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Best of Route 66 - Page 10

post #271 of 644
2/2/08 at 4:45pm

Re: Best of Route 66

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hollywoodaholic
Got this set (Vol. 2) in the mail from DDD today and have spot-checked several episodes ("Fly Away Home," "Absence of Tears," etc.). Looks pretty good.

I knew someone would be posting tonight about getting the set early. I just knew it. You lucky dog, you.

Very good news about the transfers. This makes me feel a lot better about the overall series being released.

Gary "did you pay for expedited shipping, Wayne?" O.
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Gear mentioned in this thread:

Route 66: Season 3 Volume 1
Route 66: Season 1, Vol. 2
Route 66: Classic Episodes
post #272 of 644
2/3/08 at 9:53am

Re: Best of Route 66

No on expedited shipping, Gary, but it was shipped on 29th and I got it Feb. 2, which is pretty good for DDD. I'm also in Florida, and I don't know what warehouse it ships from.

There are about 20 minutes of classic commercials on Disc 4, alternating between Chevrolet, Bayer and Milk of Magnesia. But having all those Corvair ads on a show featuring a Corvette is an ironic (and historical) hoot. Where's Ralph Nader? The Impala ad featuring the family car zipping along the beaches near Cape Canaveral and the Saturn rockets is also a great nostalgia trip.

Spot checking more episodes; "Welcome to Amity" with Susan Oliver is remarkably pristine clear. But most episodes just look very good. And there's the recently late Lois Nettleton in "The Opponent" on Disc 4. I'm sure there will be quibbles on the sound, though, but there would probably have to be some serious restoration to bring the sound up to today's standards.

All in all, I think everyone will be pleasantly surprised.
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post #273 of 644
2/6/08 at 4:03am
Thread Starter 

Re: Best of Route 66

Well I received my set yesterday and, frankly, I don't know whether to laugh or cry. First, the good news; I watched the first two episodes (a good two-parter titled "Fly Away Home" with the great Michael Rennie) and can confirm Wayne's earlier comments that the episodes look better than what was presented in volume 1 (that's based only on watching the first two episodes and spot checking the other two episodes on disc 1). The visuals aren't in the same category as the "The Untouchables" or "The Fugitive," but they still look pretty good to my eyes and represent an improvement.

Now for the bad news, Roxbury and/or Infinity have matted the top and bottom of the episodes to give it a FAKE WIDESCREEN look. So in certain scenes, the tops of the actors heads are missing. This might not be readily apparent to people who have never seen the show, but after releasing the first 15 episodes in volume 1 in the correct, full-screen aspect ratio, it becomes glaringly apparent.

I really wish there was some way to get to Kirk Hallam at Roxbury or the folks at Infinity to provide some constructive feedback to them. I feel like they have taken three steps forward with the improved visuals but two steps backward with the matting. This is a frustrating release and reminds me of the old tune "Look what they've done to my song, Ma"!!!
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post #274 of 644
2/6/08 at 6:09am

Re: Best of Route 66

Quote:
Now for the bad news, Roxbury and/or Infinity have matted the top and bottom of the episodes to give it a FAKE WIDESCREEN look. So in certain scenes, the tops of the actors heads are missing. This might not be readily apparent to people who have never seen the show, but after releasing the first 15 episodes in volume 1 in the correct, full-screen aspect ratio, it becomes glaringly apparent.

Well that is most unfortunate, Bob and I'm just stymied by such an egregious alteration as this. So the image gives the appearance of looking like a 16:9 AR but is still really 4:3 with a portion of the top and bottom masked? Just great.

I admire Mr. Hallam and Roxbury/Infinity for getting the show released and for fast tracking it as well, but boy between this and the poor image quality in set 1, they really are quite the neophyte in this tv on dvd thing. They really have no idea when it comes to meeting 'classic tv' consumer expectations.
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post #275 of 644
2/6/08 at 6:14am
Thread Starter 

Re: Best of Route 66

Quote:
Originally Posted by michael_ks
So the image gives the appearance of looking like a 16:9 AR but is still really 4:3 with a portion of the top and bottom masked?

Unfortunately, yes.
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post #276 of 644
2/6/08 at 6:24am

Re: Best of Route 66

Quote:
Originally Posted by michael_ks
I admire Mr. Hallam and Roxbury/Infinity for getting the show released and for fast tracking it as well, but boy between this and the poor image quality in set 1, they really are quite the neophyte in this tv on dvd thing. They really have no idea when it comes to meeting 'classic tv' consumer expectations.
I agree and it amazes me why they would go to such lengths to bring out a title that obviously depends on "niche" market sales and then turn around and ignore the preferences of that market so completely.
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post #277 of 644
2/6/08 at 6:24am

Re: Best of Route 66

I received mine yesterday (2/5) and spot checked them as well, a marked improvement over S1, Vol 1. I'm going to guess that we'll eventually see a Box set release at some point after the initial releases.
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post #278 of 644
2/6/08 at 6:53am

Re: Best of Route 66

That's horrible news, Bob. My copy is in the mail but I'm not looking forward to it as much now. I just can't believe they would do that. Talk about messing a release up - ugh.

