THE BOWERY BOYS on DVD: continuing discussion of Warner's eventual release plans (UPDATE 4/19:... - Page 25

I just hope they get value packed in a boxset like the Harlow one. If they try to float these at the $17-$20 price it's going to tank.

I also hope the Warner Archive will release these like they have released the Tim Holt features, which have been a big hit since we've gotten 30 films in 3 volumes within a year. Since the WA is also releasing 'B' serial features like "The Saint" and "Torchy Blane," It would be wise do do this in a chronological order, starting with The East Side Kids and moving up to the Bowery Boys features. The 'B' programmer length of these features make them ideal for this sort of packaging.

I'm hoping they release the 48 films in 4 sets of 12 films each but I can't see them releasing them anything less than 6 sets of 8 films each.

Let me be frank here. MPI has just released THE COMPLETE HONEYMOONERS LOST EPISODES, all 107 shows in a big "official" DVD set. Vivendi has released THE ESSENTIAL LAUREL AND HARDY, with all of their 58 talkies in an "official" DVD set. In both cases, the source elements are far from "pristine" and yet these releases are wonderful and welcomes to their fans.

So -- if those two smaller companies can release a full set of so-so prints (107 films for HONEYMOONERS, and 58 films for L&H) and survive, why in the world can't multi-billion-dollar Warner release an "official" DVD set of 48 Bowery Boys movies in their present condition (most of which are better quality than the Honeymooners kinescopes and the rough L&H shorts)? There is no reason that I can be satisfied with as a customer.

Maybe it's time for Warner to pass these films over to MPI or Vivendi. Or they can hire me!

Thats just it Joe, Warners doesn't out source their material and they have obviously seen classic movies and tv shows increasingly decline in sales on DVD over the past couple of years so they only see the archive as a profitable option for these eras now with few exceptions. As pointed out earlier by someone else if films by Harlow, Bette Davis, Erroll Flynn, Bogart, Gable and many others are only being released by Warner in the Archive then the writing is on the wall that the Bowery Boys are destined for the Archives. They definately will not sell as well as Laurel and Hardy and probably not as well as the Honeymooners.
I definately agree with your point that the prints they already have are good enough to release though as we have both pointed out earlier.

I find it ridiculous that selling product only to those searching for it is more profitable then putting product into stores that can be seen and potentially purchased by millions...

The few stores that are left don't want it...and Best Buy, Walmart, etc., never really did. The "Golden Age" catalog releases only extended to a few blockbuster titles at the biggest stores, the same ones being recycled on Blu-ray. Everything else just sat there, with a few happy exceptions. Maybe the Bowery Boys would be one. But the studios and stores have evolved (or devolved, depending on your POV) to where we are now.

Unfortunately, from what this Canuck can tell based on online searches, even the new Laurel & Hardy ten disc set seems to be only available through online ordering (and if you reside outside of the U.S, it is rather cost prohibitive, with duties; etc.). Based on this knowledge, for The Bowery Boys, the Warner Archives is probably the best scenario that anyone can hope for!

But again, Randy, we're getting into the whole "won't sell", "will sell", "won't sell as well as -- ", etc. etc, as if there is an exact science to this.. or as if Warner can't afford to have a Bowery Boys set out there that doesn't sell as much as STAR WARS will for Fox! I don't mean to follow up with my usual old response, but it's the only thing that fits --- the major studios with millions and billions in their bank accounts can afford to hit a few singles now and then instead of Home Runs all the time, and emerge none the worse for wear if a release like the Bowery Boys just makes a small dent, even. But every time there's a discussion, of course we get the "but it won't sell!", or "it can't sell better than X, Y, and Z" pitch. Meanwhile, tiny companies wih not even one tenth the money that Warner can afford to piss away, still seem capable of issuing titles either on par with the Bowery Boys, or even LESS popular!

It doesn't matter -- or at least it SHOULDN'T matter -- whether the Bowery Boys sell as much as Laurel and Hardy, or less. For what it's worth, I'd agree with you that L&H will sell more than the BB would. But I would not agree with you on those LOST HONEYMOONERS --- I personally love the Lost Honeymooners episodes, but I seem to be in a minority and not many fans are exactly swarming to buy MPI's new set... (AMAZON only has 16 measley reviews posted, and the set's been out over a month!). Still, that doesn't stop MPI from putting them out, and they're not bankrupt.

Joe I understand what your saying but in regards to you're comparison of what small companies are releasing and selling think of it this way from a business standpoint. Small companies have small goals and large companies have large goals. So a title that only does small sales is perfectly acceptible to them because they need lots of small sales to equal their goals. Large companies have larger revenue goals so they can't keep releasing things with small payoffs and using time and resources to do it when they have a larger goals to meet and stock holders to answer to.
This is the same for any type of business and I think it applies perfectly here.

Unfortunately the library Warner controls is too big. If it had been divided among smaller companies, we probably would have seen more of it come out on retail DVD.

