic at had was? What do i know, i just read the stuff and chime in when i feel a stir.

Re: Universal at CES

Oh yeah, a "high-5" to Averry for picking up a PS3! Be sure to apply any updates (pretty easy over the ethernet port) as not all factory-shipped players have the latest and greatest.


Probably bcs we're in a holding-pattern until something is announced or leaked with reasonable credibility.

Re: Universal at CES

Oh yeah, Wireless, the first thing I did.


I'm just really really pissed because I can't get my laptop to correctly share anything. My Xbox 360 stopped finding it as a source as well. I dont' know what to do to fix it. I've opened all sharing, and done everything I possibly can think of or find.


Everything used to work fine, now it doesn't.

Re: Universal at CES

Sorry if this was mentioned, I didnt see it...

But were any titles mentioned at the show by Universal,Paramount or Dreamworks?

Re: Universal at CES

Nope.


Which is a bummer, because had the HD-DVD camp been rolling on would most certainly would have gained some sweet Catalogs out of them.


Now we get nothing.

Re: Universal at CES

David if you care to re-read my earlier post you will see the following :

"Unfortunately , on paper is where many of them have remained " and not

" (It started when someone said that ) all of BD's advantages were on paper, and that lossless-audio wasn't something important that HDM should provide consumers." as you have now said twice. Two little words , many not all .

I also notice you didnt bother to address my other points about Region Coding
and Drm which could be a very slippery slope in the future .

FWIW I listen to Dvd-As in an all digital 24/96 system , my Cds upsampled to 88.2 , Dvds also at 24/96 and True HD via 5.1 analogue outs again into a digital system . I do appreciate great sound quality but am not willing at the moment to forgive other to me, major ' issues' such as above in order to achieve it from BD . The point is HD-Dvd can provide Lossless Dolby True just as Bd and I agree with you it was a big mistake not to include it on most releases from the outset.

On the original topic of 'Universal at Ces ', I think all these companies are taking time out to assess options which makes sense . Its such apity that they didnt do it 2 years ago so could now spend our time arguing the toss over the quality of all those Lossless soundtracks and 1080p transfers

And now back to our regular programming

~M~

Re: Universal at CES

I fully agree Rick. That certain "limit" has now being reached and there has been silent on the news-front, so we´re kinda back on the old topics (PS3, capacity, audio formats, bitrates, Blu-ray vs HD DVD.. Soon probably there´ll be a new "Transformers"-thread..

IMO, I guess it´s best to wait for the confirmed news from the Universal/Paramount-DW.. I´m a bit tired of these speculations and "secret" rumors.

Re: Universal at CES

That was actually my point, TrueHD and DTS are more difficult to make direct copies of.

We are actually starting to see more HD DVD titles with AVC codecs being used. The Star Trek set for instance, but clearly VC-1 is dominant with HD DVD. Possibly because it is more efficient.

Doug

Re: Universal at CES

I never said that high quality audio wasn't important. I just really don't care in what format that audio comes. If they can provide lossy audio that is indistinguishable from the master, who cares if it's not lossless?

I also never said that blu-ray didn't have the potential to be a superior format, it's just that so far its superiority hasn't shown itself to any measurable degree.

Doug

Re: Universal at CES

Early on MS was providing compression labor for VC-1 free of charge for WB. I know this was one reason why WB embraced VC-1 versus AVC. I'm not sure if that courtesy was extended to other studios as well. We certainly saw Paramount experiement with a variety of video CODECS on their discs (at least their BDs). I'll also be curious to see if WB continues to use VC-1 as their primary codec or if down the road we see shifts to other codecs due to cost, quality, or other issues that may change.

Re: Universal at CES

I don't know that that's true or not. Uni has been relatively low key with ALL of their catalog releases so I wouldn't take their silence at CES as any kind of omen one way or the other. I hate making comments about Universal due to my position here, and the truth is I dont know a thing more than anyone else... But people, including me, have read so much into this situation based upon their own biases and hopes that we're off into outer space with some of these prognostications.