Gary "what are those guys thinking?" O.
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post #279 of 644
2/6/08 at 6:54am

Re: Best of Route 66

They gave the episodes a widescreen look? Are they kidding? Why?
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post #280 of 644
2/6/08 at 6:58am

Re: Best of Route 66

Quote:
Originally Posted by michael_ks
Well that is most unfortunate, Bob and I'm just stymied by such an egregious alteration as this. So the image gives the appearance of looking like a 16:9 AR but is still really 4:3 with a portion of the top and bottom masked? Just great.

This seems really odd to me. I hesitate to suggest it, Bob, but are you sure your tv or dvd player isn't zooming the image to fit the screen? I can do that with 4:3 images on my tv. Maybe there's some authoring on the discs that's making your hardware zoom in.

Roxbury's press release is very specific: "Enjoy this treasured television classic (episodes 16-30) in a special four-disc, collector's set. Presented in full frame, with an aspect ratio of 4:3, special features include cast biographies." I guess it's possible they could still screw it up, since the prints looked so murky the first time...

I'll check my discs as soon as I receive them. Has anyone else noticed this?
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post #281 of 644
2/6/08 at 7:06am
Thread Starter 

Re: Best of Route 66

Quote:
Originally Posted by Guy Foulard
This seems really odd to me. I hesitate to suggest it, Bob, but are you sure your tv or dvd player isn't zooming the image to fit the screen? I can do that with 4:3 images on my tv. Maybe there's some authoring on the discs that's making your hardware zoom in.

Jason, there were no changes from my TV and DVD set-up from watching the volume 1 discs and volume 2. I suppose that it could be some authoring changes on volume 2 that are different from volume 1, but I don't think so . . . . . it really looks like an artificial matte to me. I don't have state of the art equipment nor am I a technical person, so who knows. All I can say is that when I watch volume 1 episodes, they're projected correctly in the full screen format and the volume 2 episodes are projected widescreen. I'll watch another episode this evening on a different TV and DVD set-up that I have in my bedroom to see if there's any difference and report back tomorrow. I'm sure others will weigh in on this issue as they begin to receive their copies.
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post #282 of 644
2/6/08 at 7:15am

Re: Best of Route 66

Quote:
Originally Posted by Guy Foulard
This seems really odd to me. Has anyone else noticed this?

I didn't notice it when spot-checking my set, but then why would I even be looking for such a thing? Still, if it's masked and the image basically expanded to anamorphically fit the screen, wouldn't that also affect the sharpness? And these are much better than the first set. I'll look again.
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post #283 of 644
2/6/08 at 8:21am

Re: Best of Route 66

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hollywoodaholic
Still, if it's masked and the image basically expanded to anamorphically fit the screen, wouldn't that also affect the sharpness?

If the image is nice and sharp, like the CBS/Paramount releases, you don't have as much loss of image quality when they're zoomed in--they can still look much better than the first Route 66 release looked, since that one was pretty rough. But the image composition is still messed up, so that everyone's chopped off at the eyebrows.

Once I get my copy, I'll test it out--hopefully the correct image is in there, but just programmed strangely, so that it's telling the tv to zoom in. That way it would be correctable.
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post #284 of 644
2/6/08 at 5:54pm

Re: Best of Route 66

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Hug
Jason, there were no changes from my TV and DVD set-up from watching the volume 1 discs and volume 2. I suppose that it could be some authoring changes on volume 2 that are different from volume 1, but I don't think so . . . . . it really looks like an artificial matte to me.

Hi Bob, I got my discs today and unfortunately, you were right! My apologies for doubting you. Roxbury Entertainment got nice prints this time, but managed to screw them up by making them widescreen-friendly...even though I don't recall anyone asking for that! I'm afraid the people in charge of these releases are hopeless, and I fully expect the next season to be colorized...
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post #285 of 644
2/6/08 at 11:14pm

Re: Best of Route 66

I cannot believe these people. They must be total imbeciles. So, they corrected the print problem and got nice quality 35mm prints and then they screw it up by putting it in fake widescreen. I can't even watch it with black bars on the top and bottom of the screen cutting off the top and bottom of the picture. And how did the first couple of posters in this forum not notice this? Did they think the picture was supposed to be chopped off? Anyway, here is the number for Stephanie, who is Kirk Halam's assistant at Roxbury. I would suggest as many people as possible call and give them a piece of your mind. The number is 310-393-4006. Unbelievable.
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post #286 of 644
2/7/08 at 5:43am
Thread Starter 

Re: Best of Route 66

Quote:
Originally Posted by Guy Foulard
Hi Bob, I got my discs today and unfortunately, you were right! My apologies for doubting you.

