Bones season 3 thread - Page 4

Re: Bones season 3 thread

Through the last fifteen minutes, I kept expecting it to turn out that Gormegon was a demon who possessed Zach. Then I remembered, that's the other David Boreanaz show.

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Loved the opening, very saddened by the ending.

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Agreed.

WTF?! While this episode completely took me by surprise (which is a rarity), I'm not only saddened by the ending, but angry as well.

Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)


Again, WTF?!

Re: Bones season 3 thread

Next season is going to feel really weird, not sure how the cast chemistry will hold up.

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I gotta say, that teaser surprised the hell out of me.

Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)

But, the scene in the bathtub was great, even if it was quite dumb to read such an old comic that close to water. But, it was interesting seeing Boreanaz reading Green Lantern, since he and Nathan Fillion are my top two choices to play the part in a movie. (Of course, he did voice GL in New Frontier.)

Re: Bones season 3 thread

When Eric Millegan was interviewed about the season ender on the TV Guide site he said no one was leaving the show, and since tonight's episode was able to confirm everything he said originally without giving too much away (one hurt and near death, himself hospitalized, Gormogon being a regular member of the cast) I believe he's staying on and will likely be rehabilitated. After all, he's not going to prison for this.

Re: Bones season 3 thread

But only one person was hurt in this episode (Booth's injuries last week couldn't be that serious considering he was up and running around), and Gormogon wasn't a series regular.

As much as I hate the twist, bringing Zach back as a regular character would only make the problem worse. The first season established that the people working with Booth require a background check, and even though Brennan was able to shoo the investigator away, it'd be completely unbelievable if the FBI let a man who aided a serial killer -- who helped the killer breach security -- work on cases. (Although the episode with the background checks is interesting because the investigator asked Zach what he'd do if someone presented him with an irrefutable logical argument for betraying the country, and he had to think it over for a moment before saying he'd have to consult with Dr. Brennan.)

They could get away with Millegan as an occasional guest star, but the only way he could return as a series regular is if this last episode turned out to be Booth's fevered dream as he's being operated on. And this is one case where I think "It was all a dream" would be an acceptable out.

Re: Bones season 3 thread

Eric Millegan posted this on a Bones forum:

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Called it.

The execution could have been better, and I half suspect that if the writers had had more time they would have spent it on Zack being more shaken by his experience in Iraq and planted more clues over the season, but it made for an hour of pretty great TV. I also found myself wondering if Hodgins had figured it out and was hitting the morphine button to keep Zack from incriminating himself, as opposed to just as a red herring that made him look guilty.

I'm sure one set of bones will be found at whatever institution he's locked up at next year, and I wonder if we'll see another of Brennan's grad students promoted to his position. That'll be a new and interesting way to shake the dynamics up, I think.

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See, and that's why the ending rang hollow for me. There's no way (barring brainwashing) that Zach wouldn't have at least somehow communicated with Brennan about it - hypothetical, word play, etc. The Gormogon case had already started before the "Master" approached Zach. And we're supposed to believe that in 3 months he could convince Zach to go against Brennan, his mentor and the one person he respected the most without even somehow talking to her about it?

And I agree with Jason - if the writers had more time I suspect they would tie it in with Zach's time in Iraq.

I liked the addition of Cam; I think they'll have a much harder time replacing Zach- he gave the team chemistry a very professional yet naive touch.

Oh, and my wife wanted me to add that she's very upset with this, as well.

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I don't buy it. The whole Zach as the apprentice doesn't ring true to me. I would have found it a lot more palatable if they explained it as Zach being approached by him, playing along by going undercover in order to verify that he was indeed the Gormagon, and perhaps getting sucked in too deeply. Or perhaps some danger to Brennan was being held over his head which forced him to go along until skeleton was stolen.

Speaking of which, was it really explained how the Gormagon got into the Jeffersonian and took the skeleton? I thought they were going with the theory that someone already inside took it during the security blackout. Was there really enough time for someone to get in, take it, and get it out?

Neil

Re: Bones season 3 thread

We could debate the senselessness of this whole thing until season 4 arrives, but none of it will fully make sense because the strike completely derailed the storyline and Millegan and his character ultimately ended up the victim of that. None of these things make sense or add up because they simply don't. We aren't missing clues or anything. That's what makes this whole thing a letdown on all levels.

