What is the problem w/ Warner and Blu-Ray??

Re: What is the problem w/ Warner and Blu-Ray??

A better title would be:
"What is the problem w/Blu-Ray??"
Warner is comented to both formats. Just BD is holding them up to point WB can want no longer and is only releases titles on the format that works for them at this time.

Re: What is the problem w/ Warner and Blu-Ray??

Extras. The bluray players and/or software development tools do not currently support Warner's "In Movie Experience". So, warner has three choices.

It can release a bareboned bluray disc, at the same premium price as the HD-DVD version, essentially ripping BD-owners off.
It can release a bareboned bluray disc at a slightly lower price and run the risk of encouraging bluray player sales, "because bluray discs are cheaper"

--or--

it can release fully featured discs when they are ready.

warner's blood diamond plans

Re: What is the problem w/ Warner and Blu-Ray??

BD-J seems to be the holdup on Batman Begins, The Matrix and a few others with IME.

As for the non-IME titles. Don't know. HD-DVD owners seem generally disinterested in Warners classic films (hence the ultra low sales of titles like Casablanca, Forbidden Planet, etc) so Warner may feel the demand for Classics on Blu-ray would be just as low as it is on HD-DVD so they don't even bother to release them.

Re: What is the problem w/ Warner and Blu-Ray??

I think to be honest, Warner prefers HD-DVD, not one single thing that has occured differently between their titles that were released on both formats has went better for Blu-Ray(save maybe PCM on Departed, which vs TrueHD is debatable)

up until the last minute they weren't even supporting blu-ray

honestly I wish the studios would pick a side, like Universal or Fox

I sure hope they don't feel that way about classics , Getaway, Dirty Dozen, etc. are all so awesome that words barely describe them

-Gary

Re: What is the problem w/ Warner and Blu-Ray??

Gary,

Agreed on the classics. We need more, but it really seems unlikely for the time being due to poor sales. I'm doing my part! Can't wait for Adventures of Robin Hood. Should be here any day now!

But as far as companies picking a side - Universal has definitely picked a side and I own a lot of their titles. But as much as Fox pretends to have picked a side, until they actually begin releasing titles again, they're on the fence in my mind. Product means you're down with the format. Promises are full of horse puckey. I wish all this willy-nilly nonsense would end already. Hell, even releasing those titles that are supposedly coming in Europe would be something to go on.

Cheers,

Jason

Re: What is the problem w/ Warner and Blu-Ray??

oh I agree about Fox, they are without a doubt the biggest joke

their prices, encodings, features, everything so far have been total BS, how or why they think that someone is going to pay 39.99$ retail for one of their titles that has no special features, DTS Master(that we can't even fully enjoy) and mpeg2 video at 18mpbs is totally beyond me

-Gary

Re: What is the problem w/ Warner and Blu-Ray??

That is a pretty ridiculous and unfounded comment to make about HD DVD owners. How little you know.

Re: What is the problem w/ Warner and Blu-Ray??

Tom, you would hate to even see the AVS forum on the mentioning of classics on HD-DVD, if Jim was talking about the crowd there, then sadly he would be right

-Gary

Re: What is the problem w/ Warner and Blu-Ray??

You're taking his comment too personally, and too literally I might add.

Taken as a whole, HD market has shown little interest in classic titles. It isn't unfounded, the sales figures bear this out. Does this mean that every HD DVD fan feels this way? No. I'm pretty sure that wasn't what Jim was trying to say either. Also, it doesn't mean every BD fan feels that way either.

However, at least Warner gave HD DVD supporters the chance to buy titles like The Adventures of Robin Hood, Excalibur, etc. on HD DVD. Unfortunately, it appears they took those HD DVD results and chose for the BD fans. That is why Jim is saying that, as a whole, HD DVD fans have little interest in classic titles at this time.

I bought the aforementioned titles on HD DVD, and, frankly, I would buy them again on BD just to try and drum up more support in sales figures.

Re: What is the problem w/ Warner and Blu-Ray??

From what I have been reading, Fox stopped pressing when the discovery was made that the copy protection was being broken. Now that blu-ray's 2nd layer of copy protection has been approved, I have a feeling within days we will have a new announcement of titles from Fox. In Home Media Magazine, Fox home-vod president Mike Dunn has repeatedly stated in stories about the 2nd layer that this is what Fox has been waiting for to protect their library.

Re: What is the problem w/ Warner and Blu-Ray??

Much more reasonable the way you stated it, as apposed to the asinine comment that HD DVD owners don't have any interest in Warner classics. As far as taking it literally, I can only respond to what was written.