No problem, Jason . . . . . there was always the possbility that, indeed, I was wrong, but I did watch the third episode last evening (featuring a returning Patty McCormack -- who guested in the premiere episode -- in a different role) on my second TV/DVD hookup and the matted format is present. This is laughable, but the bonus commercials on disc 4 are also matted! I really, really wish that Image Entertainment had handled the "Route 66" releases.

There's also a way to contact Infinity Entertainment via E-mail at this link:

Infinity Entertainment Group
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post #287 of 644
2/7/08 at 6:20am

Re: Best of Route 66

Like many of the other posters in this thread, I have to say I'm really dismayed at this news. I've already ordered the set and it's on the way (may be in my mailbox today), and I probably would have ordered it even with this news, but I'm not going to lie and say this doesn't bother me greatly. It does. I wish we had some idea of what was going on in the minds of the people that made this decision. As far as TV shows go, this is pretty much unprecedented.

Gary "I hate the thought that some of the beautiful scenery from this show will be cut off because of the matting - that's criminal in my book" O.
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post #288 of 644
2/7/08 at 6:28am

Re: Best of Route 66

Quote:
Anyway, here is the number for Stephanie, who is Kirk Halam's assistant at Roxbury. I would suggest as many people as possible call and give them a piece of your mind. The number is 310-393-4006.

I plan to make that call, though I'd prefer to email them--anyone have an address? I'm going to have to put "Route 66" on hold myself until Infinity straightens out their act. Maybe they'll get it together with a Blu-Ray release as planned and better yet, maybe they could make a deal with Image Entertainment, as suggested.

I had a difficult enough time with vol.1, all the while thinking how much better this looked 20 years ago on Nick at Nite and now this with the masking. Just a modicum of research like say, checking reviews on Amazon over Warners blunder with "Kung Fu" S1 would have told them that monkeying with the aspect ratio is about the biggest snafu you can possibly muster. I can't believe what an incredible oversight this is.
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post #289 of 644
2/7/08 at 6:42am
Thread Starter 

Re: Best of Route 66

Quote:
Originally Posted by Guy Foulard
Roxbury's press release is very specific: "Enjoy this treasured television classic (episodes 16-30) in a special four-disc, collector's set. Presented in full frame, with an aspect ratio of 4:3, special features include cast biographies."

I almost hesitate to bring this up, but is this a case of false advertising? It sure isn't "presented in full frame."
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post #290 of 644
2/7/08 at 7:56am

Re: Best of Route 66

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Hug
No problem, Jason . . . . . there was always the possbility that, indeed, I was wrong, but I did watch the third episode last evening (featuring a returning Patty McCormack -- who guested in the premiere episode -- in a different role) on my second TV/DVD hookup and the matted format is present. This is laughable, but the bonus commercials on disc 4 are also matted! I really, really wish that Image Entertainment had handled the "Route 66" releases. The Infinity Entertainment Group also has a couple of releases of "Bozo, the Clown" and I'm beginning to believe that Bozo is running Infinity.

There's also a way to contact Infinity Entertainment via E-mail at this link:

Infinity Entertainment Group


Why are you assuming that Infinity is the one that made this decision? They haven't done anything like this with any other release. I think Roxbury is behind this asinine move. Whoever these people are, and until 6 months ago no one ever heard of them, they have demonstrated again that they know absolutely nothing about this business. They seem to be these movie people who got the idea to do a theatrical version of the show and figured that releasing the series to DVD was a good way to piggyback their movie idea. But not having the slightest idea about television or the history of the series at all, I'm sure they knew nothing about the beautiful 1-inch transfers that were done in the mid 80s that ran on Nick at Nite. And I'm sure they also don't realize that their audience for this show isn't 20-somethings who all own widescreen TVs and have to have everything in that form, regardless of how it was produced. As for the comment about the botched 1st season of Kung Fu, I'm sure they know nothing about that. You'd be lucky if the Roxbury folks ever even heard of the series Kung Fu. These are not people who picked up the series and are releasing it because of their love for it and because it's an all-time television classic. They are just trying to make a buck and really don't know what they are doing. And, besides, those of us who complain, are a "small minority" in their words.
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post #291 of 644
2/7/08 at 8:08am

Re: Best of Route 66

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hank Dearborn
Why are you assuming that Infinity is the one that made this decision? They haven't done anything like this with any other release. I think Roxbury is behind this asinine move. Whoever these people are, and until 6 months ago no one ever heard of them, they have demonstrated again that they know absolutely nothing about this business. They seem to be these movie people who got the idea to do a theatrical version of the show and figured that releasing the series to DVD was a good way to piggyback their movie idea. But not having the slightest idea about television or the history of the series at all, I'm sure they knew nothing about the beautiful 1-inch transfers that were done in the mid 80s that ran on Nick at Nite. And I'm sure they also don't realize that their audience for this show isn't 20-somethings who all own widescreen TVs and have to have everything in that form, regardless of how it was produced. As for the comment about the botched 1st season of Kung Fu, I'm sure they know nothing about that. You'd be lucky if the Roxbury folks ever even heard of the series Kung Fu. These are not people who picked up the series and are releasing it because of their love for it and because it's an all-time television classic. They are just trying to make a buck and really don't know what they are doing. And, besides, those of us who complain, are a "small minority" in their words.