Some shows picked up where they left off no problem, while some shows like this, stumbled badly. They should have preserved the integrity of the storylines by having it play out through season 4 rather than struggling to wrap it all up as a season 3 finale. Big mistake on their part.

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I'd hardly call Bones stumbling upon its return. Yeah, the overall arc was hurt, but at least the finale was still enjoyable, and makes sense on some levels. And, the individual episodes were decent.

Now, compare it to something like Smallville, where they had one, maybe two decent episodes out of the final five, with a finale that was such a mess that I'm not even sure what the point of the show is anymore.

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Give Bones credit where it's due, though - they did a pretty damn good job in the finale of creating the environment where we were ready to believe that series regulars were suspects, which is no mean feat in a series in its third year that isn't really a serial most of the time. I do think Zach was the most logical person for it to be - he is the one who could be convinced that this is justifiable without recoiling emotionally, and I'm sure that when we revisit him sometime next season, we'll get information on how Iraq affected him much more than he let on.

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So you think they fired an actor and destroyed a regular character because they were in a hurry and couldn't think of anything better? Do you assume Gormagon was supposed to be someone else? Who? You think that is more likely than the notion that they planned this from the start of the season and simply had fewer episodes in which to excute the plan?

And how exactly were they supposed to "set this up" with Zach without utterly destroying the shock of the finale? Any clues would have either given away the game or at least made him as obvious a candidate as Sweets and Hodgins. Given Zach's social ineptitude, weak personality and massive ego (yes, despite his weakness he has one - just watch him when someone suggests he might be wrong about something) make him a good candidate for the weaker partner role in a folie a deux - just as Booth's boss suggested. And the problem with someone like Zach is that he'd fall for something like pure logic. Logic is a tool for solving problems, not a system for finding truth. Logic ultimately depends on the original premise. Peferct logic that starts from a bad premise will get you a perfectly wrong, although perfectly logical, answer. Zach was vulnerable because he lacks common sense. He lacks the thing that would enable most of us to say, when confronted with an elaborate and self-consistent conspiracy theory, "Your logic is impeccable - but you're still full of crap."



Zach fell for Gormagon's for the same reason lots of otherwise intelligent people fall for conspiracy theories barely more plausible than Gorgmagon - because it satisfies an emotional need, confirms opinions and beliefs already held, and because the "proof" is elegant and purely, in terms of logic, complete.

What people like Zach forget is that logic has nothing to do with fact or truth.

"All men are mortal"
"Socrates is a man"
"Socrates is mortal"

That is both perfect logic and perfectly true. But consider this:

"All cats drive Segways"
"Chip is a cat"
"Chip drives a Segway"

That is also perfect logic. We use two known "facts" to derive a third fact. That Chip is not, in fact, a cat and that cats do not really drive Segways, is irrelavent to the issue as a matter of logic. Zach fell for the logic. He was looking for cats on Segways.

That's why Temperance was able to turn him even more quickly and decisively than Gormagon had - she was able to show him the tiny bit of illogical humanity in his make-up that refused to let Hodgins, who is infinitely more dispensible than The Apprentice from Gormagon's point of view, be the one caught by the explosion. That would have been a far more sensible plan than doing it himself, even with safeguards, since it would have left Zach able to monitor the situation and ensure the skeleton theft came off in case something unexpected happened. But he couldn't do that to his friend.

Regards,

Joe

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The whole episode reeked of Deus ex Machina to me.

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No, but the entire arc of his character was ruined. It just leaves so many (on account of this thread alone) unanswered questions and they never made use of Zack/Millegan's potential. He never got the opportunity to be explored at all because of the strike. Even before it, he was far too underused.


No I don't think it's someone else, but certainly they faltered when playing this out. They didn't even play out the 'Gravedigger' storyline. The only significant arc this show had time for was the Max Keenan story, which was resolved with satisfaction and only an issue of morality is left unresolved on purpose - a guilty man got off. It was a great arc.

This Gormogon idea was great and making it Zack was a good way to devastate the team, but because nothing else was explored with Zack it felt so last-minute, so 'how do we get rid of this guy we never use on the show to begin with and make it interesting?' I'm not saying that was their idea, but it certainly felt that way.

It's not their fault the strike screwed up their original plans, but instead of going for one big shock finale, they could have let it play out as originally intended, only shifting the time frame into season 4.

By the way, angry much Joe? Jeez..

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isn't this similar to season1's head guy (goodman?) that got canned and replaced? if u are not doing much good, u get replaced. watch out
angela! =P

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Not angry at all. I asked some questions. No anger on this side of the conversation. Your mileage may vary.

