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The next Boulder? - Page 2

post #31 of 42
6/10/07 at 4:35pm

Re: The next Boulder?

Quote:
It is possible to get a 4,000 sq. ft. 2-story house for <$250K in the Austin and Dallas areas. This kind of affordability has spoiled me rotten
Tulsa is very similar. I went looking around as I had a few oppurtunities in Colorado but the housing really soured me.

As much as I love the scenery there and Denver in general, the cost of living was a bit much for me.
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post #32 of 42
6/10/07 at 8:43pm

Re: The next Boulder?

What's the weather like in Boise, Dennis?
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post #33 of 42
6/10/07 at 9:39pm

Re: The next Boulder?

I've only been here a little over a year, but before I relocated I spent some time gathering weather statistics on Boise. Boise gets the downwind remnants of the Pacific maritime weather from WA and OR. Most of the precip. falls on the Cascades, leaving less for ID. Boise averages 10 inches of rain and 22 inches of snow per year (last 30 year average). Let's see if this NOAA chart shows up properly:

Number of Days with Snowfall >= Threshold (days)

JAN FEB MAR APR MAY JUN JUL AUG SEP OCT NOV DEC _____ ANNUAL
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
THRESHOLD >=0.1 inch

5.8 3.6 1.9 .5 .1 0 0 0 0 .1 2.6 5.6 _________20.2


THRESHOLD >=1.0 inch

1.7 1.1 .4 .2 0 0 0 0 0 .1 1.2 2.3 __________7.0

Hmm....I guess you can still make out the chart. Basically there's 7 days per year of snow over one inch. Most snowfalls melt by around noon. The humidity stays around 20% year around. This past January was pretty cold - averaging around 20 deg. for days on end, getting down to 10 degrees on occasion - but this was a record cold and dry January. Summer doesn't get much above 90 degrees and then only now and then. Boise is at roughly 3,000 feet in a valley bounded by the Owyhee Mountains to the south west and the Rocky Mountains to the north east, both rising locally up to around 8,500 feet. This creates a sheltered valley that protects the area from some of the more extreme climate of the Rockies.

For more info on temps and precip. see http://www.cityofboise.org/CityGover...page14791.aspx Note how during the summer the night time temps drop back to the 50's.

In general I would say that spring/summer/fall in Boise is very similar to San Jose CA, the differences being lower humidity and more frequent windy days here in Boise. Winter is NOT similar to San Jose, but it would appear to be milder than many places that have a "real" winter.
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post #34 of 42
6/11/07 at 12:57am

Re: The next Boulder?

Thanks, Dennis. Doesn't sound very different from what I grew up with in Denver (perhaps a little drier).
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post #35 of 42
6/13/07 at 1:17pm

Re: The next Boulder?

Before we wrap up this thread on the topic of relocating, here's one more map that compares states in the US with countries of similar GDP.

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post #36 of 42
6/13/07 at 4:10pm

Re: The next Boulder?

Quote:
Originally Posted by RobertR
What's the weather like in Boise, Dennis?
Robert, I have found much of the inland NW to be rather similar to the Front Range of Colorado. Not humid like the West coast, maybe not quite as dry as Denver. Probably more snow, but with the same tendency to melt quickly. The weather in Spokane was quite a bit like Colorado, except about 3 weeks of constant rain in the spring and fall, not year round like Seattle can be. Lots of sunshine also. You would find little difference between Denver and Boise, or Spokane for that matter.
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post #37 of 42
6/13/07 at 4:26pm

Re: The next Boulder?

Wow... I have a hard time believing that Saudi Arabia's GDP is only equal to Tennessee's!
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post #38 of 42
6/13/07 at 5:00pm

Re: The next Boulder?

Here's the original link so you can check their methodology:

http://strangemaps.wordpress.com/200...-similar-gdps/

Note that the formula used for GDP includes the term (exports - imports) which is probably what knocks Saudi Arabia down. They trade lots of oil for lots of neat stuff.
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post #39 of 42
6/20/07 at 2:27pm

Re: The next Boulder?