Without knowing anything about Roxbury, I tend to agree with Hank on this one. I do know that Infinity hasn't done this with any of the CC classics they've been packaging together recently (JIM BOWIE, REAL McCOYS, etc). I've got to believe this decision rests squarely on the shoulders of Roxbury and not Infinity.

Gary "and it really is a crazy decision" O.
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post #292 of 644
2/7/08 at 8:15am

Re: Best of Route 66

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hank Dearborn
... And how did the first couple of posters in this forum not notice this? ...

Sorry I didn't catch it on my initial posting, but I was just spot-checking episodes and focusing on what everyone was complaining about regarding the first volume - the image quality. Definitely a case of missing the ... cut off trees for the forest.

I'll phone, write, do what I can to join the chorus to help keep this cropping from happening on future volumes. Ironically, I'm one of those outraged by the release of Full Screen versions of Widescreen pictures with any part of the frame cut off. And here we are seeing the Full Screen compromised to accommodate Widescreen. Sheesh.
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post #293 of 644
2/7/08 at 8:15am
Thread Starter 

Re: Best of Route 66

I don't think it would hurt to contact Infinity; if nothing else, perhaps they'll pass along comments to Roxbury. I've amended my previous post to remove the little jab at Infinity.
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post #294 of 644
2/7/08 at 8:50am

Re: Best of Route 66

I just now penned a long and cordial message to IEG and cited Roxbury. I was informed a reply would be sent, which I'll be happy to share. Thanks for the link, Bob.

Infinity may not be directly responsible but surely they need to effect some product quality assurance measures here? I mean, they don't want to look bad...
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post #295 of 644
2/7/08 at 8:57am

Re: Best of Route 66

Every time I look at the Route 66 sets, I think of the Image Naked City sets, with their pristine episodes, uncut and in the right ratio and wonder why the same couldn't be true for Route 66. It's really unfortunate that a better company didn't get ahold of the series.
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post #296 of 644
2/7/08 at 9:19am

Re: Best of Route 66

I was thinking precisely the same thing as I was penning my last post. I'd even be willing to take the "Route 66" episodes in groups of 4 as Image did initially just to see it get done correctly.
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post #297 of 644
2/7/08 at 11:49am

Re: Best of Route 66

How much you want to bet they were thinking, when this comes to Blu-ray it needs to be widescreen! No it doesnt, and NO classic TV show better be widescreen! OAR all the way baby!
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post #298 of 644
2/7/08 at 12:00pm
Thread Starter 

Re: Best of Route 66

I guess it goes without saying that next Tuesday's 6-episode single disc release will likely also have the matte effect applied to the episodes. Interestingly, there is one episode on this new release, "The Strengthening Angels" (with the late, great Suzanne Pleshette) that was part of the season 1, volume 1 set. So I guess that episode will look better, but will be in fake widescreen.

Route 66 - Classic Episodes Vol.1 DVD Information | TVShowsOnDVD.com
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post #299 of 644
2/7/08 at 9:12pm

Re: Best of Route 66

I'm returning it to Amazon as "Poor Quality" and misrepresented.
I'd planned on buying the whole series - I guess I'm not their target market.

From their Feb 1 press release..
Quote:
Enjoy this treasured television classic (episodes 16-30) in a special four-disc, collector's set. Presented in full frame, with an aspect ratio of 4:3
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post #300 of 644
2/7/08 at 11:00pm

Re: Best of Route 66

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rod J
I'm returning it to Amazon as "Poor Quality" and misrepresented.
I'd planned on buying the whole series - I guess I'm not their target market.

From their Feb 1 press release..


I'm doing the same thing. Back it goes. This is obviously a fly by night company that hasn't a clue as to what they are doing as evidenced by them screwing up both sets from season 1. I recommend that everyone here either return the set or cancel your order. I'm going to pull out the Nick at Nite tapes and make my Route 66s that way. I've had enough of these morons at Roxbury and anyone with any sense should feel the same way. If you support releases like this you should have your head examined.
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Gear mentioned in this thread:

Route 66: Season 3 Volume 1
Route 66: Season 1, Vol. 2
Route 66: Classic Episodes