Re: What is the problem w/ Warner and Blu-Ray??

Actually, part of my jumping to HD DVD last summer was Warner's love and care for those classics and how they had excellent SDs of Casablanca, Adventures Of Robin Hood, Singin' In The Rain, My Fair Lady, Dial M For Murder and many more. Warner has always struck a good balance of new releases with classics. Seeing Casablanca & Robin Hood in HD DVD projected is quite a treat.

Too bad about them not selling great. I bought em on sd and are buying them on HD DVD. My only thought to Warner is to give us more.

Re: What is the problem w/ Warner and Blu-Ray??

-Gary,
I think to be honest, you should offer proof "WB prefers HD-DVD".
Like what title has WB released on HD DVD, that it has no plans to release on BD?
And, what feature did WB release on HD DVD, that WB refused to release on BD?
Something along those lines would go a lot further than just saying: "I think to be honest". Cause I think: "to be honest", one must mention the titles that WB had planned to release on HD DVD, yet because its waiting for BD to get its act together, has not. Which has been totally unfair to fans of HD DVD, while catering to BD's constant: "wait till next month". Just to be prefectly honest about it.

And talk about being "prefectly honest"; not one BD player could play any of this stuff anyway!

Here is what Don Eklund, Executive Vice President of Advanced Technologies at Sony said when asked:
Q: Like BD-Java authoring?
A: "Yes. So they have an expectation like, "Okay, but June of next year (EDitEDbyED: last month), we can go add that." We knew that was the kiss of death. We knew that the minute we said that to any studio, they would not waste their time putting such content on the disc.

That's because of two issues. One, if the function won't play in many players, why spend the money to produce it? Two, if a consumer looks at the back of a Blu-ray disc that says it has all these features, then takes it home and puts it in their player and can't access the features, they'll likely complain or return it. Why have that grief? So [on Blu-ray] the studios are just putting all those features aside until later.
It is very strange, from that point of view. Not mandating a little bit of code and not building the platform right from day one comes back to haunt you later. You add things piecemeal, and it creates all these problems."

Now how is that WB's fault, honestly???

Re: What is the problem w/ Warner and Blu-Ray??

How little I know?! The sales numbers for Warners Classics on HD-DVD speak for themselves. Can't blame it on the PS3 crowd cause most of Warners classics and the lowest selling ones are only available on HD-DVD. nuff said.


First of all WTF is your problem? and why get so emotional?
I'm an HD-DVD owner who snatched up Warners classic offerings but given the sales data it looks like I'm a rare breed along with a few others who post here.

Seriously WTF is your problem?

Second of all, brush up on your reading comprehension and take off your rosey red sunglasses. Here's exactly what I wrote:


Care to provide some facts like sales data to support your opposing argument that Warners classic titles are extremely popular among HD-DVD owners? The sales data sure doesn't show it or are we just suposed to take your say so?

Can't really lump in the Blu-ray owners as not being interested in classic titles because most of the premium Warner classics are HD-DVD only along with a small handfull from Universal so there no sales data to support the argument. If Lawrence of Arabia sells poorly when/if it gets released later this year then there would be a valid argument.


Exactly Paul.

Re: What is the problem w/ Warner and Blu-Ray??

Understood, Thomas. But sometimes our fingers and brains aren't alway in-sync, and we don't type what we mean. It is happened to me on more than one occassion. You are correct in that only Jim can tell us what he really meant (add it looks like he just did while I was posting this), but he seems like a good guy so I thought I would give him the benefit of the doubt for now.

That said, it would probably be best if everyone took it down a notch. Afterall, it is only entertainment. And damn good entertainment at that sometimes, as I really enjoyed watching a classic (Rio Bravo) on Blu-ray Disc last night. Hint, hint, Warner Bros.

Re: What is the problem w/ Warner and Blu-Ray??

Thanks Paul. I'm rather blunt at times and I'm also not shy about criticizing anything HD/BD around here if it doesn't smell right to me whether it be the bait and switch tactics of a few BDA studio's or the shitty sales of classics on HD-DVD.

The only agenda I have is that I want desirable titles available on both HD formats and I mostly call it the way I see it which probably pisses off a lot of the staunch Blu-ray only supporters as much as the staunch HD-DVD supporters.

Anyhow how bout that Rio Bravo? Can't wait for those Blade Runner and Kubrick set announcements!

Re: What is the problem w/ Warner and Blu-Ray??

I don't think the classics are on HD DVD are selling at any less of a rate than they do on standard DVD. It's just that the market is much smaller. In other words if you compare the the sales numbers of Casablanca on DVD and HD DVD, it probably had around the same market percentage relative to the size of the over all market.