 

I'm not so sure of that. Retail DVD is dead unless it is a mass classic (GWTW) or new release.  The Disney Universal and Sony libraries are not anywhere near the size of Warners, MGM or Lionsgate, yet both Universal and Sony have gone the MOD route.  It is just that the first tier films are out and bought.  A lot second tier films were released also, it's just that the third and above tier films that are left and as it seems through the Twilight experiment, not much more than 3000 people want these films.  Before anyone gets upset, I am not using the word tier as an indication of quality of the film or stars, just the desire of masses to want to own it.  I am happy to now have Duchess of Idaho, but I am realistic to know that I am in the small number and not one of many thousands.  I wonder how Night Flight sold, since that was the last standard DVD of a classic that Warners released.

 

I agree that retail DVD is dead today. My point was more that if the Warner library had been divided up among smaller companies, maybe in the period from 2000-2009 we would have had more stuff released on traditional DVD, like the Bowery Boys, Andy Handy, etc.

Depending on how the division is, I think that goes without saying. Take Sherlock Holmes, for example. It's basically one of the few titles worth a crap that MPI owns. Consequently, it's already available on Blu, as opposed to a million other things. If Warner owned it, Blu folks would be waiting years for it to come out. Not so much because Warner is slow, just because it wouldn't be a top title for them.

An Archive DVD-R release of the Bowery Boys films  is a non-starter for me.  Others may be ok with such a release and that's fine; each consumer will have to make their own decisions.

 

Surely the BB, Andy Hardy, Jean Harlow, etc films have enough commercial viability left in them to warrant a nicer release than WA.  The fact that there are so few such releases coming from the majors these days would benefit these titles since the same level of competition isn't there.  If Vivendi can release a critically acclaimed 10 disc set of L&H material, WHV can do the same with some of the higher profile unreleased titles in their catalog.   

 

 

In addition to the previously mentioned sets, now there is a Lon Chaney made-to-order set. Frankly, lets just take the available Bowery Boys prints & put them out there! (Either made-to-order AND/OR retail, I don't care, just get them out there.) The 41 movies with Leo have only one print that isn't so great (Mr. Hex), but even that one isn't really that bad. The last seven with Stanley Clements are hit or miss as there's some really good ones & others that don't seem so great (but those could be simply my fifth-hand copies, estimated of course). Still, I believe all 48 have better quality than some of the released East Side Kids movies (Spooks Run Wild with Bela Lugosi comes to mind).

I've been occasionally popping in on this thread to see what the current status is & have posted only once or twice. I think Warners needs to see more regulars jumping on the band wagon & I'm going to make a concerted effort to try & stick around this time. I want to see these movies come out while those who got to see them in the theaters are still around as they're no longer spring chickens (my dad would've been about 4 when Live Wires was release so even he's getting up there & I doubt he remembers or would remember seeing that first movie). Wouldn't it be nice for the original fans to have a chance to see these movies in a nice package to pass along to the younger generations?

I agree. This is getting ridiculous. They can release the "Mexican Spitfire" series, but not the Bowery Boys?? Does anybody realy believe that Leon Errol is actually more popular to today's audiences than Leo Gorcey or Huntz Hall? No disrespect to the series or Mr. Errol, of course. I do think that if the BB films are released, it will be through Warner Archives. And at this point, I'll take anything!

I think they want to give The Bowery Boys a little bit more respect than the Mexican Spitfire, thus they are taking their time and searching for quality elements. Plus, the elements on Mexican Spitfire didn't require the attention the Bowery Boys do. Apples and oranges really, with no comment on the relative merit of either series.

They've been using the "we're searching for quality elements" excuse for too long now. Search much longer and the core age audience is dead.

I watched Naughty Marietta, an Archive release, over the weekend, and while the picture was just fine, there were plenty of places where dust and dirt and some damage were plainly visible. I remember for years during the chats we were told the MacDonald-Eddy movies needed a lot of work before they'd be released, and now they're just showing up in the Archives without any obvious work having been done on them. I see no reason why The Bowery Boys couldn't just be released now in the same way.

Not an excuse. Looking good for TV broadcasts, and looking good for DVD are two different things.

Which reminds me, funny we've not seen the next Charlie Chan box yet.

There was an update on those a few months ago, indicating that restoration of the remaining Chans was ongoing, giving the likely release in late 2012 or early 2013.
Edited by JoHud - 11/29/11 at 12:02pm

The people who have been waiting for this have mostly been satisfied with the TV broadcasts. It's going to have to be a phenomenal set at a decent price to get me to bite at this time since I now have broadcast quality versions in chronological order.

Oh,that is sweet!

Variety or Hollywood Reporter?

 

Box Office Magazine.  I was looking up some information and ran across it and had to share.  I just love this stuff.
 

 

Awesome find! Thanks for sharing.