Demand is a huge factor, and quality of life offered. CO has a lot to offer a great variety of people for sure. There's also the small fact that many folks planning on moving to that area are coming from areas which are already more expensive (housing & overall cost of living) or at least as expensive, and they make very good wages where they currently reside. There's a lot of equity floating around in this country along with the obvious debt . Anyway, IMO there's no way a place like Boulder will ever have it's housing prices return to such 'historical lows' that you speak of. It's way too popular for that. Areas like that are unfortunately way past the cutoff point for a 1970s family with a single breadwinner. As the front range in general becomes more crowded and more baby boomers also settle that area, the high demand will keep up those high prices you're currently seeing there.

There's another thing residents in CO will have to become used to in the near future as more families move there with school age children- higher taxes. The tax rates for the same size home are much lower in places like Highlands Ranch (for example) than their counterparts living in many other suburbs in urban areas elsewhere. Some of the school districts won't be able to handle the influx of people without raising taxes significantly IMO. I've seen some of the budgets and they likely won't be able to keep up for the next 10 years. I would be very surprised, anyway.

-P

Quote:
Originally Posted by Colin Dunn
I left the Boulder/Denver area in 2000 because the property bubble there made it unaffordable for me to enjoy the standard of living I thought appropriate to my occupation and salary level. Since then I've been checking the market periodically to see if the bubble has burst. Hasn't yet.

Remember, I grew up seeing technical professionals buy 2,000 sq. ft. houses in Boulder on one income; condos were occupied by college students and service-industry workers. Paying $300K for a condo (which requires a 6-figure income to qualify) seems ludicrous to me, unless it's a beachfront property in Hawaii...

What would be so different about Boulder now as opposed to in the 1970s to justify tripling the cost of housing in real (inflation-adjusted) terms? If there is no fundamental difference, in the long run the prices should come back down to historical levels.
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post #40 of 42
6/26/09 at 5:17am

Re: The next Boulder?

Colin,

So have you checked the news lately? How are the much-lower prices in Boulder affecting your plans? I understand prices in Bozeman have tanked royally.

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post #41 of 42
7/1/09 at 2:18pm
Thread Starter 
Boulder housing is still very expensive. I looked on realtor.com a few weeks ago, and 1,100 sq. ft. 1960s tract homes still have asking prices well over $300K. Condo prices seem to have come down, though many condos in Boulder are "flat-style" (apartment-like) rather than "townhome-style" properties. I would only buy a condo if it has a basement that can be finished into a home theater. There seems to be no advantage of a flat-style condo over just renting an apartment - lack of privacy / sound insulation makes these types of residences undesirable to a home theater enthusiast who does NOT wish to disturb the neighbors!

Prices are more reasonable in eastern Boulder County (Lafayette, Superior), Broomfield (now its own county), and the Denver suburbs. Home prices are almost "Texas cheap" ($75/sq. ft.)in Green Valley Ranch (a development east of Denver), but foreclosures are so prevalent in that area that few people advocate living there.

Since the coastal housing bubble has burst, a lot of artificial home equity has been wiped out. This will thin the ranks of people moving to Colorado with six-figure down payments. The credit crunch has also reduced the number of buyers, and the amounts they can borrow. Since very few people can afford to buy homes with cash, these developments must necessarily push down the prices of homes in the Denver area. Hopefully, this will keep a lid on prices over the next several years. In fact, I've already read an article that mentioned that homes under $300K are flying off the shelf in Denver, but homes in the $400K-$600K range languish for months. There's a five-year inventory of million-dollar homes in Denver. Some of these expensive homes are going to get dumped at a discount, or foreclosed.

I'm getting ready to go back to Denver in 2010. I sold my place in Austin (where prices stayed relatively firm) and am awaiting a combination of factors I expect to hit in 2010 - a recovery in the job market, and another wave of distressed properties hitting the market in Denver. Perhaps some of those hold-outs in the $400K-$600K range will have to sell for ~$300K. Then, hopefully, I'll actually get something worthwhile for the price (2,000+ above-grade sq. ft. plus big basement, built after 1990).

As for Bozeman - haven't looked recently but it was even more overpriced than Boulder when I started this thread. Homes there started at $230K and went up from there, but Bozeman lacks the jobs base of the Front Range area. Prices obviously had been bid up by investors, rather than people who actually live there. Given what university / government jobs pay, home prices in Bozeman should have been about half as high.
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post #42 of 42
1/27/10 at 5:10pm
Thread Starter 
My plans to return to Denver in 2010 are coming together. I was just offered a new job in Broomfield, starting on February 8.

I hope there will be some reasonably priced homes for sale in the northern suburbs this summer... :)
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