Regards,

Joe

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what did yoda say? fear, leads to anger, anger leads to hate and hate leads to the dark side .

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While I understand the producers didn't want to tip their hand too soon, they went too far to the unbelievable. Again, there was no explaination or setup on how Zach could work against Brennan, who was the most important person to him, besides his family. And we know from the first season's Christmas episode, that he had a strong feeling about family.

Instead, we're given a minute of Zach saying if they only understood, they'd be proud of him. Then we're given the Star Trek logic bomb where Kirk, in the form of Brennan, causes the computer, Zach, to break down due to inconsistent logic.

And while it's true we really haven't been given Zach's idea on life, and its value, he would have known that both Brennan and Booth valued life and I can't see him coming up with some argument that would satisfy them, let alone would cause him to think that they'd approve him murdering someone involved in a case they were working on, while hiding it from them. That's the real shame. I could have accepted the storyline if it had just been Zach creating the dentures and setting up lab explosion so that Gormogon/Master could get his skeleton. That alone would have been enough to have him leave the show. It's the murdering of the lobbyist that was too much, and too much out of character.

Now, as far as whether or not Zach was an underused character, I dunno. I'd classified him as the 3rd most important character of the main cast. I'd rank them like this, most important to least:

1. Brennan - because the show's name is 'Bones'. The cases revolve around her work

2. Booth - He's the action to Brennan's mind. He's the emotion and life to Brennan's logic and science. The show couldn't survive without these 2.

3. Zach - While Brennan is becoming more of a person, Zach is still naive and quirky. He brings a lot of humor through his mannerisms and reactions. It's the dynamic he creates while interacting with other members of the group that'll be very hard to replace.

4. Angela - Brennan's best friend, and the person Brennan can talk to when it concerns Booth.

5. Hodgins - Adds quirkiness, but works best when interacting with Zach. Given that he's hooked up with Angela, he's safe, but overall, it'd be easier to replace Hodgins than Zach.

6. Cam - Her character being around makes more sense than Dr. Goodman, and she works well in the group (plus she's pretty ), but again, the team lead would be an easier character to replace.

7. Dr. Sweets - He could go any minute. While I don't dislike the character, I have noticed that he's been taking up observations that may have come from Booth's intuitiveness, and I don't think that's necessary. He helps some with the humor, but honestly, him being reduced to guest star wouldn't hurt the show at all.

I just think they'll have a hard time creating a comparable dynamic within the team with a new character. Bones is a show with a nice blend of drama and humor you don't find a lot.

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My initial reaction was "Are you f-ing kidding me???" and over the past few days, this season finale was just too premature, and needed more gestation for its impact to really work for the audience. As is, it reads like a Madlibs version of the Bones season finale, where the writers just pulled out names and motivations out of a hat and let it ride. Boooo!

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didn't they arrest som1 for the murder? did i miss something?

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Yeah, it goes totally against Zach's personality -- he's the runt of the litter who is always trying to be the best, because that's the only way he can get approval. Brennan and Booth are parental figures that he's always trying to impress, though Booth hardly ever acknowledges him, and Hodgins is a brother that he has to compete with.

Now the writers could've done it so Zach's experiences in Iraq broke him, and Booth's general lack of approval forced him to turn to Gormagon as an alternate father-figure, and that could've worked. But that's now what we got.


In the first season there's an episode involving the remains of a young child, and Zach has trouble coping with it until Brennan tells him he has to just look at them as bones, nothing more.

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I rest my case.

I just don't understand why people are so quick to defend this whole thing because the ending had shock value.

It's not that it was flat-out bad or anything like that, it was just that it could have been much more. What's wrong with that?

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I'm getting the feeling that most people here are not defending the ending. I really think that with some extra dialog giving a better explanation of Zach's actions we would have thought it more plausible. The way they explained it just didn't ring true.

Neil

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Ah, thank you, I'd forgotten that. Although, as a counterpoint, there was a couple of times where Zach showed a lack of compassion (one involved the inflating an Asian woman's head like a balloon) and Cam getting slightly repulsed.

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Wasn't Hodgins acting the same way about the head balloon?

I think the point of that was to prove that as weird as Zack is, he's still a guy.

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when will next season debut? october?

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The season premiere is supposed to be August 27, with a trip to the UK for B&B.

In fact, the episode is called "Yanks In The U.K."