I don't think anything else could be expected. Casablanca isn't going to sell the same number of discs as Pirates no matter what format it's on.

Doug

Re: What is the problem w/ Warner and Blu-Ray??

So will they stop releasing again when the second layer of copy protection is broken? I give it a month.

Doug

Re: What is the problem w/ Warner and Blu-Ray??

You're probably right, and I wasn't really disputing that. I just didn't bother to bring it up because the bottom line is that it appears that they feel the format isn't mature enough for classics.

However, if that is the case, what I find odd is that they still released some classics like Bullitt, The Cowboys, The Getaway, and Rio Bravo on both formats this year, which I am thankful for. So they must think they're is some hope or that they'll try to 'grow' that market. If that's the case then release the missing non-IME titles on BD too. Warner, us BD supporters may surprise you.

Re: What is the problem w/ Warner and Blu-Ray??

Probably the most blatent act on Warner's part showing their HD DVD bias was to release the Matrix films on HD DVD on the same day as the Pirate films. Of course that ended up totally backfiring and serving as an embarassing microcosim of HD DVD's chief shortcoming.

Re: What is the problem w/ Warner and Blu-Ray??

Well and I thenk your right they still seem to be releasing classics. I don't see Warner abandoning Classics at all. In the first year of these new formats we have seen Casablanca, Forbidden Planet, Grand Prix, The Searchers, The Cowboys, Rio Bravo, The Adventures of Robin Hood, Bullitt, Superman, Superman 2. This is a pretty hefty list of classics for the first year of a new format. 2 of those titles came out last month. Hardly what I would call abandoning the classics.

Now to be fair Warners support of BD does seem to be a bit half hearted.

Doug

Re: What is the problem w/ Warner and Blu-Ray??

I'm not sure why you think it backfired. The Matrix sets sold quite well. I'm not sure why anyone thought they would outsell the Pirates movies which did better numbers at the box office as well.

Doug

Re: What is the problem w/ Warner and Blu-Ray??

So, let me see. Format neutral studio is suspected by you to have a preference. So anything that seems to fit that suspicion is a "blatant act". Even something that you think didn't profit them, but which can be explained as a misfired attempt to gain profit (in an illegal way?).

But wouldn't that make any release of the format-exclusive studios "blatant acts" on their part, in your book?

And note that we're only talking suspicions here, the other group of studios have already admitted to having a strong preference!


Cees




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I am format neutral - it's many studios, that's who are not.
And a few fanboys and followers.

Re: What is the problem w/ Warner and Blu-Ray??

13,000 copies is not what i'd call quite well.

I don't think they did it on purpose as BrettB mentions. They simply wanted IME to be a part of the release and BDJ isn't ready. The Blue Ray Group has only itself to blame.

Re: What is the problem w/ Warner and Blu-Ray??

Yes, where IME titles are concerned I agree. However when examining Warner Bros. treatment of BD and HD DVD, I break it into two parts. IME and non-IME titles. For the former I give Warner Bros. a pass until the BDA has Profile 1.1 out in the wild, for the latter I do not. The latter amount to timed-exclusives, which I realize are a market reality and now sadly appear to be the province of movies as well as games, but I dislike them intensely nevertheless, especially from a neutral studio.

Edited to add:

Now I realize that sales and the increased cost of manufacturing BD probably come into play with some of these non-IME titles, and I do not dispute that. However, it annoys me nevertheless, and it does create some ill will between BD supporters and Warner Bros.

Re: What is the problem w/ Warner and Blu-Ray??

M O N E Y ! ! !
It's all about $$$.
The Matrix vs. Pirates (hey, that would make a GREAT flick! ;-) ) sold about the same amount, as far as total gross goes.
When did WB find out "PotC" was going to be released?
When did WB have Matrix ready to ship?
How is making the 'same' amount of $$$ as "PotC" a "embarassing (sic) microcosim (sic) of HD DVD's chief shortcoming" (sick :-) )?
What's your bias?

Re: What is the problem w/ Warner and Blu-Ray??

Well considering that the best selling HD DVD of so far sold 100,000 copies, its not all that bad.

Doug

Re: What is the problem w/ Warner and Blu-Ray??

13,000 copies @ an the average price of $70---and that was just the first week....not too bad for Warner. I'll take it.

The only oversight in this release was Blu-ray not being ready for this title...or Batman Begins, V for Vendetta etc...

Can't blame Warner. It's like blaming the officials for starting a game on time when you don't have all your star players there.